Doctor Archive

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TarMangani wrote:

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Traigus wrote:

Sorry, I don't use IE, so I don't get neat color options unless I hand code ;(

My apologies on the color limitations...

The changes were made to make Doc appealing to traditional MMOG healers, not to the crafter/merchant hybrids most remaining docs seem to be.

I hope that once and for all this will silence ANYONE who says that docs aren't being made to look like EQ, WOW, and other MMOG's...

In many ways I'd agree... one of the reasons a lot of us are retired. The issues that are brought up here were brought up by Corre's and glowies, then by Sandbox people, now by the general public. But, stuff is still going to go the way it goes. You'll see more personal opinions by the glowies on the CU because we are "banned from the ranch" and not privvy to stuff. A lot of us don't like various aspects of the proposed CU, and generally have mention most of the ways you all won't like it. I don't see them stepping back fro mthe big changes. I dunno in te timeframe if they will even step back from the small stuff. The yare hemmed in by RoW, and they don't want to have to rebalance all the encoutners in that as well as the existing game after the CU.

Did they tell you guys anything specific regarding the economic effects, etc.?

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heh. I just hate IE.

I didn't knwo ther was any real debate on the fact SWG is going more mainstream... It won't be the same as other games, but it is getting closer.. It is pretty obvious.. I don't thin kthe devs have ever said it anyplace.

For the last bit:

Anything I know covered by the NDA, I can't talk about still. That hasn't changed. I'm still in the sandbox, whenever that happens, and covered till they drop the NDA. The medical people did indeed mention the massive stockpiling that has been done, the millions spend in craft clothing etc. The devs read the posts, and they know. I don't know what they plan. I don't know if they are really sure yet either... see TH's post on SCAs here. http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=Developers&message.id=64754#M64754

The economy is well known to be massively overinflated. I dunno if they might use this as a chance to drain cash outa the system... Too many things can be measured (and paid for) in millions of CR. I'd do it now. A lot of people are gonan go nuts already because of th changes. Blowing a lot of money out of the system would blend into the chaos. Doing something like that by itself later would just make people crazy another time.

-T

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Traigus wrote:


The economy is well known to be massively overinflated. I dunno if they might use this as a chance to drain cash outa the system... Too many things can be measured (and paid for) in millions of CR. I'd do it now. A lot of people are gonan go nuts already because of th changes. Blowing a lot of money out of the system would blend into the chaos. Doing something like that by itself later would just make people crazy another time.

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I say do it to us all at once. Who wants to get BF'd twice? (And yes, that's what they're doing to us...).

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TarMangani wrote:

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Traigus wrote:


The changes were made to make Doc appealing to traditional MMOG healers, not to the crafter/merchant hybrids most remaining docs seem to be.

I hope that once and for all this will silence ANYONE who says that docs aren't being made to look like EQ, WOW, and other MMOG's...

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Traigus wrote:

Zero threads on healing, fun adventure healing, or any other healing topic. There used to be, but I haven't seen them... not in a long time.

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Ok I'm 100% with you here, but I don't understand your link between crafting meds and the lack of docs going out and healing. The main reason why Docs only heal friends is because, by and large, it isn't profitable the way buffing was. In this respect I'm very happy to see the end of buffing as was, it can only get us back to healing.

But how does crafting factor into this? As far as I can see as a doc I spent only 10% of my time crafting, it never took me away from adventuring, (as an aside niether did buffing for that matter, cause I only buffed friends too). As it is I can whip up a schematic in 5 minutes put it into a factory and get on with being a healer, what is going to cause the train wreck in that?

Now if you mean that stimBs were too powerful then fine, but the fix is not to take crafting from Doc altogether, much less create a whole class of stims that any one can use. I'm sorry if I'm being dense here (it's not my intention) but I really don't see what you are getting at.

Gift.

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Giftmacher wrote:

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Traigus wrote:

Zero threads on healing, fun adventure healing, or any other healing topic. There used to be, but I haven't seen them... not in a long time.

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Ok I'm 100% with you here, but I don't understand your link between crafting meds and the lack of docs going out and healing. The main reason why Docs only heal friends is because, by and large, it isn't profitable the way buffing was. In this respect I'm very happy to see the end of buffing as was, it can only get us back to healing.

But how does crafting factor into this? As far as I can see as a doc I spent only 10% of my time crafting, it never took me away from adventuring, (as an aside niether did buffing for that matter, cause I only buffed friends too). As it is I can whip up a schematic in 5 minutes put it into a factory and get on with being a healer, what is going to cause the train wreck in that?

Now if you mean that stimBs were too powerful then fine, but the fix is not to take crafting from Doc altogether, much less create a whole class of stims that any one can use. I'm sorry if I'm being dense here (it's not my intention) but I really don't see what you are getting at.

Gift.

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I wasn't for 100% craft removal... never was. I never thought we needed so many meds to do our jobs. My general opinion was to do combo packs instead of 1 for every stat.

It takes a lot of time to get good materials in SWG... especially when rares are out of sequence. I don't mass produce, but I have crates and crates of materials in my houses in case a rare spawn doesn't come up soon... not even good stuff... but just rares so I can make stuff.

Many of the people hare have godawful cr. worth of stuff.

making the schematic takes little time.. But there are materials, power, maintenace cr. etc. the time needed to pay for all of it, just to stay operational... I also count that. It isn't always playing (grinding missions etc. to make cash), many times it is making money just to pay the bills... I dunno about you, but I play games to avoid RL bill paying activities

There is a lot of backend time on crafting in SWG.

-T

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Traigus wrote:

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Giftmacher wrote:

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Traigus wrote:

Zero threads on healing, fun adventure healing, or any other healing topic. There used to be, but I haven't seen them... not in a long time.

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Ok I'm 100% with you here, but I don't understand your link between crafting meds and the lack of docs going out and healing. The main reason why Docs only heal friends is because, by and large, it isn't profitable the way buffing was. In this respect I'm very happy to see the end of buffing as was, it can only get us back to healing.

But how does crafting factor into this? As far as I can see as a doc I spent only 10% of my time crafting, it never took me away from adventuring, (as an aside niether did buffing for that matter, cause I only buffed friends too). As it is I can whip up a schematic in 5 minutes put it into a factory and get on with being a healer, what is going to cause the train wreck in that?

Now if you mean that stimBs were too powerful then fine, but the fix is not to take crafting from Doc altogether, much less create a whole class of stims that any one can use. I'm sorry if I'm being dense here (it's not my intention) but I really don't see what you are getting at.

Gift.

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I wasn't for 100% craft removal... never was. I never thought we needed so many meds to do our jobs. My general opinion was to do combo packs instead of 1 for every stat.

It takes a lot of time to get good materials in SWG... especially when rares are out of sequence. I don't mass produce, but I have crates and crates of materials in my houses in case a rare spawn doesn't come up soon... not even good stuff... but just rares so I can make stuff.

Many of the people hare have godawful cr. worth of stuff.

making the schematic takes little time.. But there are materials, power, maintenace cr. etc. the time needed to pay for all of it, just to stay operational... I also count that. It isn't always playing (grinding missions etc. to make cash), many times it is making money just to pay the bills... I dunno about you, but I play games to avoid RL bill paying activities

There is a lot of backend time on crafting in SWG.

-T

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Ah got what you mean now, yes it took me ages of casual collecting to get a good pile of resources, I made lots of mediocre stuff to tide me over on the various hunts etc. I got involved in. Pretty much scraped by, but did it, I kind of felt more of an achievement once I got a small stash up and ready for all my crafting needs though, so I'm ambivalent about losing that aspect of crafting.

Talking about bill paying, that is what I do now, I use the space expansion to earn creds to by the odd resource, or support friends who hunt for me. I can only see this being exacerbated by the moves ahead though. Once established in the current system you could at least sit back and wait for resources to spawn, now I think I'll just be grinding space to pour money into my ground side profession, I'll effectively be loseing time to earn on a regular basis. In short I think this extreme form of dependence isn't a good idea, especially in the absence of an obvious income, couple that with the fact I just don't want to be a BE as it's would be rather like playing my RL job and well I'm not mad keen on this game.

I just wish they weren't so extreme in the restructures, why couldn't we keep crafting with extra requirements for BE components orchef foods (as they seem to be suggesting).

Anyway, thanks for the explanation.

Gift.

I will probably be picking up a different profession (probably an artisan based one) after the CU on my doc alt, from the sounds of it buffs won't be that heavily relied on unless food buffs won't be as good as the 10%-30% buffs.

As for healing in groups, there are plenty of Jedi to do that now, combat medics will have that specific role, and *ta-da* squad leaders will finally have its uses with form-up and retreat and the group bonuses.

Ontop of all that, I enjoy the occasional medpack crafting, having to pick up bio-engineer for that is going to be a little annoying and probably won't leave me enough skillpoints ontop of already having master weaponsmith.

I really am a little worried about the revamp, especially those who enjoy playing as an entertainer and doctor/medic for the social aspect of the game and getting the shaft from the sounds of it.

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Twitchie wrote:

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TarMangani wrote:

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Traigus wrote:


The changes were made to make Doc appealing to traditional MMOG healers, not to the crafter/merchant hybrids most remaining docs seem to be.

I hope that once and for all this will silence ANYONE who says that docs aren't being made to look like EQ, WOW, and other MMOG's...

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QFE

If it truly does get more like WoW or EQ, I'm done with it. I chose SWG primarily for that reason. Aside from the fact I like Star Wars.

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Well, I would say get ready for the worst, and here's why...

I'm a programmer. Have been for over 20 years now.... 12 as a professional. Though I don't code any games, I've read quite a bit about them, and have seen tons of source code for a couple of game engines.

Game engines are extremely difficult to write. If you've paid any attention to the core of some games, you'll already know that such game engines as the Doom engine was used for many other games, just licensed out.

For a business like SOE who has more than one MMORPG, it makes great economic sense to use the same engine for both games. As a gamer, I don't really like the idea. The core of SWG, at least I thought, was pretty nice. I do agree that some mechanics were a bit off and needed fixed. A company like SOE isn't providing SWG because we like it... they do it because there's profit in it. And there's a lot more profit in supporting one engine rather than two.

FWIW...

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pircio wrote:

first off i want to say that reading the 80 replies that amassed since i started this and left for the weekend was not easy, but i did it, and i want to say that there has been some really constructive arguments thus far.

however i need to chime more stuff in

we are going to be needed more often in combat, primarily for state heals and cures. that's not my problem.

we're going to be losing a lot of crafting that we have now. a little closer, but not quite my problem.

if i want to craft i have to spend extra SP's (that I don't have) to almost be able to do what i want to make money (or change my crafting prof). that's going to suck, but still not my biggest problem.

the problem i have is THE REASON TO MASTER DOCTOR.

Currently, when you hit master doc, what do you get?

wound treatment and speed +25

med use +10

and 11 schematics, which are all going to be gone

we have no master doc ability, no awesome thing that says "hey, since i'm master i can do this." sure, cure disease packs need a 91+ mu, unless they're experimented down. but once buffs are gone that's it.

the dev's need to give us a reason to master, because unless they do, you'll see a lot of 4040 docs (or some such combination), and no reason to become master.

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There are a lot of things we don't know yet about the CU, and some of your questions can't be answered because of that.

...if i want to craft i have to spend extra SP's (that I don't have)...
The jury's still out. Nobody has said anything other than SP requirements will change for some professions.

...Currently, when you hit master doc, what do you get?

wound treatment and speed +25

med use +10

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Obata wrote:

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I8TheWorm wrote:
I wasn't here before buffs, so I don't know what kind of tips docs recieved for stateheals/rez's in combat groups...

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I was.. The answer is, none. Knowing some details that weren't released yet, I don't expect to see that change.

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I was here then, and what Obata said is the unvarnished truth. Back in the days before buffing was a money-making deal, Docs were incredibly poor. People expected me to craft stims, wound-packs & rez packs, heal them or rez them for free, and be happy about it -- which basically left me unable to buy even the simplest pistol without relying on the generosity of friends who bought stuff for me out of pity. We were lucky to get a tip from anyone -- even when we were sitting the med center solely for the benefit of those who needed to be healed.

[edited to fix typo]

Message Edited by Earymi on 03-22-2005 01:46 PM

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Earymi wrote:

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Obata wrote:

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I8TheWorm wrote:
I wasn't here before buffs, so I don't know what kind of tips docs recieved for stateheals/rez's in combat groups...

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I was.. The answer is, none. Knowing some details that weren't released yet, I don't expect to see that change.

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I was here then, and what Obata said is the unvarnished truth. Back in the days before buffing was a money-making deal, Docs were incredibly poor. People expected me to craft stims, wound-packs & rez packs, heal them or rez them for free, and be happy about it -- which basically left me unable to buy even the simplest pistol with relying on the generosity of friends who bought stuff for me out of pity. We were lucky to get a tip from anyone -- even when we were sitting the med center solely for the benefit of those who needed to be healed.

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Additionaly, since we were not the damage dealers (too busey healing) we were not the first to /lootall so we did not get the loot. The new loot system (which I have done little testing of) my fix this issue.