Doctor Archive
Thread: CM's Nerfed, now it's our turn...
Sevardos wrote:Now it's OUR turn? Are you daft? Few fries short of a happy meal?You're calling a nerf on the entire player base - all combat professions - NOT Doctors. This won't affect Docs one bit because no matter what they do to buffs, players will still want and need buffs.Think first... then type.Just for the record, I think the rebalance is a good thing. Was just commenting on the idiotic inference that this would be a Doctor nerf and not a community nerf.
It seems I've put a lot more thought into this than you. As everyone has pointed out, buffs (along with armor, as everyone knows) have essentially ruined PvE and PvP. The point of a change to buffs is so that they won't be so overwhemingly powerful that they negate the need for doctors and CM's in combat to heal people, as everyone has clearly pointed out. Changing buffs to a % of base stats rather than than a flat increase will give a variety to stats, make players choose which stats they beef up and which ones are vulnerable, and make PvP viable again. There will once again be a need for healers both in PvE and PvP again.
The nerf on CM's was a nerf for the whole playerbase too. There have been no legitimate complaints against CM's, the only complaints were results of a screwed up HAM system which was partially caused by Doctors. Buffs are so extremely overpowered that no one bothers to target Health or Action, is pointless. The only chance to kill someone is by taking out their mind, because of Bufffs and Armor. This caused the misconception that Poisons and Diseases were overpowered when in fact they weren't, as evidenced by the fact that every complaint was against Mind poinson/disease and never once against Action or Health poison.
Bringing down the power of buffs will stabalize the game, promoting healthy combat, and giving versatility and choice in tactics. Quite frankly, I'm tired of being the major cause of ruin to the game and then having the aftereffects brought down on our healing cousins, the CM's.
Buffpack A - increase of 25% of base stat
Buffpack B - increase of 50% of base stat
Buffpack C - increase of 100% of base stat
Buffpack D - increase of 200% of base stat. (With perfect experimentation)
With clothes, food and droid getting to 225%. (with perfect packs or janta blood)
My main concern is instant death from high level mobs. It's already happening with Nighsister Elders. Elders are using stun batons, which bypass a lot of armor. The result is someone taking 5k damage and being incapped and killed before anyone can twitch a finger to help. I don't want this. This too defeats the purpose the medical profession.
I'd be OK with a buff and armor change, but not if that means everyone dies before I can heal them. Tanks have to be able to tank for more than a second, or we'll be back at PETWARS cause only a 20k creature can stand up to anything.
- Bayland
Bayland wrote:
My main concern is instant death from high level mobs. It's already happening with Nighsister Elders. Elders are using stun batons, which bypass a lot of armor. The result is someone taking 5k damage and being incapped and killed before anyone can twitch a finger to help. I don't want this. This too defeats the purpose the medical profession.
I'd be OK with a buff and armor change, but not if that means everyone dies before I can heal them. Tanks have to be able to tank for more than a second, or we'll be back at PETWARS cause only a 20k creature can stand up to anything.
This is two excellent points. I am still trying to figure out how I really feel about it.
In one aspect, making it so that there are just certain really really high level content that you just cannot complete without someone in the group getting killed is good for Doctors.
I figured the way things will eventually settle is that in newbie planets, anyoneveteran combat professioncan pretty much solo everything as long as they have full armor and full buff.
At higher end planets like yavin or deathomir, no one will be able to solo anything except for perhaps Jedi Knight. But any size group should be able to do reasonable level mission with any doctor or CM.
At really high content, like highest level mission from advanced planet, it would definately require a full time healer, but CM should be the healer of a choice since they can heal lot more damage than doctors. Basically things should be hard, but if everyone in the group knows what they are doing and things are organized, no one should be getting killed.
At highest content, like dungeons, NS or Krayt, Doctors should be a must since no matter how good the group is, some one will always get killed eventually.
Now second point you brought up, that this might return us to the days of Pokemon is also a important point. To that affect I think leaving the buff for primary stats to current value is a good idea. Combine that with armors (after nerf), it should give defensive combatant same tanking ability as pets.
Now only problem with this, high HAM players/pet taking lot of damage constantly, is that if Dev over do it, it would make any healer beside mater Doc/CM useless as well as making Jedi not only reasonablechoice in PvP, but also the only reasonable choice for solo PvE.
But I'm sure Dev will solve this small problem. Thats why they get the big bucks.
Ipseck wrote:
its not just buffs that are over-powered, but healing in general. Anyone who spends 15-25 skill points in medic can heal themselves nearly indefinately. A novice medic alone can heal over 1400+ points of damage in a single shot (700+ health and action). That's 2 full unbuffed ham bars, with just a novice starting profession.
Now combine the ability to heal 2 entire buffed stats with the ability to heal every state in the game, and you get a nearly invincible opponent.
Every other profession has its counter.. Jedi-melee, Riflemen-kd/dizzy, pistoleer/fencer-intimidate, melee-ranged kiting, cm-doc...
Now what's the counter to a doc? How do you stop one? As it stands the only way to combat one is to target their mind, which is a design flaw and a weekness everyone has. What happens when the mind is removed as a targetable pool?
I fully agree with that.
Not only buff are overpowered but heal too.
In the current state of the game, a doc, even unbuffed, is the closest thing to immortality, if you know what you're doing.
Perhaps if someone was suggesting that doctor buffs be removed from the game, you might be entitled to make that point. But what's being suggested here is a change of buffs from a static amount to a percentage of your stats. You'll still need them, and you'll still need avian meat to craft them - so please drop the stupid anti-nerf attitude and ridiculous overreactions.
Obeewana_Doobie wrote:
So should I give up collecting the great avian that spawned on Dathomir for my alt?
Whoaaa there fella. I was just wondering, as my Doc is just getting into the swing of making really good stuff, will I be wasting my time and should I just concentrate on making quality stim, wound packs etc..... No need to get all up tight.
MorvenDee wrote:
Perhaps if someone was suggesting that doctor buffs be removed from the game, you might be entitled to make that point. But what's being suggested here is a change of buffs from a static amount to a percentage of your stats. You'll still need them, and you'll still need avian meat to craft them - so please drop the stupid anti-nerf attitude and ridiculous overreactions.
Obeewana_Doobie wrote:
So should I give up collecting the great avian that spawned on Dathomir for my alt?
Lexy wrote:
Sevardos wrote:
Now it's OUR turn? Are you daft? Few fries short of a happy meal?
You're calling a nerf on the entire player base - all combat professions - NOT Doctors. This won't affect Docs one bit because no matter what they do to buffs, players will still want and need buffs.
Think first... then type.
Just for the record, I think the rebalance is a good thing. Was just commenting on the idiotic inference that this would be a Doctor nerf and not a community nerf.
It seems I've put a lot more thought into this than you. As everyone has pointed out, buffs (along with armor, as everyone knows) have essentially ruined PvE and PvP. The point of a change to buffs is so that they won't be so overwhemingly powerful that they negate the need for doctors and CM's in combat to heal people, as everyone has clearly pointed out. Changing buffs to a % of base stats rather than than a flat increase will give a variety to stats, make players choose which stats they beef up and which ones are vulnerable, and make PvP viable again. There will once again be a need for healers both in PvE and PvP again.
The nerf on CM's was a nerf for the whole playerbase too. There have been no legitimate complaints against CM's, the only complaints were results of a screwed up HAM system which was partially caused by Doctors. Buffs are so extremely overpowered that no one bothers to target Health or Action, is pointless. The only chance to kill someone is by taking out their mind, because of Bufffs and Armor. This caused the misconception that Poisons and Diseases were overpowered when in fact they weren't, as evidenced by the fact that every complaint was against Mind poinson/disease and never once against Action or Health poison.
Bringing down the power of buffs will stabalize the game, promoting healthy combat, and giving versatility and choice in tactics. Quite frankly, I'm tired of being the major cause of ruin to the game and then having the aftereffects brought down on our healing cousins, the CM's.
I see reading comprehension is also a challenge for you. If you read the last line of my post- and I know, you probably need to sound it out first when reading so take your time - I said; "I support the rebalance"
It's fools like you who cry nerf first and then don't think of the consequences that gets on my nerves. The changes to CM do NOT impact every single combat profession in the game ... unless it's PVP and PVP is a small % of the overall player base. However, buffs will. And not just Docs ... every ... single ... profession! In fact, Doctors would be the least impacted by it.
And no, it will not have negative impacts to earning potential (or marginal impact) as a Doc because no matter what the rebalance is ... now read the next part carefully sparky and sound it out if you have to ... the player base will still want buffs!! Why? Because it's still a damn buff!
You want more of a challenge now?Fine - go fight unbuffed and get all the challenge you want. The issue with the combat balance is NOT JUST BUFFS. It's how it conspires with all the other elements like armour, food, etc. So stop calling a nerf on just one element and support initiatives that BALANCE IT FOR ALL.
Sick of fools calling for blind nerfs.
The simple fact is buffs have ruined the game (in conjunction with other aspects of the game). It has been almost a year since anyone has even considered attacking the Health or Action pool of a target because it's completely futile. I like how your only solution to the problem is "Well, don't get buffed!". That's the lamest thing I've ever heard. In fact, everyone who complained about CM's should have just taken your illogical advice, "Well, if you don't want to be poisoned, don't pvp!" It's totally ridiculous.
However, I do like the fact that when you disagree with someone you resort to vicious attacks on their character and intelligence, rather than providing substance to your opinion. I know you like being all powerful, but that's exactly what is ruining this game.