Development Cycle Archive

Thread: In Concept 1-1: Combat Roles; Bounty Hunter

DHUScreed
Thu Jan 22, 2004 10:39 pm
#105

What defines theBounty Hunterrole in combat?


Bounty Hunters need to be self sufficient, superb combat fighters.


What basic combat elements should they possess?


The abilities to control their targets states, and quickly subdue them.


What offensive abilities?


A wide range of skills to stun,dizzy, confuse, knockdown, intimidate and target any pool they desire.


What defensive abilities?


Little if any, they are all offense. At master a +30-+40 to Counter Attack would be nice (I dabbled cabineer to get +40 Counter Attack and I dont see a sufficient enough change in attacks missed for it to be a big issue.) Have Counter attack WORK also, maybe if you counter attack a shot your opponant is dealt maybe 50% of the dmg it would have dealt to you if you hadn't countered it.


The only thing I have trouble understanding is, if we are the masters of changing states, shouldnt we know how to defend against them also? Some +defenses vs blind, dizzy, knockdown etc would be nice. I just dont like hitting a TKM with FKD and have em get right back, up when im knocked down and dizzied I stay down for 20+ seconds.


What unique abilities?


Give each weapon a specific role in the Bounty Hunters combat line. Pistol should be able to target all 3 pools specifically through the use of skills. Carbine should be the weapon we use to change the state of our target. LLC should be a heavy hitting weapon that targets a random pool.



Should add what advantage or asset in group combat?


A group hunting creatures, we would do very little to help. A group hunting NPC's or PC's, we woud be able to control the states of the targets.


How could/should they interact with other professions?


Jedi and smuggler we would take contracts on. Armorsmiths, weaponsmiths and DE's would supply us with the needed arsenal. If player traps are ever implemented than Combat Medics could make us poisons to use in our traps.


What interaction / dependencies should exist with other combatants?


Other combatants should fear us in a 1v1 fight, and should only confront us in a group of 2 or more where they would be able to take us out w/o much trouble.


What should be their unique role in the Galactic Civil War?


Other posters had great ideas along the lines of, if a high ranking imperial/rebel player kills "x" # of imperial/rebel players in "x" amount of time they would get a contract put out on them.



As it is now, we just cannot stand toe to toe with any other elite combat profession due to several things;


1.) Our state changing specials do not "stick"


2.) Several specials justdont work, or are not cost efficient in battle.Examples: Bleed; does hardly any damage in PvE your lucky if you can get a 70 point bleed on a target, in PvP your lucky to get a 15 point bleed on your target. Underhand shot; Just isnt cost efficient in battle,costs 200+ HAM and you pray that the knockdown is effective. Fast Blast; To make it worse its a Master skill and as it does good dmg (Ive hit NPC's for 2300 dmg with it) BUT it divides it along all 3 health pools making it a useless skill.


3.)Our inability to dabble is, IMO, our most handicapping problem. To obtain MBH it costs a total of 217 skill points leaving us with 15 skill points to dabble with. Last night I tried going w/o novice medic and it didnt work out to well, so theres another 15/33 skill points gone to just be able to stay alive in a fight leaving me with a measley 16 skill points to dabble with. As I see it, its just not fair. Other professions are able to dabble making their character unique among all the others, Bounty Hunters are forced to be made into a cookie cutter profession b/c we dont have effiecient amounts of skillpoints left to further make our characters unique to our playing style or desires.



Hopefully a dev will read this and not just stop reading after the first 6 pages :smiley-sad:









Screed Herrschaft - Mercenary - "Im just a simple man trying to make his way in a galaxy." -Jango Fett

KarameeirSarin
Thu Jan 22, 2004 11:27 pm
#106

Ok. I'd like to change a bit how i am supposed to list ideas for changes to the Bounty Hunter profession.


- Defenses. Now, as we all know, Bounty Hunters have no defenses whatsoever to practically anything. We get our asses handed to us in PvP. As most do believe that the Bounty Hunter should be good in a 1vs1 fight it isn't really so. The Bounty Hunter uses dirty tricks such as the Smuggler to get a mission done, such as bribing other players into giving the location of a mark, taking its enemy by surprise from afar and such. But when the bounty hunter is faced towards a horde of Body guards, he has no choice but to take them out. I am talking about situations in which the bounty is protected by several people, the big crime lords. So at first change the defenses so we tend to become a little more useful in PvP. Get paid to help out in a fight ?, probably.


-Droids. This is an idea i had for quite some time, i already posted as well. Implementing a system in which after the release of the droids, the Bounty Hunter would get the control of the seeker droids vision. The bounty Hunter seeks the Bounty through the droid. This is a good way to make it kinda hard for us to find our bounty but in a sense where we bump into our mark by luck. After releasing the Droid, the droid is located on the planet in which the Bounty is and from there on we control the seeker droid and seek out the bounty, if we decide to *get out* from the droids vision well the droid blows up. This adds so much to the star wars feeling, because if you do implement player bounties, when a player is walking by and just sees this droid watching him hes going to be like **edit**? have i done something wrong or something, and he ponders about his existence. It adds Stealth into the game, be discreet when trying to find your bounty. The droid could be used in so many different things, stalking a bounty in which you could set a trap. Please consider this.


-LLC. This isn't probably going to be well digested. But i was thinking about adding a wound type for the llc. The flamethrower in the commando profession has a special ability which sets the target on fire. It would be cool if our llc could be used in a similar way. Where we, have a special ability that either paralyzes the target for 10 seconds(electric shock or something), or lowers their defenses for 10 seconds. Or, it could be used as a high damaging attack which gives a Dot, showing jolts of electricity around the player from time to time. Its just an idea, but we need something to actually live up in PvP. Fear us god damnit!


-Repuation. Hey look its a bh, would you like to duel?. Heck, when's the last time someone was actually afraid of us. The only time someone was afraid of me was when my friend put a bounty on a noob for being disgusting towards his wife and he actually was afraid of me. For one moment, it was priceless and it felt like Bh was a cool profession. The rest, well pfft. We should be feared, believe it or not, a Bounty Hunter is feared throughout the galaxy because he acts like justice, but responds to how much you are willing to pay for justice. Wherever you are, a bounty hunter could be watching you and might kill you. This comes in with the Player bounties. Now that everyone knows about the God like templates, isn't it a bit annoying that by the time the player bounties come out, we wont stand a chance of fighting against them. Hey look, its Jarek, a pistoleer/tkm, hmm....... Bh missions should have risks, but i bet all of the players will be prepared.


- Open your eyes. Im not the only one suggesting new and immersive Ideas devs. Why don't you drop by the Bh forums from time to time. Just earlier i read an amazing idea as to implement a Bounty Hunters guild faction in-game. I don't remember who it was though, but if you check it out it will be sure make alot of us happy. The Bounty Hunters guild of course SHOULD be in-game ,since it does follow continuity. Its kinda sad things that do add alot to fun and star wars feeling have been left out.


Anyways, just my 2 cents, good luck with Improving Bh, and plz don't screw up.





--Karameeir Sarin-Bounty Hunter
*Fear..Fear is my ally*
Iceman-KG-
Fri Jan 23, 2004 1:24 am
#107

What JEST3R said.





Colonel Iceman-KG-
Black Epsilon Ace, RSF Ace
Corsec Pilot
zounds_klaxons
Fri Jan 23, 2004 1:37 am
#108

i would like to add that while i think BHs should have the ability to track NPC and PC bounties, it should differ from ranger tracking in three significant ways

1) BHs would use droids, while the rangers use their knowledge of the environment

2) BHs would be able to track things over a much larger distance

3) BHs must first obtain a bio signature of their prey



Zounds Klaxons
Kettemoor

All the dead ghosts of rock and roll
Are gonna follow you wherever you go
-Boushh-
Fri Jan 23, 2004 2:46 am
#109

*) What defines the Bounty Hunter role in combat?

Master of light ranged weapons. I love the LLC but
the rifle is probably better suited. Or reduce the
three seperate weapon trees, make them one featuring
pistols, rifle, carbine, LLC. Create two new trees
for seperate skills.

*) What basic combat elements should they possess?

This is fine where it's at.

*) What offensive abilities?

Nothing above what is already provided. Bounty Hunter's need some
kind of challenge so don't increase anything here.

*) What defensive abilities?

Dodge and counter-attacks that are unmatched.

*) What unique abilities?

Invisibilty on the radar at all times. Or add a skill that
makes you invisible for a limited amount of time. Call it stalking
and make it last 2 minutes.

*) Should add what advantage or asset in group combat?

Bounty Hunters should be solo combatants. Don't want anything changed.

*) How could/should they interact with other professions?

Many players have to go to a certain profession for help or to gain
something. No one ever goes to a Bounty Hunter for anything.
I like it that way.

*) What interaction / dependencies should exist with other combatants?

No preference here. MAYBE a bonus of some sort depending on
how many Bounty Hunters you are grouped with at a given time.
Adding a non-Bounty Hunter to the group takes away the bonus
until the player is removed. Volley Fire would be good here.

*) What should be their unique role in the Galactic Civil War?

May not join either faction. Bounty Hunters care about money.
Leave it at that.
-Boushh-
Fri Jan 23, 2004 2:55 am
#110

Sorry, just wanted to add:

I appreciate the fact that Bounty Hunter is a difficult profession to rise to/through.
But I'd like to see that Exploration I-IV be the only requirement from the scout tree.
MBH costs us enough points and we can't toy with anything else too much. Would be nice
to make the requirements master marksman, and a choice of master pistoleer, master carbineer, or master rifleman.

Bounty Hunters want to express themselves by making themselves unique each with their
own choice of skills.
crimsonkhan
Fri Jan 23, 2004 3:51 am
#111





In an attempt to refine my thoughts on the Bounty Hunter profession I offer these suggestions.


Remove Light Laser Cannon from the the Bounty Hunter profession specializations and replace it with "Tricks of the Trade".


This how the four Bounty Hunter specialization lines should look;


Investigation I, II, III, IV



Using droids to track down prey is a fantastic idea. At rank Master Bounty Hunter a"seeker" droidALWAYS find it mark and within a very reasonable amount of time anywhere on the planet the seeker is released. Once found the marks coordinates are thendownloaded tothe Bounty Hunters datapad.

Offer Master Bounty Hunters an option, using the radial menu, to "scan" wether or not that player character has a bounty.

Collecting bounties can adversly affect your faction standing if applicable, and Bounty Hunters can have bounties placed on them as well.


Bounty Hunter Carbine I, II, III, VI



In this specialization offer the Bounty Huntercarbine accuracy,carbine speed ranged combat defensesadjustments andMEDIUM (more on this later)leveldamage special attacks. BTW Carbine weapons should always have an armor piercing rating of medium (maybe a MBH only carbine with high armor piercing).


Bounty Hunter Pistol I, II, III, IV



As per Bounty Hunter Carbine. Pistols(except for maybe a MBH only pistol) should have NO armor piercing capabilities.


Tricks of the TradeI, II, III, IV



This specialization is where the Bounty Hunter professions capabilities shine. In this line of specialzation a bounty huntergains generic, non-lethal special attacks that can be used with pistol or carbines. Non-lethalspecial attacks include but are not limited to stun, dizzy, blind, knockdown, snare, deafen, and ionize etc. whichcanrender their targetincapacitated indefinately.

In this specialization the bounty hunter is given further accuracy and speed adjustments to carbines and pistols, as well asranged combat defenses.


In my mind a Bounty Hunters role is two-fold. While a bouny hunter can be called upon to be an assassin, other timesa bounty hunteris called upon to capture his quarry alive. In SWG there are two combat hybrid professions, Commando's and Bounty Hunter's. In an attempt to further define "roles" for profession's in SWG I have come to the conclusion that a Commando is the master damage, while theBounty Hunter is the master of passive aggression. This non-lethal mastery comes at the expense of not having high damage special attacks and poor melee defenses.





Talos Darksun, Expert Bounty Hunter

linawindsong
Fri Jan 23, 2004 5:02 am
#112


What defines theBounty Hunterrole in combat?


excelent hunters of people cunning and able to captur eor kill they prey


What basic combat elements should they possess?


well to behonest not all bounty hunters were gunslingers. so you gota think maye this bh was pistol type or this one used sword or something there are all types bounty hunters and such should be choice of styles


What offensive abilities?


capable of crippling an ones prey or hendering him from escaping


What defensive abilities?


to be honest bh that are master wll have survied several fights and death matchs so some sort of counter attack or dodge possibly or atleast defenses to stuff a bounty hunter can do since we know those skills


What unique abilities?


traps work on npc or pc to trap them for a bounty or delay there ability or escape


Should add what advantage or asset in group combat?


ability to track npc or pc / ability to lay down fire and hender escape's and such of npc or cripple there defenses by giving them neg modifer to abilitys


How could/should they interact with other professions?


should be able to take bountys on over players and stand good chance of killing a player if they set trap or get drop on them


What interaction / dependencies should exist with other combatants?


they shouldnt be healers


What should be their unique role in the Galactic Civil War?


possibly used as take bounties to bring in a imp or reb upon them being known or comiting acks aginst over side or to kill them for one of sides




Prince Howling Windtalker
Master Bounty Hunter Of Valycn
Kaim_Mytac
Fri Jan 23, 2004 9:22 am
#113



What defines theBounty Hunterrole in combat?


Fear. Plain and simple. Like a squad of Stormtroopers bursting into a cantina would send an uncertain shiver into everyone present, so should that of the lone-wolf Master Bounty Hunter. Imagine the RL feeling as you are driving your car down the road and a police cruiser slides in behind you. You know you haven't done anything wrong, yet you still feel that unmistakeable tickle of uncertainty to the future of the moment. It isn't until the police cruiser has gone do you even begin to calm down to normal (and that's just with a low level Patrol Officer!). Bobba Fett did very littlle interacting with others, but just his presence, the lone stance at the back the room, was all that was needed to give off the unavoidable aura of a deadly andunpredictable danger. Moreover, as far as SWG role-playing professions, none should touch that of Bounty Hunter. There is none of this in the game currently.


A player that has reached the level of Master Bounty Hunter should have the ability to hit HARD.They should haveUNIQUEMaster Bounty Hunter Specials that WORK and givesuch a deadly OFFENSIVESTRIKE advantage that would any others others pause.ONLY aMaster Bounty Huntershould bea Jedi Hunter, and being such, should have the ability to hammer down on those that don't have the same power as that of a hunted Jedi. Why should an ElitePistoleer or Taras Kasi Master, who hasn't hadto spend near the same time orskill pts, be able toownthe Elite HYBRID Master Bounty Hunter?


Two-Hundred & Seventeenskill pts. invested.Time and dedication given to a very non-to dynamic levelling tree. Patience with the many "glitches," that aresimplyaccepted asstandard operating procedure by the veteran MBH's. And, what does this add up to?Ridicule by TKAs, Pistoleers, Carbineers,Riflemen, andany of the other Elite Combat skill dabblers that canOWN the MBH99%of the time. Template manipulaters that giggle atthe inabilityofthe MBHbaseskills to stand toe to toe with anythem; even ifthe MBHhave usedtheir last 33 skill pts to try to increasetheir insufficientbase skills totry and even the PvP playing field.It is always amusing to watchtheoft occuring incident of the OVERT TarasKasiMaster/Pistoleer/Smuggler Dabbler (or one of the other UBERtemplates)in front ofthe Coronet Starport easily slayingthe waves of oncoming aggressors thatare foolhardy enough to wade into the fight. As it stands,there isn't a MBHon anySWG server that has even contimplated somthing even close to that.


What basic combat elements should they possess?


Swiftly powerful and accurate offensive abilities. The Master Bounty Hunter has spent most of their time in combat and this should be reflected in their attacks. As the MBH's time has also been spent learning the talents of patience, stealth, andtactics to"set-up" their Target, the MBH should have some advantage over some of the wildly high defenses that most other combat PC's have.


What offensive abilities?


Massive and threatening. The MBH should possess the ability to wield their arsenal with devastating effect. As mentioned, the Master Bounty Huntershould bethe master of offensive power and and tactics.


What defensive abilities?


There should be some limited defensive ability that comes from the huge amount of combat training they have, but this is definately NOT a forte for the Master Bounty Hunter. One on One, they should win almost everytime, but against a focusedgroup, the MBH better have /burstrun hotkeyed. Their defense should arise mainly from the use of tactics and their knowlege of armor and low level medical skills. As a Master Bounty Hunter, Bobba Fett spent years tinkering with his personalized Mandolorian outerwear to give himself every defensive advantage to compliment his huge offensive talent. This should take time,and is something that everyMBH should aslways be trying to better.Just like a smart MBH is always looking to upgrade their favorite toolsforattack,so should they be made to seek out the means to make their defense better.As for medicalknowledge, the supreme amount of time thatthe solitaryMBH had to spend levelling his Master Scout and Investigation trees should have at least taught him the BASICS of immediate, in-battle first aid (e.g., simple Stim B HAM treatment application).


What unique abilities?


Probably the most important ability a Master Bounty Hunter shouldhave is the ability hide the fact that they are Master Bounty Hunters.AnMBH needs to be able tomask the fact thatthey are huntingother humanoids in a forum where other humanoids haveimmediate access to /examine anyone they please. In addition, the MBH should be able to TRACK their humanoid targets.I realize that this may be a Droid-Bug issue, but it is a major drawback toMBHs the way it stands now. The Master Bounty Hunter should also be able to hunt down non-Jedi PC bounties. An in-game system needs to be devised (a THIRD FACTION, perhaps?). I realize that some SWG Servers have come up with their own format for non-Jedi PC bounties, but they are haphazard and weak. SWG should have a formal system in place. Finally, there should be an option for a Master Bounty Hunter to belong to a THIRD faction (e.g., Bounty Hunter's Guild). If Bounty Hunters are considered the SCUM of the Universe, should they not have the ability to hunt, and be hunted by, both Rebel and Imperial Factions in the GCW (this isan optionthat should be available to every profession IMHO). As it stands,the most useless PC inSWG is the Rebel alligned PCwho has just trainedup to Master Bounty Hunter.


Should add what advantage or asset in group combat?


Just their deadly offensive power. A MBH is essentially a solo player. They can belong to a guild and offtimes chat, raid,and hunt with their in-game buddies. But at the end of the day, the MBH should be all about the solo game. The whole time spent getting to MBH is mainly solitary, so why should that change after they've got there. The GAME needs to find a way to make getting to MBH not be the end of the path, but the beginning of a more exciting and dynamic one (not everyone is grinding holocrons).


How could/should they interact with other professions?


The interaction with other professions is the key to becoming the best MBH one can be. Doctors and Dancersfor buffs and heals, Chefs for stat improving food and drink, Smugglers for the naughty stuff, DEs / Armor / Weaponsmiths for the very best they can get...the list is endless. It is the main price of choosingthe solitary life of the MBH. The MBH has the difficult task of having to search out and find all of the many and diverse tools it takes to be successful in the Bounty Hunting profession. Furthermore, if a non-Jedi PC bounty system is ever implimented, the interaction of the MBH with other PCs would expand substantially.


What interaction / dependencies should exist with other combatants?


Thisneeds to be made clear. Fighting with other combatants only diverts the attention of the target(s) from the MBH. Thereshouldn'tbe anymore advantage than that. As mentioned, the MBH is THE solo PC of SWG. Their whole career is geared towards being able to to handle themselves, by themselves, in any situation (at least it's supposed to be). This is why MBH should NOTBE ALLOWEDtouse pets or attack droids in anybattle, PvE or PvP,to TANK for them. This is supremely against what being a MBH is about. A true bounty hunter with the proper skills and attributes (which they don't possess as of yet) is not going to waste time or threaten their precious anonymity by have a noisy pet or a cumbersome attack droid follow them around. No, an MBH needs only the powers, tools, and tacticsthey possess unto themself.


What should be their unique role in the Galactic Civil War?


Their unique role in the GWC should be that they should be able TO FIGHT FOR WHATEVER SIDE PAYS THE MOST. Forcing a MBH to take a side just to participate in the GCW, essentially, negates the ability to pursue their chosen profession to anyone who sympathizes with the Rebellion. A MBH who select to become a Rebel can't do their job as a Jedi hunter - so, all Bounty Hunters have to be Imperials? It even sounds silly as I write it. The way it stands, any Rebel MBH has nothing to do until some Dark Jedi Knights/Master PCs start poping up, and by then, how the heck are the MBHs supposed to have a chance against them? The "Two Faction GCW" format uniquely effects the gameplay of the those in the MBH profession; therefore, a unique GCW fix for the MBH profession should be implimented. Hence, the introduction of a THIRD BOUNTY HUNTER'S GUILD FACTION should exist to expand the GCW to all who wish to participate.A BH could still choosetol join either Rebel or Imperial Factions, but by having a THIRD OPTION for a MBH would give those (and I would assume it would be most) the option of being true to their calling. A bounty hunter is a killer for hire, and they should be for hire by anybody who is willing to pay their price.




------------------------------------------------------
Kaim Mytac

"A good death does honor to a whole life."
Crash752
Fri Jan 23, 2004 10:04 am
#114


What defines theBounty Hunterrole in combat?
They should be the master of one on one combat. Versus one target the bounty hunter should have the upperhand.


What basic combat elements should they possess?
They should have the tools and abilities to adapt to any combat situation.


What offensive abilities?
A wide range of offensive ablities to be able to adapt to any combat situation.


What defensive abilities?
If they are given stronger offensive ablities then defenses could remain minimal.


What unique abilities?
The ability to track other players with seeker droids and to hunt other players.


Should add what advantage or asset in group combat?
A bounty hunter should be able to adapt to any combat situation.


How could/should they interact with other professions?
By hunting them or by using them as informants.


What interaction / dependencies should exist with other combatants?
They shouldn't have any dependencies on other combat professions. A bounty hunter should be able to hold his own in combat.


What should be their unique role in the Galactic Civil War?
Bounty hunters should be give their own faction. Their only interaction with the GCW should be when they are contracted by either rebel or imperial employers to hunt opposing faction players.



Ehon - MBH - Radiant




Overseer
Wepps
Fri Jan 23, 2004 10:05 am
#115


Defensive Templates - and the Death Mark



With the seeming introduction of the Death Mark system, coming shortly in stages, we once more turn to the saga of the Defensive Templates.


There has been talk of these issues being addressed in the combat rework publishes, also this month and following, but it is important to reveal some logical observations which hopefully will allow a better implementation than what is expected at this stage.


1 - ASSUMING that defenses will still stack to a degree, development team must come to realize that ours do not.


Why? Because we have none to achieve. If a person beginning with master Bounty Hunter pursues a purely defensive template, obviously through the Pistoleer skill trees as only those are associated with this profession, then they relegate themselves to inferior firepower as a result.


Again, this is an assumption based upon the premise that defenses will stack to some degree in the future.


By full expenditure of the remaining 33 skill points available into the Pistoleer defenses, the Bounty Hunter sacrifices the offensive output needed to compensate for extremely high ranged defenses of certain templates, which exist as high as +186 to that defense.


Therefore, giving Bounty Hunters defenses equal to or even greater than other single combat professions does not go against the concept that the 'Bounty Hunter sacrifices defenses for a greater offense'. It simply is the limit to which a Bounty Hunter can pursue any defensive possibilities. In comparison, while other combat professions are free to pursue enhanced defensive templates, the Bounty Hunter cannot, due to the lack of skill points available to the Bounty Hunter.


2 - Given the truth of the above statement, each of the remaining combat professions outside of Bounty Hunter, have full ability to pursue those defenses as they see fit, in that any given base master template of the normal 3 ranged professions, Rifleman, Pistoleer, Carbineer, have 158 skill points remaining.


Therefore, it is not a balance based upon the pure template of a given combat profession, but a balance based upon their expenditure of points across a range of professions.


So, a Pistoleer pursuing defenses will often also master TKA, which is not possible to the Bounty Hunter of a master template. Because of this, their total defenses will always far outpace those of the Master Bounty Hunter.


To compensate, then, we require our defenses be boosted significantly.


a - The comparisons to date have been Master Bounty Hunter versus any single profession, when discussing balance issues. However, we are not facing anysingle profession, we are facing ranges of professions, with defenses that allow them survivability over extended combat sequences. Even when facing a Master Bounty Hunter, these stacked defenses will always give the opponent the advantage, in that they allow our opponents the time to react. So, they have time to place effective firepower on the Bounty Hunter target.


b - In contrast,Bounty Hunterdefenses allow no time for reaction, and no time for failure. If a shot misses, we are seconds from losing the fight.


The above two truths (a & b) lead the logical mind into realizing that defenses are everything. Offensive firepower is useless versus a target that, not only is absorbing shot after shot, but is also returning fire versus an opponent that has no defenses to speak of.


This advantage of any given combat template over the Bounty Hunter based template, creates a situation where we are EFFECTIVELY inferior, regardless of what the numbers speak, or the special attack descriptions read.


3 - Special Attacks Repertoire. The Bounty Hunter has had several special attacks reduced for PvP combat, and some removed entirely. These need to be restored fully.


The argument here is based upon the fact that each of the other combat professions has their own special attacks which are fully functional, that match those of the Bounty Hunter. Therefore, it is not the attacks themselves which create the fallacy that Bounty Hunters are overpowered.


For example: TKA and Carbineers have a fully functional knockdown special, useable in PvP combat. The Bounty Hunter knockdowns, however, are completely ineffective and overly expensive in HAM usage. These were removed several months ago in a series of negative patches which nullified the Bounty Hunter's ability to survive in PvP combat.


This disparity between what is considered overpowered for one profession, but perfectly suitable for another, leads to a disparity in combat balance.


4 - All this effects Death Marks. No Bounty Hunters will be accepting Death Mark missions, if their targets are effectively invulnerable to ranged attacks, and are effectively more powerful.


This system, given the current significant imbalances in existence, will serve only to cost the Bounty Hunters time and money. The chances of success of any given Bounty mission drop considerably when considering opponents who have defenses in the ranges in which they exist, opponents having powerful attacks that are not reduced in PvP, and Bounty Hunter attacks that are reduced in PvP.


This situation causes the Bounty Hunter community to avoid PVP contact to a great degree. Simply adding Death Marks to an unbalanced system will not solve any gameplay issues that the Bounty Hunter community currently is experiencing, because it will lead the Bounty Hunter community back into an unbalanced system with negative results.


Without balance, the Bounty Hunters will not take part, and time and resources will have been wasted. Therefore, I recommend that balance issues are more fully discussed, given the facts presented above, before implementing a system that cannot hope to succeed.





------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"And those that pray for dew at the desert's edge - shall bring forth the deluge." - Dune, The Preacher

Live from Tikrit


Josue15
Fri Jan 23, 2004 10:51 am
#116

Wow, Kaim_Mytacyou hit BH right on the head!


I like your post and I agree with your definations of a Master Bounty Hunter.


The only thing I like to add is the ability for a Bounty Hunter to use Snares, Darts and Traps on their Marks.

We see through out the Star Wars Movies where the Fetts used Them.


Darts (Like in Clone Wars)


Should have the ability to Disease or Poisona Mark


Snares (Like we saw Boba do against Luke in RotJ and His dad against Obi'wan in Clone Wars)


Should have ability to Restrain their Mark ; reduce the Targets Combat and Defense Abilities.


Traps


Would allow a Bounty Hunter to bring in his target alive for more Credits ( This should be add in our BH mission.)


Like we saw in the Movies are time The Empire and Jabba wanted their Bounty back alive.


_______________________________________________________________________________________




What defines theBounty Hunterrole in combat?


Fear. Plain and simple. Like a squad of Stormtroopers bursting into a cantina would send an uncertain shiver into everyone present, so should that of the lone-wolf Master Bounty Hunter. Imagine the RL feeling as you are driving your car down the road and a police cruiser slides in behind you. You know you haven't done anything wrong, yet you still feel that unmistakeable tickle of uncertainty to the future of the moment. It isn't until the police cruiser has gone do you even begin to calm down to normal (and that's just with a low level Patrol Officer!). Bobba Fett did very littlle interacting with others, but just his presence, the lone stance at the back the room, was all that was needed to give off the unavoidable aura of a deadly andunpredictable danger. Moreover, as far as SWG role-playing professions, none should touch that of Bounty Hunter. There is none of this in the game currently.


A player that has reached the level of Master Bounty Hunter should have the ability to hit HARD.They should haveUNIQUEMaster Bounty Hunter Specials that WORK and givesuch a deadly OFFENSIVESTRIKE advantage that would any others others pause.ONLY aMaster Bounty Huntershould bea Jedi Hunter, and being such, should have the ability to hammer down on those that don't have the same power as that of a hunted Jedi. Why should an ElitePistoleer or Taras Kasi Master, who hasn't hadto spend near the same time orskill pts, be able toownthe Elite HYBRID Master Bounty Hunter?


Two-Hundred & Seventeenskill pts. invested.Time and dedication given to a very non-to dynamic levelling tree. Patience with the many "glitches," that aresimplyaccepted asstandard operating procedure by the veteran MBH's. And, what does this add up to?Ridicule by TKAs, Pistoleers, Carbineers,Riflemen, andany of the other Elite Combat skill dabblers that canOWN the MBH99%of the time. Template manipulaters that giggle atthe inabilityofthe MBHbaseskills to stand toe to toe with anythem; even ifthe MBHhave usedtheir last 33 skill pts to try to increasetheir insufficientbase skills totry and even the PvP playing field.It is always amusing to watchtheoft occuring incident of the OVERT TarasKasiMaster/Pistoleer/Smuggler Dabbler (or one of the other UBERtemplates)in front ofthe Coronet Starport easily slayingthe waves of oncoming aggressors thatare foolhardy enough to wade into the fight. As it stands,there isn't a MBHon anySWG server that has even contimplated somthing even close to that.


What basic combat elements should they possess?


Swiftly powerful and accurate offensive abilities. The Master Bounty Hunter has spent most of their time in combat and this should be reflected in their attacks. As the MBH's time has also been spent learning the talents of patience, stealth, andtactics to"set-up" their Target, the MBH should have some advantage over some of the wildly high defenses that most other combat PC's have.


What offensive abilities?


Massive and threatening. The MBH should possess the ability to wield their arsenal with devastating effect. As mentioned, the Master Bounty Huntershould bethe master of offensive power and and tactics.


What defensive abilities?


There should be some limited defensive ability that comes from the huge amount of combat training they have, but this is definately NOT a forte for the Master Bounty Hunter. One on One, they should win almost everytime, but against a focusedgroup, the MBH better have /burstrun hotkeyed. Their defense should arise mainly from the use of tactics and their knowlege of armor and low level medical skills. As a Master Bounty Hunter, Bobba Fett spent years tinkering with his personalized Mandolorian outerwear to give himself every defensive advantage to compliment his huge offensive talent. This should take time,and is something that everyMBH should aslways be trying to better.Just like a smart MBH is always looking to upgrade their favorite toolsforattack,so should they be made to seek out the means to make their defense better.As for medicalknowledge, the supreme amount of time thatthe solitaryMBH had to spend levelling his Master Scout and Investigation trees should have at least taught him the BASICS of immediate, in-battle first aid (e.g., simple Stim B HAM treatment application).


What unique abilities?


Probably the most important ability a Master Bounty Hunter shouldhave is the ability hide the fact that they are Master Bounty Hunters.AnMBH needs to be able tomask the fact thatthey are huntingother humanoids in a forum where other humanoids haveimmediate access to /examine anyone they please. In addition, the MBH should be able to TRACK their humanoid targets.I realize that this may be a Droid-Bug issue, but it is a major drawback toMBHs the way it stands now. The Master Bounty Hunter should also be able to hunt down non-Jedi PC bounties. An in-game system needs to be devised (a THIRD FACTION, perhaps?). I realize that some SWG Servers have come up with their own format for non-Jedi PC bounties, but they are haphazard and weak. SWG should have a formal system in place. Finally, there should be an option for a Master Bounty Hunter to belong to a THIRD faction (e.g., Bounty Hunter's Guild). If Bounty Hunters are considered the SCUM of the Universe, should they not have the ability to hunt, and be hunted by, both Rebel and Imperial Factions in the GCW (this isan optionthat should be available to every profession IMHO). As it stands,the most useless PC inSWG is the Rebel alligned PCwho has just trainedup to Master Bounty Hunter.


Should add what advantage or asset in group combat?


Just their deadly offensive power. A MBH is essentially a solo player. They can belong to a guild and offtimes chat, raid,and hunt with their in-game buddies. But at the end of the day, the MBH should be all about the solo game. The whole time spent getting to MBH is mainly solitary, so why should that change after they've got there. The GAME needs to find a way to make getting to MBH not be the end of the path, but the beginning of a more exciting and dynamic one (not everyone is grinding holocrons).


How could/should they interact with other professions?


The interaction with other professions is the key to becoming the best MBH one can be. Doctors and Dancersfor buffs and heals, Chefs for stat improving food and drink, Smugglers for the naughty stuff, DEs / Armor / Weaponsmiths for the very best they can get...the list is endless. It is the main price of choosingthe solitary life of the MBH. The MBH has the difficult task of having to search out and find all of the many and diverse tools it takes to be successful in the Bounty Hunting profession. Furthermore, if a non-Jedi PC bounty system is ever implimented, the interaction of the MBH with other PCs would expand substantially.


What interaction / dependencies should exist with other combatants?


Thisneeds to be made clear. Fighting with other combatants only diverts the attention of the target(s) from the MBH. Thereshouldn'tbe anymore advantage than that. As mentioned, the MBH is THE solo PC of SWG. Their whole career is geared towards being able to to handle themselves, by themselves, in any situation (at least it's supposed to be). This is why MBH should NOTBE ALLOWEDtouse pets or attack droids in anybattle, PvE or PvP,to TANK for them. This is supremely against what being a MBH is about. A true bounty hunter with the proper skills and attributes (which they don't possess as of yet) is not going to waste time or threaten their precious anonymity by have a noisy pet or a cumbersome attack droid follow them around. No, an MBH needs only the powers, tools, and tacticsthey possess unto themself.


What should be their unique role in the Galactic Civil War?


Their unique role in the GWC should be that they should be able TO FIGHT FOR WHATEVER SIDE PAYS THE MOST. Forcing a MBH to take a side just to participate in the GCW, essentially, negates the ability to pursue their chosen profession to anyone who sympathizes with the Rebellion. A MBH who select to become a Rebel can't do their job as a Jedi hunter - so, all Bounty Hunters have to be Imperials? It even sounds silly as I write it. The way it stands, any Rebel MBH has nothing to do until some Dark Jedi Knights/Master PCs start poping up, and by then, how the heck are the MBHs supposed to have a chance against them? The "Two Faction GCW" format uniquely effects the gameplay of the those in the MBH profession; therefore, a unique GCW fix for the MBH profession should be implimented. Hence, the introduction of a THIRD BOUNTY HUNTER'S GUILD FACTION should exist to expand the GCW to all who wish to participate.A BH could still choosetol join either Rebel or Imperial Factions, but by having a THIRD OPTION for a MBH would give those (and I would assume it would be most) the option of being true to their calling. A bounty hunter is a killer for hire, and they should be for hire by anybody who is willing to pay their price.


_______________________________________________________________________________________




Josue' Thomas Jedi Knight

Click here to support this great Vision of a better FRS to save SWG by Glzmo!
Jedi Robes
Long awaited are the Jedi robes! Gone will be the days of Jedi running about in armor. The Jedi robe will provide a hidden toughness value that will protect the Jedi, similar to armor, but providing more of a Jedi feel. -TH Jedi archive II
ShrissOfTheSands
Fri Jan 23, 2004 11:36 am
#117

What defines the Bounty Hunter role in combat?

*** Their sheer EXPERTISE in a variety of different styles of combat, including a large arsenal of weapons, TRAPS, and GADGETS (see the movies).

They should be the elite of the elite, the cream of the crop, the most FEARED individuals in the galaxy. Why? See the movies. And also use some common sense. Honestly, a person who takes on a job to hunt and kill numerous individuals should be damned good at a number of things, yes?

Oh, and watch the Jango Fett/Obi-Wan fight in Episode II. BH should be so formidable. In short, RECREATE THE INTRIGUE, THE PROFESSIONALISM, THE FEAR, THE ABSOLUTE, WITHOUT A DOUBT SIGNIFICANCE OF A BOUNTY HUNTER THAT IS PRESENT IN THE STAR WARS FILMS.

When players see the title "Master Bounty Hunter", they should be spamming /kowtow.


What basic combat elements should they possess?

Immense accuracy ratings with all their weapons, and a greater arsenal of unique weapons. Player traps as well. (Again, see the movies) Ripcords, gas, darts, jetpacks, etcetera. Go-Go-Gadget-this-and-that.

What offensive abilities?

GOOD versions of the following, because, after all, we ARE bounty hunters in Star Wars lore: Knockdowns, Dizzy, every status effect in the game, STRONG BLEEDS, a MIND BLEED. Poisons: darts. (SEE EPISODE II -- Jango kills Zam with a dart from 100 meters out; make it our "SNIPER SHOT") We need ripcords for keeping enemies still for a duration, poisons to slow them down, poisons to slowly kill them. We need rockets firing from our packs, we need NIGHT VISION (or some sort of special HUD -- see Jango Fett's console game...it was done well...I felt like a true Star Wars bounty hunter).

What defensive abilities?

ANY defense would be nice. A high dodge rate would be fitting for a BH. 100+ And dare I say it, MASTER BOUNTY HUNTERS SHOULD BE GIVEN A QUEST TO COMPLETE TO ATTAIN SPECIAL CUSTOM ARMOR. Allow us to customize it with given restraints, along with the color, decals, etc. Part of being a BH in the Star Wars films is about being UNIQUE. Bounty Hunters running around in full suits of composite makes us all look so generic, it's rather insulting to George Lucas for all the hard work he obviously put into making Bounty Hunters shine in their own individual lights.

What unique abilities?

See above, the EPIC ARMOR idea. Also, player traps. Jetpacks; short bursts of flight. Oh, and give us a wrist-attachment -- a multi-tool of sorts that can be affixed with different status effect traps. In other words, give me a wrist-attachment that I can say, put some poison darts in, fire them off, and then put a ripcord in, and fire that off.

Should add what advantage or asset in group combat?

Unfailing accuracy, hard-hitting damage, and damage variance. But BH should be a solo class anyway.

How could/should they interact with other professions?

We should be on a higher pedestal; plain and simple. Interaction? What exactly do you guys mean? Interaction as in how should we compete with them? Well, we should be wiping the floor with them, for God's sake. If Jango Fett can seriously give Obi-Wan Kenobi, a Jedi Master, a run for his money, common sense would tell me that Jango could rip a smuggler a new hole; or a Teras Kasi Artist; or a rifleman; or a Combat Medic. Give me a break!!!

What interaction / dependencies should exist with other combatants?

None whatsoever. We're bounty hunters. We're solo. You never saw Jango Fett running side by side with a combat medic so he can use Eye Shot to a greater degree.

What should be their unique role in the Galactic Civil War?

Player Bounties, and controlling the Jedi population. And the latter means (pay attention to this, Devs) ...that we need to be ABSOLUTELY FORMIDABLE.



Thank you for your time.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"What we see now is like a dim image in a mirror...then we shall see face to face."

Sephrin Kai
Bounty Hunter
3/4/4/4

The Honored Maidens, Council Member
Page 9 of 26