Fencer Archive
Thread: Fencer's attacks ( Future of Fencer )
Rizzaka wrote:
I would like to see a TRUE lunge attack where we over extend ourselves and pierce their armor with a weapon that should not be able to. This attack should have a significant delay or drasticly drop our dodging/defese abilitys for a brief time at the same time giving us the ability to increase the armor piercing quality of by one level (0ap to 1ap, or 1ap to 2ap)
I agree with a parry 'mode' much like berserk and that it should give us chances to blind and stun as well while we are in this state
Another possible attack could be a disarming strike, much like the disarm shot of pistoleer (i think they have it, or is it smuggler) something of that nature would fall right in line with what we 'should' be
I like the idea of disarming as well. However the idea of lunge being an attack that over extends does not ring true with me. In the sport a lunge is a controled, albeit large, forward step and extension of the arm. After the lunge the fencer can recover by springing back to the en garde position, or he can move his back foot forward and return to the en garde position. In no way is the fencer ever out of balance or over extended during this action, assuming he executed it properly.
The fleche as I described above definitely fallsinto the category that you are placing the lunge. You literally dive forward with the tip of your weapon to pierce the chest. A properly executed fleche has the fencer pushing off with his forward foot and leaves his shoulders an torso forward of his feet (think of a diving catch in baseball). It could definitely add armor piercing to a normally non armor piercing wepaon, but at the expense of no recovery.
*shrug* I have no clue about real life fencing just that the one guy i knew/know that does it looks like bill gates and is a **edit** lol
I just said over extend because every attack needs to come at a price in this game and i feel that would be a decent balance for the power of that attack, not that we'd get nocked down or loose balance but that we'd be much easier to hit for the duration of the attack.
Shilak wrote:
What should be the "basic flavor" of Fencer special attacks?
Rather than the current set of specials I would prefer to see the following: -
-onehandhit1, onehandhit2 and onehandhit3 as the damaging random pool attacks. Damage will be very high (x5 at best).
- onehandspin1 and onehandspin2 as our only area attacks, thesewill allow us to deal more damage only when surrounded by 3 or moreenemies. Damage will be medium.
- onehandblind1 and onehandblind2, make these both single target attacks that cause blind and hit the mind pool. Damage will be medium (x3 at best).
- onehandstun1 and onehandstun2, make these both single target attacks that cause stun and hit the health pool. Damage will be medium (x3 at best).
- onehandsnare1 and onehandsnare2, make these both single target attacks that cause snare (25% and 50% movement speedreductions)and hit the action pool. Damage will be medium (x3 at best).
- onehanddizzy1 and onehanddizzy2, make these both single target attacks that cause dizzy and hit a random pool. Damage will be high (x4 at best).
- onehanddelay1 and onehanddelay2, make these both single target attacks that cause 5s and 10s attack delays (similar to current warcry).Target will be immune to getting this effect again for 30s aftereachdelay effect that sticks on them. Damage will be low (x2 at best).
Also, give all our attacks a small chance of causing a bleed on the pool struck (1% at novice scaling up to 5% at master) to reflect the precise nature of our attacks.
Shilak wrote:
What should be the "basic flavor" of Fencer special attacks?
Rather than the current set of specials I would prefer to see the following: -
-onehandhit1, onehandhit2 and onehandhit3 as the damaging random pool attacks. Damage will be very high (x5 at best).
- onehandspin1 and onehandspin2 as our only area attacks, thesewill allow us to deal more damage only when surrounded by 3 or moreenemies. Damage will be medium.
- onehandblind1 and onehandblind2, make these both single target attacks that cause blind and hit the mind pool. Damage will be medium (x3 at best).
- onehandstun1 and onehandstun2, make these both single target attacks that cause stun and hit the health pool. Damage will be medium (x3 at best).
- onehandsnare1 and onehandsnare2, make these both single target attacks that cause snare (25% and 50% movement speedreductions)and hit the action pool. Damage will be medium (x3 at best).
- onehanddizzy1 and onehanddizzy2, make these both single target attacks that cause dizzy and hit a random pool. Damage will be high (x4 at best).
- onehanddelay1 and onehanddelay2, make these both single target attacks that cause 5s and 10s attack delays (similar to current warcry).Target will be immune to getting this effect again for 30s aftereachdelay effect that sticks on them. Damage will be low (x2 at best).
Also, give all our attacks a small chance of causing a bleed on the pool struck (1% at novice scaling up to 5% at master) to reflect the precise nature of our attacks.
I agree with these skills and what it would make a fencer.
All skills should be single target skills IMO- not overly damageing but when used in conjuction with other specials very effective 1v1
There would have to be some mod that would make the movement reduction less, such as terraine negotiantion or combat equilibirum otherwise it would be a overpowered move.
Lowest damage in game
Near Highest Accuracy
Near highest defense
Blind
Dizzy
Low toughness
Delay of action attack - (Disarm )
Delay of movement attack - ( Hamstring )
I think as a speed-based profession we shoul dactually be speed-based. ATM the insane speed mods given to professions that are meant to be slow and powerful makes for a laughable excuse for combat balance. Up until master fencer/swordsman balance each otehr pretty well but once a swordsman hits master and starts doing high-damage specials every second fencer's supposed speed advantage flies out the window and under the wheels of a semi-auto. Also, balance outthe stats of the brawler weapons (since our end-game weapon sucks like the wind). A 2-handed curved sword should hit harder (which it does) be much slower (which it isn't) and have high armor piercing (which it has). The downside to all of this is that they hit harder, and pierce armor at a speed equal to fencers, who have to use one of the worst weapons in the game to get past light armor.
I am also baffled as to why we haven't recieved a new weapon yet. Pistoleer, swordsman, pikeman, rifleman, and carbineer professions have all recieved either loot-based or quest-based weapons and the fencer professionhas not. even with the Geonosian biolab we are getting stiffed. Now there are scythes for swordsman, disrupters for a rifleman andstun blasters (or whatever they are) for pistoleers. PIkemen already have incredibly powerful pikes built from a looted nightsister schematic and DoT lances looted from corpses. Carbineers get the Nym Slug Thrower, while fencer gets nothing at all. We need a special and rare weapon as well because as of now we are being deprived of content that every other profession except TKM (because they do not need it seeing as they are incredibly overpowered already) hsa been allowed to participate in. This, on top of the fact that our "best" weapon is the only end-game weapon for any profession without armor piercing, makes us a joke in PvP. Right now only stacked fencer/pistoleers can do anything against PvP powerhouses such as TKMs or Riflemen, and ht is ability is oging to be taken away in publish 7 leaving fencer out in teh cold with a 2 inch dagger as their most effective weapon. Really, why is oru only piercing weapon a tiny knife recieved half-way up the brawler tree?
Fencers should be an asset to groups in the role of a molester. THey should be imble and aigle and distract and harrass the front ranks of the enemy while heavy swordsmen and pikemen coem in from the back to finish the job. IMO master pikemen and master heavy swordsmen are not fulfillinf their roles right now as they don't need a fencer to distract an enemy they can obliterate straight out with 4000 damage specials every other second. Heavy swordsman speed needs to be dramatically reduced and fencer needs at the very least 1 medium armor piercing weapon, such as a rapier or looted geonosian weapon. Pistoleers and fencers seem to be getting the short end of the stick from the devs and I don't understand why. We are the wookiees of melee combat not because we can't wear armor but because we can't get past it. 1-hand body hit 3 hits for at most 1000 damage with a vibro-blade and decreases all three stat bars (why is still a mystery). It is also totally asinine that a 1100 heavy swordsman can kill a 0232 fencer in 2 head hits. BeforeI could even attempt a KD-dizzy half my mind was gone and 2 seconds later as I hit dizzy I was on the ground.
Shilak wrote:What should be the "basic flavor" of Fencer special attacks? Rather than the current set of specials I would prefer to see the following: -- onehandhit1, onehandhit2 and onehandhit3 as the damaging random pool attacks. Damage will be very high (x5 at best).- onehandspin1 and onehandspin2 as our only area attacks, these will allow us to deal more damage only when surrounded by 3 or more enemies. Damage will be medium.- onehandblind1 and onehandblind2, make these both single target attacks that cause blind and hit the mind pool. Damage will be medium (x3 at best).- onehandstun1 and onehandstun2, make these both single target attacks that cause stun and hit the health pool. Damage will be medium (x3 at best).- onehandsnare1 and onehandsnare2, make these both single target attacks that cause snare (25% and 50% movement speed reductions) and hit the action pool. Damage will be medium (x3 at best).- onehanddizzy1 and onehanddizzy2, make these both single target attacks that cause dizzy and hit a random pool. Damage will be high (x4 at best).- onehanddelay1 and onehanddelay2, make these both single target attacks that cause 5s and 10s attack delays (similar to current warcry).Target will be immune to getting this effect again for 30s after each delay effect that sticks on them. Damage will be low (x2 at best).Also, give all our attacks a small chance of causing a bleed on the pool struck (1% at novice scaling up to 5% at master) to reflect the precise nature of our attacks.
I would like to second these suggestions:
"- onehandhit1, onehandhit2 and onehandhit3 as the damaging random pool attacks. Damage will be very high (x5 at best).
- onehandspin1 and onehandspin2 as our only area attacks, these will allow us to deal more damage only when surrounded by 3 or more enemies. Damage will be medium.
- onehandblind1 and onehandblind2, make these both single target attacks that cause blind and hit the mind pool. Damage will be medium (x3 at best).
- onehandstun1 and onehandstun2, make these both single target attacks that cause stun and hit the health pool. Damage will be medium (x3 at best).
- onehanddizzy1 and onehanddizzy2, make these both single target attacks that cause dizzy and hit a random pool. Damage will be high (x4 at best)."
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My thoughts:
It is very important for fencers to recieve a KD and a mind-specific targeted HAM attack, if this class is to ever be competitive in PvP. I like the generally espoused idea of the 1h weapon fighter being quick and versatile rather than overwhelmingly powerful (2h) or uniquely gifted (tka meditate). This versatility should include a variety of attacks and a variety of weapons. We have been skipped over for new weapons, yes, and that should (and I expect will) be fixed. Rather than dealing crushing blows, the fencer specialty (and role in group combat) should be versatility and special moves - attacking whichever HAM bar is neccessary, applying states such as dizzy, blind, KD and bleeds, and drawing the attention of attackers while others deal the heavy damage. This is the role that our spin moves and high defense currently suggest to me, and I think judicious changes could fully enable this.
Other notes: The animations are fine with me, also. Our weapons are significantly more limited in damage types than other classes.
KD
Perhaps onehandhit3 allows the master fencer a chance at a knockdown? Such a powerful (master-level) attack is plausibly overpowering.
Mind Attack
I strongly agree with the suggestion that the blind attacks hit the mind pool. It makes perfect sense. BH eyeshot hits the mind, why doesn't our blind attack? It obviously must be directed at the head.
I am a master fencer/pistoleer, and cannot do more than random HAM damage to the mind pool. If combat classes are supposed to be balanced, the mind attacks must be evenly spread, since the mind pool is NOT equivalent to health and/or action.
So what does everybody else think?