Fencer Archive
Thread: Pistoleer/Fencer dodge getting nerfed?
I disagree with your observation that ranged/melee defense isn't stacking. I did an extensive test yesterday in which I defended against a giant mawgax using a pistol, 1h sword, unarmed and 2h sword. In the latter case, I have no skills at all. Using all four weapons, I was missed approximately 68% +/-2% for each weapon, with my melee defense of +116.
I would rather see a cap than not allowing dodge to stack. Being Master Fencer / Master pistoleer should give me bonuses to def as these are the two best defensive classes in the game. If combined should I not have a better chance to dodge thanaperson who has onlymastered thepistoleer profession!
I started the pistol / fencer combo long before they announced a dodge boost for the two classes. However since then I have enjoyed the good life of being able to avoid/block/dodge most attacks. What israrely mentionedis the fact that dodge also delays my attack. I have dodged up to 6 times in a row but did no damage in return, just effectivlyprolonged the battle. Do I see the advantage of dodge,you bet. Is it an evil that must be purged from the system, I say capthe skill at 150and leave it be.
Test was done at about 7pm 25/12
Samepiket beatingon me all the time, I was not moving at all. (went afk for about 5 minutes because I wasn't having to heal with my rifle out.)
Master Rifleman, Novice TKA.Melee defence: 42 with 40 being from the rifleman profession.
With E11 Rifle equiped, Hits: 46, Misses: 140.
With no weapon equiped, Hits 144, Misses: 64.
Make of it what you will.
Seflyn wrote:
Sorry for the slight hijack but I felt this was kind of relative. I havn't seen anything aside from rumors posted so far, so I apologize in advanced if this is already known.
It seems as of a few days ago, ranged and melee defences don't stack. I've done a crude and simple test, but using my fists (novice TKA) it seemed as if I was getting hit a LOT more than when holding my rifle (master), this has been confirmed by someone witha great deal of both defences. I might tidy up the log file and post the numbers tomorrow, but it was very noticeable even in combat chat.
I'm hoping my numbers are off or I just plain made a mistake, but I have a feeling I'm right on this.
they made it so if you are holding a ranged weapon, and a melee person comes up to you, they have an accuracy bonus vs you now
they did not nerf the auctaul melee and ranged defenses persay, they just increased the accuracy bonus of the other guy.
this might seem like a direct nerf to ranged professions stacked melee/ranged defenses, because those defenses work to counter accuracy, but it isn't.
although end result is that the ranged persons will feel as if they are being missed less then before, so i guess you could look at it this way.
MisterLeebo wrote:
That's dumb. If you spend the skill points into turning your character into a dodge master, then you should get to be a dodge master, I don't see how not getting shot will really be that much of an expoit since you're sacrificing the ability to do as much damage or branch into other trees. This is like making BH and Pistoleer speed + accuracy mods not stack, why is ducking under an axe or laser as a fencer any different than ducking under it as a pistoleer? I was intending on trying out the Pistoleer/Fencer combo to see how often you would dodge with maxed out dodge (and perhaps a few skill attachments)
the way i look at it is. you are spending those points to become a defensive master, and be able to avoid almost all kinds of attacks. You give up being able to make master armor and weapons, you give you being able to make yourself PA halls and structures for your town, and you give up being able to have high level ch pets, and pets that tank for you, and you give up a million other things in the game
just to have the ability to defend yourself.
thats not an exploit, if anything they should make dodge better.
im a wookiee i can't wear armor, id rather have 90% kinetic composite, but i can't wear it, so i have dodge.
Uh then don't my numbers make even less sense? Surely with my rifle out I should be getting hit alotmore than with my fists out?
It's not about "If I spent all my skill points to be such and such"
It's not about what another class can do
Pistoleer/Fencer will not be the only combo they look at
This is about balance...point period...point blank.
Fair enough, but right now it appears that the master TKA knockdown works almost always anyway regardless of your dodge value. Also, the master rifleman advanced strafe hits almost always too - both operate at super high speeds. A passive trait like dodge is less of an imbalance than these two. I'm hoping that all things are pretty much balanced as a part of the combat and weapons changes that are coming.My experience is that fencersare designed to be more defensive than manyprofessionsand to tank their way to victory. Against the surreal offensive output of TKA, commandos and rifleman, strong and effectivedefenses are a must for fencers. I'm just saying that although this may be an issue, there are worse imbalances out there and unfortunately people have already come to accept some of those imbalancesas inherent skillsin those professions... which they are not.
phantomRyce wrote:
because not getting hit all the time you can still:
Shoot for 400 - 500 dmg with a pistol.
HIt for 400 -500 dmg with a sword250 - 350 dmg with a stun baton which wont get reduced on composite people..
Resist KD's and Dizz'ys like nothing. Still have points to get novic medic, and some so you can heal those bleeds, the only things that will touch you, and the rare cahnce you do lose 500 life you can heal it all back in an instant.
The point is, while we have all the ability to not get hit, few proffesions have the option to waste points stacking enough accurasy to balance this out. Right now with 80% composite and almost never getting hit, and 100kd,90dizzy defence. 70 something ranged defence, and over 100 melee defence with NOT **edit**TY damage. Whats to stop you?(Well i know what could stop you...)
Anyway thats the reason it wil probably get nerfd. There is no counter to it, you can stack defence, but not offence(accuracy) well rarley, and for much more points.BH + Carbine, or pistol is only stacking accuracys.
I am a Teras Kasi Master, having +64 Melee Defense. I just became a Novice Rifleman, by killing dalyrakes on Talus, getting hit about 20% of the time. Don't think that was possible with having +0 md from rifleman unless... the defenses were stacking as they should.
I'll make a test tomorrow.
Unarmed
Attacks: 31
Hits: 16
Misses: 15
Rifle
Attacks: 13
Hits: 3
Misses: 10
I fully agree that this data is inaccurate and not precise, but still, this proves that the melee defense IS STILL STACKING.
As I've said earlier, I am a Teras Kasi Master and a Novice Rifleman, so there is NO way that these results could be inflicted by melee defense obtained in the Rifleman tree.
I will post more precise results tomorrow.