Droid Engineer Archive
Thread: Greed The real reason why some want to keep DE a so-called pure crafter class.
I've noticed that KOLLOS is a rather vocal proponent of the "pure crafter" idea. I've met him in game and I'd like to hear his thoughts.
Kollos, I'd like to hear more about your reasons for not having a DE-only combat droid. I'm not trying to bait you or anything like that. I myself lean toward accepting the DE only droid, mainly because I personally have no use for most of the droids that I make, except for WDG crafting. Why should I not want a DE-only uber-combat droid?
Check your facts, last time I checked all you needed to do was harvest resources from dead things or mask scent. CASE OPEN.
Alanbane wrote:
This class is above the Artisan tree.. CH is above a combat tree. Case CLOSED.
Check your facts, last time I checked all you needed to do was harvest resources from dead things or mask scent. CASE OPEN.
Mask scent you don't get until the second box up the tree. And to harvest from dead creatures you have to have had a hand in its death. So you at least have to be in on a number of kills to make it to mask scent, from there, sure, you can probably make it to CH without killing anything else, but there's no way without killing (or having a hand in killing) quite a few critters.
What do you have to kill to make DE?
The problem is a pure DE can't fight. Why give the DE a combat droid. I think it is a bad idea. Combat droid levels should be based on your combat skill. Or what will happen is the Droid Handler will be like the CH will be soon be where it is not any good unless you master it.
How many people think there will be a huge flow of new DEs that spend SP on artisan, engineer, novice DE plus what ever levels are required to get a good combat droid? Not many I wouldn't think as most are struggling to balance SP as it is now. Doesn't matter to me one way or the other except that DEs need something we can sell, not just make for ourselves.
I think people expect to see a Droideka type combat droids. I seriously doubt SOE based on their current views on CH and non-ch pets would do something like that.
Even if there was a flow of new DEs just to dabble and get the good combat droids, SOE would make it so you couldn't dabble and get a good one. Just look at what is coming for CH. No more dabblers for good pets.
Personally I would like to so more utility and functional droids instead of combat droids and maybe even some bug fixes too. Not just DE bug bugs but many of those still in the game that seem to go unresolved to this day despite being "fixed".
I dare not try to post links, given my own incompetence with such things and the obvious problems that others have had trying to do so. 
I've posted my concerns in a couple of other threads on this topic, most of which are all still on the front page, but it basically boils down to this:
Droid Engineer is a crafting class. Adding a DE-only combat droid, if that droid is better than any other combat droid we can make, will radically change the end-game for a Droid Engineer. We will no longer be a crafting class, but rather a combat class. Or, if you prefer, a hybrid combat-crafter. That is a fundamental change to the profession that is, in essence, a bait and switch. Every single one of us chose the Droid Engineer profession knowing (at some level) that it was a crafting class and that droids could be used equally by anyone. Changing that in such a fundamental manner after so many people have invested so much time is just wrong.
HUGE OVER-REACHING GENERALIZATIONS FOLLOW.
You were warned, put down the flamethrower. 
Crafting classes attract one type of player while combat classes attract an entirely different type. Crafters tend to understand an economy and usually work to support it because it is the very foundation of what they enjoy doing. Warriors tend to not understand an economy, at least not at the level of detail that your average Crafter does, and also tend to not give a hoot whether or not any particular aspect of that economy remains sound unless it infringes on their ability to have the best weapon/armor/loot.
Attracting Warriors to the Droid Engineer profession would, in my opinion, work to destroy the droid economy. These Droid Handlers, as I have taken to calling them, really wouldn't care whether or not they could sell droids and support a shop because their end goal is only to Master the profession and get the DE-only combat droid. They have an alternate source of income (combat) that supports their way of life, so have no need to sell droids at a profit (whether modest or not). Along the way, or even after they achieve their end combat-related goal, they would happily ruin the droid economy by dumping their wares on the market. (Note that "dumping" is an actual term used in federal law, so please understand the meaning before you flame.)
Please note that I have no problem with a Droid Handler class. I only have a problem with the Droid Handler and the Droid Engineer being one and the same. Add droid certs to Creature Handler. Add droid certs to Squad Leader. Create an all-new Droid Handler class. Any one of those is great because it does not affect the way that the Droid Engineer is played - in fact, any one of those options would be a huge bonus to the Droid Engineer profession because it would give us a larger (and presumably more dedicated) customer base. A larger customer base would attract more Droid Engineers to the profession, competition would flourish, and the droid economy would prosper.
I want to see new combat droids because I want to be able to provide them to my customers. I'd also like to have better protection for myself when I am out tending my harvesters or delivering a special order. I even like the idea I saw wherein certs are automatically granted to anyone as they level - basically, the lowest level combat droid is available to anyone, the next step up to a Master of a base profession, the next step up to the Master of an elite profession, and the top rung to a Master of at least 2 professions (at least 1 of which is elite). Just don't add a top rung that is only available to a Droid Engineer because that will fundamentally alter the profession.
As to bait and switch
"Game Experience May Change During Online Play"
That gives the devs the right to do anything they want
Yeh and a tailor should have cloths pet and maybe chef should have killer food, or maybe armorsmiths have killer suits of armor, and then have houses for the architechs that eat people. Yeh i see all the proffesions in the artisianline having the obvious want and desire to become a handler of some sorts.
Makes perfect sense. What a fix, lets see ch is number one played profession i know how to fix smugglers have them control killer crates of illegal substance.
Come on you have to have more metal power then this.
This dumb solution was created because ch is number one profession. Its pitiful thats the best they could come up with, and your support for it is as sorry as there poor excuse of fixing a profession.
Droid-Creator wrote:
As to bait and switch
"Game Experience May Change During Online Play"
That gives the devs the right to do anything they want
I can only assume that's sarcasm, because I certainly hope you know that's a CYA statement. The video game industry is under siege from various directions about the content of games, which is why we now have voluntary ESRB ratings. SOE has to put something like that on the game to protect themselves legally from all of the jerks who swear and make lewd comments online that, unfortunately, children may be subjected to. That's a whole heapin' huge federal mess that we REALLY don't want to get into.
No, that statement means they can make any changes to the game they desire.
All sarcasm aside, I'm in favor of all classes getting unique items at master levels.
Sinnare wrote:
Yeh and a tailor should have cloths pet and maybe chef should have killer food, or maybe armorsmiths have killer suits of armor, and then have houses for the architechs that eat people. Yeh i see all the proffesions in the artisianline having the obvious want and desire to become a handler of some sorts.
Makes perfect sense. What a fix, lets see ch is number one played profession i know how to fix smugglers have them control killer crates of illegal substance.
Come on you have to have more metal power then this.
This dumb solution was created because ch is number one profession. Its pitiful thats the best they could come up with, and your support for it is as sorry as there poor excuse of fixing a profession.
I've heard this plenty of times and still strikes me as having a terminal lack of thought. If a decision was made based on these examples, we would have our probots and DZ70's taken away (not that anyone would notice if the DZ70 was gone). Yes, we are a crafting class, an elite profession of the Artisan tree. But, we are also a pet class. We are the perfect blend of both. We make pets that any other class, combat or craft, would find useful.
Oh, and chefs do make killer food, but it's a bug so I won't get into that discussion.
The other interesting reply, and I asked for it, was from Kollos:
----"they would happily ruin the droid economy by dumping their wares on the market."
This was what I suspected was the major issue for the pure-crafter minded person. I have no argument for that. I would not want to see my market decline because of an influx of 1337 d00ds.
I have an idea that I think is a good one, but will probably get buried in this thread. it's a rough plan, a beginning really, but the concept has merit:
What if we plant droid commands in the artisan tree? All of the basic commands could be in the engineering branch, so that any DE could command a droid for just about any purpose. But combat commands would be spread out among the other branches so that a player wanting a DE-only combat droid would not only have to master DE, but spend a lot of points in Artisan. We could take it a step further and grant droid combat commands in the Master Artisan skillbox. The effect would be to reduce available skill points and make the option less attractive to "dabblers".
So, instead of a DE-only combat droid, how about a Master Artisan/MDE-only droid?