Development Cycle Archive
Thread: IC 1-4: Combat Roles; Combat Medic
Xytroncore wrote:
So let me get this straight, you guys are all just standing there for about 8 seconds (time it takes a combaty medic to toss 2 packs, then standing there for another 8 seconds while combat medic restacks lol....people who are stupid and just stand there instead of killing the combat medic shouldn't cry nerf, I'm sorry, but you had 16 seconds to find and kill the combat medic.
You're talking like its a single combat medic.
Jaska wrote:
If this was true, Combat Medic would've been flavor of the month a WHILE ago. Why isn't it?
They just managed to fix the problem with CM's disease as well as the adv-comp that gave good chunk of boost to their effectiveness justcouple of months ago.
Ofcourse it was also during period when people weren't creazy about PvP due to decay (which they arefortunately taking it out) so effect weren't very noticeable.
But the "favort of month" effect seem to begetting somenotice by Dev which lead to previous patch of range cap although due to the bughealing stim & poison/disease got mixed.
Now I wouldn't just blow off all this negativety as mere whining and advice like "use tactic" and "get doctor" would help CM as much as they helped CH.
There have been pretty detailed discussion in doctor forum as to why"get a doctor" is pretty empty advice. Themed use lvl of cure poison/disease are just silly, they cost way too much mind to acutally worth it and so on and so forth.
But you are right. If CM aren't over powered, there wouldn't be so many and they would not have big of impact. If there is significant increase in CM, and their impact on combat is not what Dev had in mind, we'll see "balance".
Time will tell.
WildWildMaN wrote:
What defines theCombat Medicrole in combat?
I'd say "Chemical sniper":
- Stealth applying of various states, including DoTs
- Chemical weapon of mass destruction (aka poisons)
- Unique abilities in PvE for fighting heavy armored beasts
"chemical sniper"-love the wording of this, but i completely agree, i would LOVE to see the cm profession move into more combat orientation.
What basic combat elements should they possess?
/applyPoison, /applyDisease, /applyState ??
/applyState-completely agree with this, though a question that arises for me is would these be separate packs, or (as i briefly mentioned earlier) an optional component slot to either make a killer psn/disease, or apply one of a number of states (in addition to base psn/disease dmg)
What offensive abilities?
Nothing in addition to those above. Very deadly profession vs. living creatures (useless against machines/buildings though) but very narrow, one-way fighting.
actually i would like to see some sort of weapon integrated, but with the suggestions made here, i would be willing to make that sacrifice...i do agree that if the prof keeps the similar power that it does, a weapon would be much less needed.
What defensive abilities?
Not a single. Price for being unique offensive power.
I like the idea here, but i would suggest a resist to poisen, as stated by another, you would think that if a person works with deadly chemicals/disease/state alters, ect they would have SOME resist to them
What unique abilities?
The only class that can attack from beyond 64m range. Since CM can attack only living (i.e. movable) beings its ok.
The only class with multiple various area effecting abilities
I like the idea of this, but being as I have heard the cry of nerf so many times i would not suggest a range far beyond 64m. It would have to be something that gives the prof a very unique feel, but something that makes them catchable (eg 75-80m). 100m is completely absurd, although i must admit that being able to throw this far does have a certain apeal...however 100m is around 60% farther than any other prof can fire, so it does not need to be quite that far.
Should add what advantage or asset in group combat?
Idea about turning off friendly fire seems great. Area poisons are extremly powerful, so they need to be limited somehow, making them affecteveryone in the area including friends is ok.
Many classes apply states (dizzy/blind/etc), make Combat Medics ability (statechange pack) to apply states and to heal them (Squad Leaders have this ability, but SL is extinct class)
Add /cover abilities from rifleman tree (andbtw fix it finaly!). This fits very well in idea of stealth chemical fighter.
How could/should they interact with other professions?
- interaction with doctors is ok now.
- interaction with Chef should be interesting, in making resist-improving food
- I'd strongly suggest interaction with BE in creating bio-enhancers. And overall, concider adding "enhancer" slot in combat meds and switch all that **edit** useless Rancor Bile, Donkuwah Poisons etc. to enhancers.***
- Great idea can be modifying weapons to add limited DoT and state-change capabilities.***
What interaction / dependencies should exist with other combatants?
- Combat Medics need defence badly. Very deadly but very vulnerable class (high skill points intensive also, cannot take manydefences from other classes)
- Besides that, CM is stand-alone class. It can fight solo PvP and PvE.
What should be their unique role in the Galactic Civil War?
CMs are main weapon against enemy soldiers. CMs play absolutely no role in fighting droids/turrets/vehicles. CM can be great support to any combat squad.
This definately needs to become more evident. Put simply, When was the last time you heard of someone poisoning your computer?(no, viruses don't count)
Suggested fixes (easy part):
- Reduce Terrain Negotiation for master CMto 15-20. Really, we dont need to have TN at master scout level**, but this is great ability overall and fits into class idea.**
- Rebalance schematics a bit concerning level of Med Use. Currently all good area stuff is on master level, i think every C pack should be there too (assuming it is not experimented for Ease of Use). yes, i also agree that the class needs to be a little less dabble-friendly
- Rebalance schematics conserning power.
Raise the power of A packs significantly. They are utterly useless, with extremly poor range.
Reduce potency - since ARC schematic fix in previous publish, our stuff is UNRESISTABLE. I dont think its right. Before ARC fix with usual RC potency was around 70% and that was a dilemma - experiment power or put some points into potency.
To additionaly quickfix comabt issues and improve PvE, make following:
- increase poisons strength twice, easiest way is in multiplier damage = CM effectiveness X 2, make that "CM eff X 4".
- 75% reduction of PvP damage (total PvPreduction compared to current is 50%, total PvE increase is also 50%).
Not exactly sure if you ment to reduce the current pns/disease 75%, but unless we also getsimilar mods that come along with every other combat class (1.5x base dmg isn't it?) we should not get hit with reducing us 75%.
Suggested fixes (other):
- Revamp /healMind. It is awful now. For more suggestions consult our Correspondent, my favorite is nondamaging (only mind cost, no wounds) DoT-like heal (when applied, it heals mind everytick, 8 seconds, by relatively small amount like 100).********************
- add /takeCover ability from Rifleman tree (but dont forget to fix it before adding)
- add enhancers slots to CM medicines and switch all useless stuff like Rancor Bile and Donkuwah poisons to be enhancers.***************************************
Can't stress this enough, really i would like to see CM as a much more combat class. It should be unique (only one to use chemical warfare), but also have unique weaknesses and tactics associated with it. Truthfully, ranged stims are nice, but if the call of a Field Medic profession would make sense, it would seem appropriate for the area stims (all types) to be moved there and allow the COMBAT medic profession to focus much more on combat tactics
just looking at these numbers, they're a bit high, mostly b/c of the type of xp that they take. I don't know that combat xp is the solution, but possibly Medical combat xp or something along those lines. combat xp is just too hard to get, and it involves lots of PvE, which combat medics are horrible at. the crafting xp is also high, and while i agree that it should probably be higher i don't think it needs to be quite that high-so long to get just500xp.
PsionicHawk wrote:
I've been thinking about the combat medic alot and some ideas have come to mind. The following is one idea of how the combat medic could change.
Master Combat Medic:
Healing Range +25
Combat Med Effectivness +25
Ranged Healing Speed +25
Combat Medicine Use +25
Terrain Negotation +10
Thrown Weapon Speed +10
Thrown Weapon Accuracy +10
Certification: Proton Gernade
Defense against Knockdown +30
Dodge +30
Ranged Defence +5
Melee Defense +5
4th Tier
Master Ranged Distance:
150,000 Combat Exp
Master Ranged Speed:
150,000 Combat Exp
Master Combat Medic Support:
90,000 Medical Exp
Master Combat Med Crafting:
50,000 Crafting Exp
3rd Tier
Expert Ranged Distance:
100,000 Combat Exp
Expert Ranged Speed:
100,000 Combat Exp
Expert Combat Medic Support:
65,000 Medical Exp
Expert Combat Medic Crafting:
37,500 Crafting Exp
2nd Tier
Advanced Ranged Distance:
70,000 Combat Exp
Advanced Ranged Speed:
70,000 Combat Exp
Advanced Combat Medic Support:
40,000 Medical Exp
Advanced Combat Medic Crafting:
25,000 Crafting Exp
Melampus wrote:
I'm the first mCM on kauri and prob one of the first in the galaxy...
Apollo
Master CM, Master Carbinier
First CM? a few questions....
1) does carbineer work that well?
2) when did you get CM?
3) what faction side (if any-imp or reb)?
btw...you're going on my "buddy" list as soon as i get on next
Grozzer (yes i know the login name is different)
DSB
Whether the CM's want to cry, shout Flame whatever. The truth is they ruin the fun of the game as it stands now. I have been a number of different professions, and when it comes to PvP they are rediculously powerful. If they want to keep their posions, let them. But make it so they possibly have a posion rifle or something that has a slow attack speed. But to be able to blindly through a AOE that is uncureable is in no way fair.
Not every raiding team has available a CM to heal their team, and it is a serious unfair advantage. I think it is just bad planning to allow a Novice combat medic start throwing posions around, but yet you have to be 2 boxes up in Doctor before you can even heal poisons?!?
And please don't cry to me about the 169 points that it takes to acquire the skill. If the guy above can be a MCM and a master carbineer, you have the ability and the free points to take on a offensive profession as well. It just seems to me, that this is a case of wanting your cake and eating it too.
Now go ahead and flame me 
Interesting post by TH on DoT.
Check the Dev tracker.
He is talking about Commando's DoT but I think this is their usual way to slipping in changes without making it seems like their are giving into popular demand.
I wouldn't be surprised if some big change are coming to Poison/Disease with the DoT revamp.
Then again they may make em more powerful.
Who knows
Travixius wrote:
Whether the CM's want to cry, shout Flame whatever. The truth is they ruin the fun of the game as it stands now. I have been a number of different professions, and when it comes to PvP they are rediculously powerful. If they want to keep their posions, let them. But make it so they possibly have a posion rifle or something that has a slow attack speed. But to be able to blindly through a AOE that is uncureable is in no way fair.
Not every raiding team has available a CM to heal their team, and it is a serious unfair advantage. I think it is just bad planning to allow a Novice combat medic start throwing posions around, but yet you have to be 2 boxes up in Doctor before you can even heal poisons?!?
And please don't cry to me about the 169 points that it takes to acquire the skill. If the guy above can be a MCM and a master carbineer, you have the ability and the free points to take on a offensive profession as well. It just seems to me, that this is a case of wanting your cake and eating it too.
Now go ahead and flame me
OK you asked for it.
First you say poison is uncureable? How so? Any Doctor that bought the right tree can cure any of my poisons and do it effectively. OK so they cannot keep up with the AoE poisons, and that is why we have said many times that instead of nerfing a combat medic, how about putting something in the game for Doctor's to be able to do mass curing?
I personally think that the current cure's should go to the medic tree, and then give Doctors the ability to AoE cure, and possibly even create innoculation packs that would increase their resistance to poison and disease.
I am struck by how many people just yell nerf this and nerf that, if everyone of you went and cried out for added powers for another class, then that is what would happen. No it is much easier to get a nerf through so you all come screaming about that. There is a time whena line needs to be drawn and we all say "NO MORE" I was trying to get that started with the last round of nerfs but it failed. Oh well.
If it is so hard to find a combat medic to go with you on a raid, then why does your opponent have one. CMs are around and most of them are more than willing to go out on a raid with you, have you ever asked? Drop me a line on Ahazi and I will go out and raid with ya. Either way, there are times when you have to have a well rounded group. I played EQ for a long time and I never heard anyone screaming about nerfing the MOBs in the game because they had to have an enchanter to fight anything. You should make sure you have all your tools together or don't raid. That is the way it is. If you need a CM, make sure you get one, if you need a doctor make sure you get one. It sounds like this is anothe of those, "WAAAAHHH I can't do what I wanna do because I have to have someone else with me" whines.
Oh and the poisons that a Novice Combat Medic can throw are not nearly as powerful as the ones that you are crying about. I have been in situations where I have tossed 15 charges of an A poison and had it resisted every single time.
169 skill points? I am not crying about paying for them, I will if you get your way though.