Entertainer Archive

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RagNoRock5x wrote:

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jcarlson34 wrote:

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JFreeman wrote:
Yes, it's too slow.

We're increasing the xp rate gain overall, and removing battle fatigue from the game entirely. We have some other enhancements to the entertainer professions that we want to do as well (profession-specific inspiration buffs for non-combat professions), but this is what is currently in development.

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So with no BF anymore this means one less skill the Jedi Healer trees has in an already weak Jedi professional disipline. The Healer tree will really need to be revamped after this to add more value to it...

I will be looking forward to seeing more information on this subject and I will reserve my opinion until I see more details. I do have some concerns however that the game continues to be overly simplified as acost to balancing the game but do enjoy having the devs bounce ideas off us more(the more interaction the better). Balance is needed but not appriciated by the player base if it involves continuely nerfing everything to achieve that balance.

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Im sorry but WTH are you talking about?

I have seen no jedi w/o a line in healing simply because they need it to stay alive in any sort of combat.

Any jedi that wants to stay alive in PvP needs the 1500 heal.

Do not increase there healing abilitys any more for the sake of all SWG

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Panthu wrote:

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Mistwaver wrote:

Ugh! I know what you mean ... I just got a sharp pain in the top of my head when I read that.

/sigh

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No, Reeli! This is a good thing! There has never been anything fun about BF for either side, the one getting it or the one healing it. The fun thing is the interaction, but that can be done so much better by allowing Ents to be tradeskill buffers.

No other game has ever had a support system in place for crafters... this is huge for both Crafters and Entertainers. This really could only happen in SWG, the first game that has ever truly created a player crafted economy with real shops and store fronts.

This allows a full game to be played out in the cities, the "down time" areas.

I know you have a Jedi Healer as well as an Entso you are probably worried about losing the interaction from healing BF as a Jedi, but BF was just a contrived weirdness made purelyto create interaction for Social players that didn't want to have anything to do with direct combat.

The Jedi Healers just inherited the weirdness that was only ever there for Entertainer Players as a reward. The very fact that Jedi could heal BF made the whole point of the thing moot. Hopefully now Jedi Healers will be given something else that is uniquely their own and will suit their Healer gameplay much better.

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QFE

I must say, there are GREAT ideas in this thread.

But..honest...when did the devs listen to the players ?

The Jedi Healers just inherited the weirdness that was only ever there for Entertainer Players as a reward. The very fact that Jedi could heal BF made the whole point of the thing moot. Hopefully now Jedi Healers will be given something else that is uniquely their own and will suit their Healer gameplay much better.

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JFreeman wrote:

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Cutedge wrote:

Since you're removing BF or planning to do so, can we at least get confirmation that won't be doing the same to wounds?

I'm not even an entertainer. I came here trolling the dev tracker, but please don't remove BF. Make it heal faster, but don't remove the need for it.

SWG is unique because it forces interaction between players. You are required to find a doctor. You have to find an entertainer and watch/listen. You used to have to wait with others for shuttles. It promotes healthy interaction with fellow members of the community. Please don't change this.

Message Edited by Cutedge on 06-17-2005 01:19 PM

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We want entertainers to be more like 'entertainers', and less like 'healers'.

In general, we don't want to force interaction. You should go to watch an entertainer because you want to, not because you have to. It'll be better for this to be a positive interaction ("I go see an entertainer to get something good") rather than a negative interaction ("I go see an entertainer in order to get rid of something bad").

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There's a quote about the original design of Galaxies that says it was too much like living the life of Uncle Owen and not enough like the life of Luke or Han Solo.

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Starcloud wrote:

If it can be worn, the new schematics should go to Tailors. That's what the Tailors are there for; to make wearable things.

Other stage props can be the domain of Entertainers, but wearables of any kind must go to the Tailors.

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I must disagree... Prop Armor and Weapons should be the domain of Entertainers. Stage Craft is a vital part of any drama course IRL. Making costumes is NOT the same as making clothes. I have been involved with theatre for many years and can tell you I have met many folks who can make an astounding outfit that is held together with duct tape and safety pins. We tailors should get new schematics (Nightsister clothing, the new RotW clothing, headwear, etc.) but having the Entertainers be able to make 'fashion armor' gives them something too.

Back on topic, BF should remain, as a matter of fact the rate should INCREASE, it is ridiculously low now.

Itolia Rapo
Master Tailor, Roleplayer, and HELPER 
(I'm just a glutton for punishment)


Galaxy City, Dantooine


							

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JFreeman wrote:

We want entertainers to be more like 'entertainers', and less like 'healers'.

In general, we don't want to force interaction. You should go to watch an entertainer because you want to, not because you have to. It'll be better for this to be a positive interaction ("I go see an entertainer to get something good") rather than a negative interaction ("I go see an entertainer in order to get rid of something bad").

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JFreeman wrote:
Yes, it's too slow.

We want to change the 'healing' line to a 'props' line that allows you to craft and utilize 'stage props' (weapons, armor and so on that just look like weapons and armor). We're increasing the xp rate gain overall, and removing battle fatigue from the game entirely. We have some other enhancements to the entertainer professions that we want to do as well (profession-specific inspiration buffs for non-combat professions), but this is what is currently in development.

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omadnay wrote:
How do you think you can design a game to make people "really want to go see an enterainer"?

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See Chessack's post above.

That's basically what I was trying to say, though perhaps I lack the Dancer's touch when describing it.

So... we make out own props, and no longer buy weapons or armor (paying extras for custom orders very often, let it be said).

So... we don't have battle fatigue so there is no need for the healing mods the BE make (sold at a premium because it takes eggs) and Tailors put in synthcloth and then come to cantinas to put into custom made clothing for us (also sold at a premium price).

So...we now have nonfunctioning props to go with our nonfunctioning instruments (by which I mean they don't do anything).

So...we loseBattle Fatigue, which was a great"string on the finger" method that got adventurers out of the dungeon and into towns every so often. Yes, it's a system of negative reinforcement, but like manypeople who don't understandpsychology, you assume negative means bad. It's important for actions to have consequences, and it was eminiently logical that someone out working and fightinggot fatigued. We do our damnedest to make the removal of the Fatigue a pleasant and fun time. Now you tell us it's bad, because we did it wrong? or because you allowed AFK to go on so long that you turned the cantina milleu into a wasteland?

So...now instead of merchants coming in and selling us goods, as well as networking with the other people there to heal, we get what? These vaguely hinted at profession specific buffs, that will reward people for coming to see us and make them want to do it. Without details we are supposed to swallow these further losses and changes, and accept this semi mythical improvement. We are supposed to be pleased that our sources of economic interaction are being removed, and that somehow this stuff you can't tell us about will make it better? Might as well leave AFK play in, because now the cantinas will be McDonalds Drive Thru, and the only people who can work and function in McDonalds drive thru for an extended period are zombies (no offense intended to actual McDonalds employees, this is a metaphor).

We're being exiled. Cut off from what used to be a viable economic system. Let's toss the baby with the bath water shall we?

Here are a couple things to consider before you attempt this:

-make the concept of props similar to slicing. We take an existing item and make it usable as a prop. Then, we still need to obtain the items, there would be a logical progression to propmaking and the Entertainers who don't want to be crafters (remember them?) don't need to be!

-keep battle fatigue, but give us a buff that would impart BF resistance. Fighters could heal up, get the buff, and then go out for a longer jaunt if they wished. Excessive BF should slow people down physically and mentally (lower regen in the action and mind). A tired body should not heal as well. Anyone who approves of even a TINY bit of verisimilitude can't argue with that. With a BF buff, the hunter is off whistling "I've been working in the Spice Mine, all the live long day" and not tiring out as fast. It makes sense to me, anyone else?

-brush up on your B.F. Skinner and how his theories apply to game design. People didn't regret coming to us to heal half as much as they regretted not having a smoothly functioningsystem and some benefit after. The resentment came more from the fact that it was a hassle to get what we offered, moreso than hating to come visit regularly.

-wound healing and stat enhancement are what bothered most entertainers about our healing abilities, not the metaphor used to simulate tiredness and recuperation, which real work and real relaxation would impart.

-if we do keep BF, create some prop food and drink. Let it be available from a cantina, or enhanced versions from Chefs, but have it apply a state of improved fatigue reduction while you're in the cantina. Sip a drink eat a snack (and be seen doing it for immersion's sake) and even the BF haters won't complain if it gets them out in half the time.

Ok, I'm spent. The heavy handed nature of the post, coupled with the fact that it didn't truly say much that was substantively positive, bothered me. It's your job to think on this stuff, and we appreciate you doing your job, but a lot of us have had a lot of time to think on this too, and if my ideas aren't good enough, I'm sure any of the millions of others could be worthy.

Message Edited by Chessack on 06-17-2005 04:32 PM