Droid Engineer Archive
Thread: I know what I might do (on MY server, anyway)...
this is just what i told u, what u intended is one thing, the other is what it turns out to cause.
just to make somehting clear, the devs will watch the forums this weakend for support or better ideas, if they dont get this we dont get any changes ever. btw roughly 90% of the posts in the DE forum are against it not 90% of the DEs or community.
giving out droids for free might be fun, but i dont think its fun if noone wants them cause they got em from someone else, right? and if people dont buy from DEs because they get stuff for free the pure crafter DEs game is ruined simply.
Sadly we exist in a playground... a sandbox where SOE holds all the water hoses except for one: the player-run economy. We don't have control on where people go, what they do, what they can't do, whether they live or they die. We have no input into what the developers do with our profession, what changes they make to the game in general, or even how we would like to see things turn out. The only thing we have any control on at all is the economy. And even then I don't think we have enough. There's no way for us to control or regulate who sells what or where. We can't cripple the competition in any way.We can only pray that we get enough market-share or undercut people.
So nowwe're all feelingfeeling trapped, no choice in what's going to happen, and TheRealTK421 is striking out in the onlyavenue with whichhe canhave any influence. But even if he does,sadly I don't think there's any end-game strategy for it. No world-changing goal worth justifying the action (or at least in my opinion).
But this just illustrates the main point.There are no good answers. As I have said, we have not enough control on things. Without a real purpose, or 'content' as they like to say, people start turning to -and on- each other. We're bored by the game almost immediately because anything we want to do is either disallowed, easy to accomplish (mastership in days)or was never added in to begin with. The only thing we can end up having influence on is other people. How can we affect them? How can we control them? We can't changethe situation ofthe game, so we focus our efforts on the one thing we can change: the situation of other people.
On the one hand I think this is wrong, as it is a longwinded way of saying that this is griefing; which it is. But on the other hand, it is happening for a reason: SOE is failing to deliver anything. I don't support griefing and never will, but I understand why it happens. The worst part is SOE isn't making any effort to change this. It is THE underlying game flaw. Balancing is the natural knee-jerk reaction to this because it appears to solve the problem. But as soon as you 'balance' one part of the game, all the players will start flooding to the next part because it is something to do. It is something that lets them affect others. It makes them distinct and better than their peers.
in the case of SWG there really is little to no hope at this point. There are no mechanics to provide 'content' that entrances the players and immerses them. All there is is numbers and rules and balances and classes. One side creates items, the other side uses them to temporarily destroy things. And for what? Nothing changes. Nothing is different. Nothing lasts. It's all entirely worthless.
As such, I'm inclined to surrender at this point, and eventually move on.
In the case of the droids; the reason this thread was started? The only option I'd say we could exercise and win would be to severely overcharge on all droids, and maintain an extreme price. But unfortunately that requires every member of the DEA to abide by the decision, and basic human nature will take effect long before that happens. Not to mention that there'll always be a number of people who will see the ability to grind DE quickly then sell everything cheaper while living outside of our control.
control... control... control...
Go for it! If that is what you really want then you have my blessing 
All type of gaming styles are good as long as it dont hurt other players enjoyment.
Me personally? I will probably drop my master doc title and go DH as soon as the profession is released.
I love droids! They are really cool. Cant see whats wrong with me standing behind the frontline in a raid and control my droidekas. CH does it everyday but with Graul maulers... Ppl who says that this dont fix the DE profession are right but it will give them a upswing in their economy and will also make DE more demanded (I know I would love to have a master DE as a friend when I am DH!)
And it came to pass ...
That a thousand DE's
Made a million MSE's
And brought the servers to their knees.
It was known as the Million Droid March
They were everywhere.....
Edsoni DE
Wanderhome
Well, I won't be doing anything.
Since our corrispondant is working directly against us, any hope for the DE profession is lost.
Our corrispondent is openly working against the community -
http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=droid_engineer&message.id=56564
Audio
our correspondent is working for all not only a part of the DEs who are in the forums. he is a class corespondent meaning he deals with things concerning the class not a represetative.
there are two choices, DH or nothing and i think DH is better. and i dont think our corespondent or the devs will ignor if a better idea shows up that is implementable. btw certs and DE improvments have been ranted down in this board so the devs dropped this ideas.
Wood..I've never broken down any of your posts before, but you're about to get 'served'...
Enjoy!
/bow
TheWoody wrote:
Sadly we exist in a playground...a sandbox where SOE holds all the water hoses except for one: the player-run economy. We don't have control on where people go, what they do, what they can't do, whether they live or they die.
Actually, the overt among us can attempt to control when opposing faction members live or die...but to a large degree, you're correct.
We have no input into what the developers do with our profession, what changes they make to the game in general, or even how we would like to see things turn out.
Actually, the forum-goers provide a silly amount of "input". I think the real statement here is that our input has very little bearing on swaying the handed-down-from-on-high design decisions made by the Devs.
Cases in point:
1) CH was originally released and easily became known as, by FAR, the most powerful profession in the game. I don't think that point is debatable even in the least. The Devs believed they had the "right" creature/CH system in place. We didn't...and they ended up having to spend a TON of man hours and money fixing the situation.
2) Jedi. Same deal. Different profession, different problems/issues and misdesign. Same result. They have to go back now and spend time and man hours to fix it.
Proposition: Anything worth doing is worth doing right the first time (especially when it's released in an admittedly broken and over/underpower manner or simply doesn't make sense).
How long do you think it will be until we hear the unknown numbers of DHs complaining about how broken their profession might be and awaiting the 6-9 months until the Devs get around to fixing what never should have been put in place at the outset?
Do you not think that many DEs will still be decrying that our profession is STILL as useless and busted as it ever was...even after all of the "Invasion" comes to pass?
From what I can tell...we will all collectively be in the same place 6-9 months from now that we are right now.
....cause the solution that we await wasn't done right the first time (See "Cases in point:" numbers 1 and 2, above).
The only thing we have any control on at all is the economy. And even then I don't think we have enough. There's no way for us to control or regulate who sells what or where. We can't cripple the competition in any way.We can only pray that we get enough market-share or undercut people.
We can kind of cripple competition. What good is competing to sell droids when they can become a free commodity (for those that choose to give them away...due to the goodness of their own heart)?!?
If you ran an ice cream shop and wanted to compete, how hard would you do so when the shop down the street had ALL the same flavors as you....................for free.
Would you try to compete then?
So nowwe're all feelingfeeling trapped, no choice in what's going to happen, and TheRealTK421 is striking out in the onlyavenue with whichhe canhave any influence.
I'm not sure that this is striking out. An original plan for fun? Maybe.
A touch bitter? Perhaps...but I'm a DE...I'm no stranger to bitterness. This is just a different way to take the medicine the Devs have poured in our collective spoon.
But even if he does,sadly I don't think there's any end-game strategy for it. No world-changing goal worth justifying the action (or at least in my opinion).
I don't want to change the world...unless by "change" you mean give droids to people that think they are cool and want to use them.
But this just illustrates the main point.There are no good answers. As I have said, we have not enough control on things. Without a real purpose, or 'content' as they like to say, people start turning to -and on- each other.
Well, I'd kind of agree with this.
We're bored by the game almost immediately because anything we want to do is either disallowed, easy to accomplish (mastership in days)or was never added in to begin with. The only thing we can end up having influence on is other people. How can we affect them?
In a positive way.
How can we control them?
Uhhh...I'm not sure anyone here wants to "control" other players. I know I sure don't. I'd rather be able to have fun together.
We can't changethe situation ofthe game, so we focus our efforts on the one thing we can change: the situation of other people.
It's too bad really...we'd be able to have a better chance of changing the situation of the game if the powers-that-be would actually communicate, and act, as if they had a genuine interest in the input from the paying players. When there's this much fervor and animosity over a chosen game design proposed, I'd think that's a good indication that it's time to go back to the drawing board.
If they had made an attempt to truly understand the issues in play, and weren't so quick to pick the easiest avenue for a "fix", they might have a chance of getting it right the first time (see "Cases in point", numbers 1 and 2, above).
On the one hand I think this is wrong, as it is a longwinded way of saying that this is griefing; which it is.
What's griefing? Giving droids away?Howdid I grief my 'client' by giving him something that I really enjoyed the thought of him using to better his/her experience and "fun" in the game?
But on the other hand, it is happening for a reason: SOE is failing to deliver anything.
Well, I'm not sure you'll get tons of debate or discussion here on this point. They do deliver things...they just seem to find a way to miss (or dismiss) a lot of things that a lot of users scream about as having an impact on their experience.
I don't support griefing and never will, but I understand why it happens.The worst part is SOE isn't making any effort to change this. It is THE underlying game flaw.
There may be other flaws...but I see what you mean.Players grief for two reason, as far as I can tell:
1) They are bored.
2) They have an immature, sophmoric mentality that makes them believe that they get fun when they ruin someone else's day. It's the samementality as those that like to do grafitti.
Balancing is the natural knee-jerk reaction to this because it appears to solve the problem. But as soon as you 'balance' one part of the game, all the players will start flooding to the next part because it is something to do. It is something that lets them affect others. It makes them distinct and better than their peers.
Yes...this is an allusion to Case #1, above. The flood actually started right at launch and had to be controlled eventually via the pet revamp.
Like I said...
Anything worth doing is worth doing right the first time.
in the case of SWG there really is little to no hope at this point. There are no mechanics to provide 'content' that entrances the players and immerses them. All there is is numbers and rules and balances and classes. One side creates items, the other side uses them to temporarily destroy things. And for what? Nothing changes. Nothing is different. Nothing lasts. It's all entirely worthless.
Yes..I fear you're right here. Players don't see that their actions over time have any impact on the game environment.
As such, I'm inclined to surrender at this point, and eventually move on.
I guess if you're moving on to DH, you'll know where to get your droids, huh?
In the case of the droids; the reason this thread was started? The only option I'd say we could exercise and win would be to severely overcharge on all droids, and maintain an extreme price.
Controlling markets in this fashion is totally unrealistic, at least in an upward direction.
People undercut all the time...it appears to be the way of things.That's fine.Free markets do it all the time.
But unfortunately that requires every member of the DEA to abide by the decision, and basic human nature will take effect long before that happens.
Nope...it likely wouldn't. I'm sure a large portion could probably make a good run at keeping pricing up but it wouldn't last. They'd sit on inventory forever and never get a chance to do what they wanted to do...
Make cool droids for themselves and others to use.
I'll still make droids...I'm just gonna make it insanely easy for people to get them.
Not to mention that there'll always be a number of people who will see the ability to grind DE quickly then sell everything cheaper while living outside of our control.
Why grind DE at all when you can have the droid just by taking DH and picking up a free "tank"?
Doesn't seem much reason to become a DE to me.
control... control... control...
Respectfully,
Ashlish wrote:
Make sure to let the DEA know so people like me can plan accordingly.
If you consider this situation carefully, there's no reason why it can't happen now with current droids. We all just understand that you can't give away stuff like this for free forever. Well, maybe....that depends on how many people you have helping "the cause".
I'd warn the Ahazi DENet before I ever took any action along these lines.
/bow
Respectfully,
Nelus wrote:
dont think the devs will bring in a new idea considering mad player that wanna ruin the game. as u stated without such actions the dev idea will be good for all.
I love it so much, I'm going to share my love of droids with everyone and make sure that price NEVER becomes an issue preventing someone from getting/using a droid.
No one is forcing me to charge for my products.
/bow
Respectfully,
TK:
Can you start a Droid Engineering word of the day thead? I went to public school.