Droid Engineer Archive
Thread: DEs Unite: A compromise for the DE/Crafter and DE/CH camps
Oops....
One thing that makes this forum work, as annoying as I find this feature, is the fact that threads that are heavily used ('popular') float to the top and stay there for awhile.
And BTW, I don't think TH's thread is stickied to the top of the forum. So if it sinks, it will be lost. Out of sight, out of mind.
Daker,
I did read somewhere that the devs plan on allowing DE to pull more than one droid out - yea, I can heal now!
But as far as non-profession (DE, CH) users, they were going to lock pets down tight - only one out at a time - and afterwards look at exceptions to loosen up the restriction. Kind of stupid to have 3 stormtroopers for faction combat but only be able to pull out one.
I have to agree, this is the simplest plan anyone has proposed yet. And they could probably roll it out in a week or two. With only one combat droid available, or callable at a time, it'sthe perfect solution.
When more droids become available, with different combat levels, they'll probably have to whip something else up so we don't have the same overpowering problems CH had.
In that case, I still think the CH model would be the simplest and easiest plan to implement. But I know alot of people oppose that plan on principle.
Daker-Naritus wrote:
I thought of a perfect compromise between the positions:
Implement combat droids usuable by ALL players, but limit non-DEs to one combat droid, and allow advanced DEs (to prevent dabbling) to have 2 of the combat droids.
That is a very good solution but I feel with all the negativity TH is getting from Non-DEs coming into the DE forum we will never see it. 
As an alternative, perhaps we can sell the best combat droid to everyone but get a less uber but still very viable and very cool droid for use in combat.
Example: if Droidekas were the best, everyone would want the best. Perhaps theIG-88 becomes a DE only droid but has a lesser damage rating but is still freakin' sweet.
Also to prevent noobs from gaining droids to tank, I see two distinict ways to prevent this without certs:
1) Already in the works, MOB AI will be getting smarter. They will come and attack the pet owner. A noob with a Combat Droid doesnt really stand a chance when this change goes in. This new feature which will probably come out before we get combat droids and thus make droid certs not needed.
2) If you really want noobs to not have these, just make the resource requirements very high or make the minerals needed to make them very rare. That will drive up the price for a DE to break even on the droid so let the economy prevent these droids from selling cheap. Look at houses and guild halls. The better ones are riskier to build and take a lot of materials. Therefore they cantsell them cheap. Just apply this to combat droids and you solve your problem.
But Daker-Naritus and the rest of you hard working DEs, keep up the good work on trying to figure this out. Hopefully our profession becomes cooler because of it.
Cameo - Master DE - Naritus Server
Let us think two seconds ...
If there are new real combat droids and no certifiactions you can be sure than in less than two month they nerfed like the probots and we are all again in the forums crying because our droids are useless
If there are new real combat droids and certifiactions the game may be viable but then we have a problem
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Let us think two seconds about the issues :
1 -we have combat droids and no certifications in less than two month the will be nerfed like the probots to prevent newbee to get too powerfull ( and do not underestimate newbee money is not a problem for them you can have toons of cred easy when you know how to do it not millions but enough to buy a combat droid )
2 -we have combat droid and certifications , thentherewill a problem whoand how willwe get the certifications in my opinion the best way to bypass this is to have real usefull combat droid.
- that is to say combat droid that can be used only by a profession :
-Bounty hunter droids that can hunt and not only track fugitive ( with some special attacks relative to bounty hunter trees )
- scout/ranger/CH droids than canbe usefull to find animals dna sample protect the user agaisnt wildlife,with the abilityto calm down the wildlife , but with no effects on NPC
&n
First of all, the CH dabbling issue is being resolved.
Second, I think we need "Both": Combat droids to sell and a big nasty combat droid that is ours. Our personal little baby, if you will.
I do not agree with those who want toplace us DEs in the same "Build and Sell" catagory as Architects, Tailors, etc. We've been screwed for so long, I say we get rewarded for it and make our class truly unique among the Artisans.
Let us think two seconds about the issues :
1 -we have combat droids and no certifications in less than two month the will be nerfed like the probots to prevent newbee to get too powerfull ( and do not underestimate newbee money is not a problem for them you can have toons of cred easy when you know how to do it not millions but enough to buy a combat droid )
2 -we have combat droid and certifications , thentherewill a problem whoand how willwe get the certifications in my opinion the best way to bypass this is to have real usefull combat droid.
- that is to say combat droid that can be used only by a profession :
-Bounty hunter droids that can hunt and not only track fugitive ( with some special attacks relative to bounty hunter trees )
- scout/ranger/CH droids than canbe usefull to find animals dna sample protect the user agaisnt wildlife,with the abilityto calm down the wildlife , but with no effects on NPC
- Combat medics droids than can spread diseases and other attacks based on debuff ...
- commando droids that can help them to use heavy weapon , mine and so one ...
- Artisant combat droids that can help them survive in harvester run
- and at least let us be a little selfish powerfull combat droids that needs to be remote controlledby droid engineers ( like in ep1 )
- ... And so on
i am sure that we can find a type of combat droid that can be powerfull and have weakness for every advanced profession and we can put certification in every advanced profession.
3 - If we want the DE to be a pure crafter simply remove combat droids ...
solution 1 will not resolve the problem it will result in more frustration.
solution 2 will be the best for me and a mix between crafter/combat and it does not cut off the market , but we are no more able able to use every droids we make.
solution 3 will lead in the frustration in every one who see star wars through the second trilogy ( well ep 1 ep 2 ep 3 ).
So in my opinion we need combat droids , we need certifaction but we need them in an inteligent ways, and as we are a litlle selfish we need something that is unique to us to reward the effots needed to be DE
Reaperss wrote:
I belive in a cert system for droids. Especially combat droids. Say 1 combat droid at Master Marksman, and one more as a master of any elite combat profession. DE's should not get any combat advantage and should have at least novice marksman before getting to use combat droids. Droids with up to LV3 medical modules should be available to novice medics, with master medics getting lv4 novice doctors and combat medics getting lv6. Something along these lines should also be done for other professions.
Sounds like a lot of work for our devs
I still don't see what gaining a novice or master combat profession has to do with using droids. Another problem I have with spamming DE skills to all professions. If you want to learn how to use droids, take a few DE skills.
And I'm not going to argue that droids have autonomous AI, because in this game they don't. I think you still should have some sort of specific training to use any piece of 'equipement'.
Daker-Naritus wrote:
Hawk, what you are saying doesn't make sense...
(1) If the devs give us better combat droids, it will be done only after a lot of balancing discussion as to how powerful they should be. Thinking that devs are going to give us combat droids and then take them away by nerfing themis stupid. The only reason it happened the first time was because the game was new and they didn't have much experience in the issue. Things have changed since that time.
(2) Devs are not going to implement 14 differeent kinds of droids, and will not give us 30 different certifications (one for each class).Theywant a simple, quickfix that iseasy to implement. We will get one, maybe 2 new droids and maybe some new modules. If all you ask for is complicated stuff like this you will get nothing.
(3) How could removing combat droids even be an option?
My solution gives good combat droids that are sellable, a small number of them, easy implementation (same droids for everyone, DEs get more), and something unique and special to the class (we get to handle 2-3 combat droids instead of only one). Why does htis not solve every problem you think we have? Why does it need to be more complicated than this?
Well , it does not make sense but think about the probot ... nerfed think about the CH they have change the certifications if there are combat droid the dev will not make an exeption or they will be nerfed and will be lower than any first CH pets to keep balance and keep a gaol to CH or there will be Certification
Point two yes the dev will not make 14 different droids but i my opinion to have profession specific combat droid is a way to adress the problem even if i know that this will never happen
point three is the one i most disagree with but if you listen to some others DE they have been thinking of it
Certifiactionsis the only options to keep balance and avoid the probot style nerfs as you have said if the dev give us combat droid it will stupid to nerf them , well they have been stupid one time they may do the same once again .
The problem is how we get certification ? that is the good question
Improved mob AI would make it so theres no need for certifications, and noobies wouldnt be able to tank with a good combat droid. Whatever theyre attacking would just get killed before the noobie would be able to do any damage and get any xp, and if the droid didnt kill it quickly it would attack the noobie who by default would die quickly by attacking something too strong for him. The droid would be useless to them until they get better.
The issue still holds that newbie players *can* use the upper end combat droids to give a rather unbalanced assistance to combat. Maybe they can get the money to buy them, or maybe they have a Guildie friend just give them away for free. The fact is that the newbie player doesn't work at anything to acquire that droid, and that unbalances their combat level.
I really think certifications are the only true way to restrict use. DE-Only combat droids would do it also, but then you'd kill the general market for combat droids while also opening it up to "dabblers" who take Novice DE just to use the upper-end combat droids. Keeping it DE only but putting certs in the DE tree will only move us more towards a CH profession that makes its pets, which would piss off both CH and BE. We aren't that, we're a crafting class. No droid should be better than a master-level CH pet, because the CH spent skill points to get that pet. A random player using a droid didn't spend skill points to be able to use it.
Certification systems keeps the upper-level droids out of lower-level hands, while still keeping the market open for us to sell them.
Reaperss wrote:
I belive in a cert system for droids. Especially combat droids. Say 1 combat droid at Master Marksman, and one more as a master of any elite combat profession. DE's should not get any combat advantage and should have at least novice marksman before getting to use combat droids. Droids with up to LV3 medical modules should be available to novice medics, with master medics getting lv4 novice doctors and combat medics getting lv6. Something along these lines should also be done for other professions.
Eh, personally I'm a Master DE/Master Artisan/Master Merchant, and for one,I dont have the skill points to master marksman, much less an elitecombatprofession, and for another thing the combat droidsshould apply to brawlers too 
If we no longer had to depend on master artisan as much, I'd be fine with the master idea 
Daker-Naritus wrote:
...If we get several combat droids, I would be PISSED if they all did one thing (shoot). I would prefer the devs to ask for feedback, and us to have varied combat skills on the droids.Maybe droideka are the best at pure shooting. Maybe we get battle droids (roger rogers) thatwave a weaker generalattack, but can throw (or launch if you prefer) grenades that hit mobs with an area attack. Droidekas would be better for pure one on one fighting, battle droids better for groups. Maybeadd the ability to give the battle droid anygun in the crafting process, thereby allowing custimization and specialization. Then non-DEs would have a choice of several combat droids that they can choose one from based on what fits the situation, and we get the ability to assemble groups of different droids (because we can have several) thereby giving us a cool advantage.
Personally I think it should be something like
Droideka: Overallbest 1 vs 1
Battle Droids: Significantly weaker than the Droideka, but 2-3 can be out at a time to make up for it. (Roger Rogers)
IG Assassin: Best anti-personnel droid.
Hailfire Missle: Blast damage, best anti-vehicle.