Development Cycle Archive

Thread: Friday Feature Jan 23rd Jedi Revamp

WolfwoodCross
Wed Apr 14, 2004 11:45 pm
#885
Just read the bit on Publish 9. Certainly glad to hear that each player will now, essentially, be allowed two characters per server. I also like that a player does not have to completely give up his character to gain force sensitivity. I really like that actually.


About the PVP split regarding Dark and Light Jedi.


A player should not just simply choose Dark or Light. Players should be forced to make certain choices in any of the quests that are either good, bad, or morally ambiguous (my favorite choice ^_^). The choices a player makes along the course of his quests should dictate his eventual Rise or Fall. The path to good or evil should be obvious, but not 100% obvious.


Example - As a young Force Sensitive in the Rebellion, you have been given the task of finding an Imperial Spy for the Rebellion. Your orders are to eliminate him for the sake and security of the Alliance. Communing with the Force, you sense the location of the Spy and track him down. But when you find him, you find that he is home on Tatooine with his wife and children, who are oblivious to his dubious nature as an Imperial Spy. But if you do not eliminate him here and now the Empire will destroy a new hidden Rebel base.


Do you eliminate him for the sake of the countless lives that would be lost due to the Imperial Countersrike, orphaning his children and making his wife a widow? Or do you turn your back on commiting cold-blooded murder, no matter the consequences?


And the worst question - Which decision is the right one?


It is this kind of problem a Force Sensitive needs to face on their quests to find who will become Jedi and who will fall into darkness.

RogueKairi
Thu Apr 15, 2004 3:57 am
#886
End the hologrinding. Log the player progress and take out the holo system.


All of this hologrinding has not only ruined the economy (I can actually put up with this), but the immerision is absolutely ridiculous. I swear, the amount of AFK players has taken an increased number since the holiday release of the holocrons. Its no joke to say "welcome to the AFK Cantina in Coronet".


It would be nice to have a lull, a break, from all this grinding between now and the release of the jedi revamp. Give the economy and the player base a period of time to rebuild itself. Not later, but now. I know that many players are still gonna try and grind out as many professions as they can before the revamp will complian their progress is ruined, but honestly, who can really complain if their efforts have been saved?


Take the hologrinding out. Record theprogress of all the hologrinding for all those players. No effort will be killed. Theres no loss and thus shouldbe no worries. Give us a break and time to rebuild. When the new jedi system rolls around, we'll be ready and refreshed to go.



ARAMAXIS
±Bounty Hunter±
Brryn Starwind
-Master Ranger Veteran -Teras Kasi Master Veteran -Master Doctor Veteran
There but for the Grace of God go I
Dyrty
Tue Apr 20, 2004 9:24 am
#887
IF MY MAIN CHARACTER IS THE ONLY OPTION FOR FORCE SENSITIVETY AFTER THIS PATCH I WILL FREAK OUT!I think it is a stupid idea period. The more you screw around with the Jedi system the worse it gets! I say leave it as is! Hell I liked the idea of Perma Death even!



April 25, 2005 The Real War Begain....
- I support keeping & balancing the current combat system You can too

"The dumber people think you are. The more surprised they are going to be when you kill them." ~William Clayton
GuanYing
Tue Apr 20, 2004 4:52 pm
#888
Kenbow2, cool ideas for jedi, I like them. Unique lightsaber typed damage would be a good thing as would more of a jedi vs sith element. I like the idea of being able to try to sense other jedi and also trying to mask your force presence to try to hide. I posted somewhere before an idea of giving a huge xp reward for light and dark jedi that kill each other to encourage jedi fighting too.
CranialTyrant
Thu Apr 22, 2004 2:24 am
#889


Ymobacca wrote:


So the proposed Jedi Revamp seems to be somewhat vague, well I'd like to add my interperation and some thoughts of my own to the mix.

I've never really dug the existing idea. I don't like the idea of Holo grinding in order to acheive some end-goal of becoming Jedi - I prefer to enjoy the game and play, rather than grind. If I was to succumb to the grind, the other thing putting me off was that a new FS character would be needed - so all the time I spent on my primary character would be for nought - another character would benefit.

To introduce a new quest-based system sounds great providing that players who are on the holo grind are suitably re-imbursed (i.e. if someone is 90% there now, they should still be 90% there when the new system comes in). A quest-based system sounds like it will encourage the game to be played rather than ground - and for me personally that can only be a good thing.

I am assuming that you're current character at some point will become Force Sensitive provided you have fulfilled the quest-criteria. I like this idea - after all, was it not Yoda who said that the force binds all living things? If I was to become Jedi I wish it to be with the character a) I earned it with, and b) the character I'm attached to. However, I think that there should also be the option to reject Force Sensitivity on your existing toon and then elect to create a new FS character. One FS character per account. So if my character, Ymobacca, unlocks Force Sensitivity I should then have the option to pursue Jedi with Ymobacca, or with a brand new character - not both. This will help keep the Jedi level to a minimum.

Once a character is classed as Force Sensitive, this does not mean they are Jedi - it should simply mean that they may choose to embark on Jedi training. I may choose to be Force Sensitive but never take advantage of that or realise its potential.

Once a player embarks on Jedi training all previous skills (if an existing character) should be lost - after all the Jedi code states that Jedi have no posessions, wear simple clothes, etc (as in the EU). Whilst this seems harsh, it would mean a sacrifice of sorts in order to become Jedi. Make the path from Padawan to Master really mean something - not just 'another profession'.

Upon reaching a certain level of Jedi skill (say Jedi Knight), players should have the option of either having other non-Jedi skills, or carrying on to Jedi Master. The benefit of the first is that we could have such things as Jedi Healers (in the EU it mentions that some Jedi were better at such things as medicine, negotiation and what not rather than combat). We could have Jedi CHs that have a more natural affinity with their pets, Dark Jedi TKA's and so on. However, if a Jedi is to pursue Master then the sacrifices must continue (again this would help control the population of Jedi). Jedi Masters would in effect be the top of the food chain - but they will have had it very hard in order to get there! Jedi Master should represent the pinnacle of character development and only acheivable by those willing to put in the effort and sacrifice. In other words, introduce the concept of dedication and sacrifice. I mean, let's face it - you can probably grind about 60% of the professions out there when AFK - is this something to be rewarded?

For me, under the current system I have no interest in becoming Jedi - I don't want to lose my existing character nor grind away so I suppose in one way it does the job of controlling Jedi population. With some of my ideas I may be more intrerested but still not take the path of the Jedi knowing how much I'd have to sacrifice.

I dunno, I have a feeling some people will not like my ideas and flame me to death (good job I have a Master Doc with me!), but all I was wanting to do was suggest some ideas.

-Y

This is a post I pulled off another thread that I though should be posted here. This I think is the coolest idea for the Jedi Path. I like that you are given the choice of which slot is a Jedi, personally I don't want my main character to have to be a Jedi. Thats not what I created it for. My plan was to have a whole second character for that. But some may want it that way so this guys idea would be awesome. I also really like the needing to surrender the other skills if you wish to train as a Jedi and not just be a force sensitive. It really captures the essence of being a Jedi. This to me is the perfect way to have the Jedi unlocked and it will keep the Jedi population down even though its now quest based. I hope many others really like this idea and post and post about it so the Devs will notice and decide to use it.


Also one question: In the new system coming out, if you haven't unlocked a Force Sensitive slot and you take your main character and do the quests, how will you be able to unlock a second character slot. Do you have to achieve Jedi Knight or something? Or will it be as soon as you become Force Sensitive? Or what. I don't want my current character to be a Jedi, I want a new character to be one. I really want to know how that part will work because I may be close to unlocking the Holo grinding way and wanna know if I should try and push to finish before the Revamp.



"So the elves decided to lay down a suppresive fire on the gnomes..."
wossu-gaha
Sat Apr 24, 2004 2:40 am
#890


i think this is a step in the right direction for jedis
ATFdarkane
Sun Apr 25, 2004 1:09 am
#891
This is the problem i see with this new path to your force sensitive slot. i think the rest of the way up to master jedi is really good the way your gonan change it, but the problem is the path to become force sensitive. Now, instead of everyone and there mother grinding professions to open the fs slot, everyone will now be linign up to do jedi missions. In fact i think twice as many people that were grinding professions will be linign up to do these missions. people are gonan think "Hey it was to annoying to master proffesions to open my FS slot, But now missions !?! hey i can do that" it doenst matter how many missons you make , everyone is gonna be doin them 24/7 , they will tottaly forget about the rest of the game and all there gonan do is FS missions, i guaruntee you that. You shoudl make teh way to becoem force sensitive a lottery. Thast right , a lottery. 1 a month you grab a random player from each server, and BAM you have a new Force sensitive player. This way everyone has an equal chance of getting jedi. No one will complain " hey that guy is a master tk and rifle man, im onl a master marksmen, he has a better chance then me , its no fair" This will also limit the jedi on each server, like its suppossed to be at the time frame. Once this new system u have is implemented , everyone on every server will eventually be a jedi. it might not be over a few weeks, but EVERYONE will end up being a jedi. then u can just call the game Jedi academy 2. If u make a random lottery, everyone will relax and play the hard worked on content that you DEVS made for everyone to enjoy.
Dyreal
Tue Apr 27, 2004 5:07 pm
#892
how do we know what the limit on jedi per sever is



Dyreal ex bh( 200 rebel jedi kills) imp col imp ace /Jayce' jedi padwan imp col imperal pilot
( 19 rebel bh kills 2 imperal incaps true imps don't kill other imps) /Jayce dark jedi knight imp col kills ( classified) freelace ace. 'jayce buffbot imp sergent if looks could kill she have 300mil kills maarek imp col /doc/SW

Any one know what would happen if rebels stop gteffing??
They would never win!

imp for life

also willing to help on any space missions that does not kill imps
if your an leader of an imperal guild please email me i have some stuff to talk to you about

honor above all else
Ikailv_Davik
Wed Apr 28, 2004 4:29 am
#893

I really think you need to redo how one becomes a Jedi. I am not a pwer gamer, and don't have the time to play this game a lot. However, I have been told I am a great roleplayer, and I would love to become a Jedi for the roleplaying aspect of always being on the run, and having to keep your anonymity.



One problem though, I have a life to live outside of this game. That automatically means I can not unlock my FSCS. I don't have the time to grind away like some people do, and I'm not going to spend a year or two playing the game doing nothing but grinding over and over again. This is not even remotely fair, and quite frankly I should not have to pay a full monthly fee for a game that denies me the best content because you have to sacrifice real life in order to become a Jedi.


You guys really need to rethink the path to becoming a Jedi. I am not trying to be insulting, but after I found out about the whole Jedi holocron thing, I've changed my views on SWG. I look at it as a stop on the way to Everquest II, where you can be any class you want without having to play 24/7 and sacrifice your entire life. Now I know some will flame me, but I am 30 and work about 60 hours a week, so I'm not some kid whining here. This is a real concern


ZedKelly
Thu Apr 29, 2004 11:41 am
#894
As I see it there are several problems with the Jedi that havent been addressed in the info of the upcoming Revamp.


1. Jedi in armor. No where in any movie has any Jedi been seen in Armor, why? Because they didnt need it, however in this game it is almost mandatory if a Jedi wants to survive any BH or PVP encounter.


2. Armor providing protection from Light Saber Damage. This may be in the proscess of being fixed, as I have seen this brought up elsewhere. How is this a problem? If a lightsaber can cut through two sets of doors and a Blast door how can personal body armor provide any protection whatso ever?


3. Anonimity. Perhaps someone could clarify this to me if I am wrong as i dont have a Jedi character I'm not certain of this but, It appears that when Jedi have a lightsaber in hand their Neon Sign over their heads shows their profession. Is this simply because the Jedi put it there or is it automatic? And if it is Automatic, why?



I am not one tosimply complain withough providing suggestions on how these problems could be fixed. so.....



Solutions:


1. Provide the Light Saber with all 4 damage avoidance abilities, ie.. Block, Dodge, Evade, Counter Attack. And allow Jedi a much higher cap as well as a faster rise to that cap as they climb the skill Tree. This would make Armor unnessissary. Ah but what if a Jedi decides to wear armor anyway and make him/her/it's self invulnerable? Easy, allow armor worn by Jedi to greatly inhibit or outright prevent force related abilities, as well as inhibit movement and attack speed.


2. A new class of damage more appropiate to lightsabers, ie Plasma Damage. Plasma Damageshould ignore all armor, andshouldhave a high max damage andmin damage much closer or even the same as max damage makeing the spread small or nil.


3. Jedi both dark and lightrequireing anonimity due to their being hunted down by every BH in the Galaxy as well as the Empire in General, should be able to hide their Name as well as their title from other players. They also should be able to be unseen by other players Radar. Personaly i think everyone should have these abilities but Jedi need it to provide them with the stealth and ability to hide they need to survive.




Tempest Novastorm
Adventurer Extraordinaire

" Its my dang Galaxy and Palpatine can't have any part of it! "
" The Temptresses are mine too but they will deny it, uh... don't tell my wife! "

I explained the SNAFU in detail and was told although it seemed FUBAR to me it was working as intended, which left me thinking, BOHICA.
valandrave
Thu Apr 29, 2004 11:42 am
#895

I feel that these new Jedi changes are good except for one. WHy can you only advance after Jedi Knight by doing PVP combat against other Jedi? Granted having any Jedi other than Luke goes against continuity but I still hear how the DEVs want to stick to continuity.


In the spirit of that let me ask you... How many Jedi actually even saw let along fought a Jedi of opposing faction? Well we know that up until Episode I that no Dark Jedi had ever been encountered by the Jedi for 1000 years. So I ask you... How did Yoda get to be a master? Forcing a player who (for example) is an entertainer to do PVP combat is absurd. So say that entertainer wants to do the quests to be Jedi and finally gets to be a Knight and wants to continue on to master. How likely is it that this particular player is going to go up against and successfully defeat a veteran PVPer? SO once again it seems the DEVs reward the PVPers and screw the PVEers. No one should be rewarded for their style of play. I am sure ALOT of Jedi in the Star Wars mythos would rather strive for peace and not fight. Are you saying these devoted few cannot attain master? Bad move DEVs.


Make being a Jedi a challenge but why does it have to a PVP slugfest? I have Faith that the DEVs can be original and come up with a way for fans of PVE to attain master without having to be forced to learn to PVP.


Legelos
Thu May 06, 2004 2:43 pm
#896




valandrave wrote:


I feel that these new Jedi changes are good except for one. WHy can you only advance after Jedi Knight by doing PVP combat against other Jedi? Granted having any Jedi other than Luke goes against continuity but I still hear how the DEVs want to stick to continuity.


In the spirit of that let me ask you... How many Jedi actually even saw let along fought a Jedi of opposing faction? Well we know that up until Episode I that no Dark Jedi had ever been encountered by the Jedi for 1000 years. So I ask you... How did Yoda get to be a master? Forcing a player who (for example) is an entertainer to do PVP combat is absurd. So say that entertainer wants to do the quests to be Jedi and finally gets to be a Knight and wants to continue on to master. How likely is it that this particular player is going to go up against and successfully defeat a veteran PVPer? SO once again it seems the DEVs reward the PVPers and screw the PVEers. No one should be rewarded for their style of play. I am sure ALOT of Jedi in the Star Wars mythos would rather strive for peace and not fight. Are you saying these devoted few cannot attain master? Bad move DEVs.


Make being a Jedi a challenge but why does it have to a PVP slugfest? I have Faith that the DEVs can be original and come up with a way for fans of PVE to attain master without having to be forced to learn to PVP.







Ok 1st im not trying to flame you but what would you rather have? And what is a JEDI? They are the most elite fighting class in the gallaxy! They are NOT ELITE ARTISANS! And what makes a Master??? Crafting? Getting a badge? If that was the case then a " Master would be as powerful as a initiate."


Sorry but i totally disagree with your statement. Just like i totally disagree with people complaining cause they dont want to fight to become a JEDI. THAT IS WHAT A JEDI IS!



_________________________________________________

AKA Arragon / Magi

Another 4 Accounts Cancelled here SOE. NICE GAME! /priase ROFL what a JOKE!
SWG = Sony's Worst Game . Its all in the name so why is everyone suprised?

Quit Nerfing the game and NERF THE DAMN PPL MAKING IT! <--(destroying)
Legelos
Thu May 06, 2004 2:48 pm
#897


Greeting Developers of the greatest game i have ever played. I have some ideasfor the upcomming " JEDI REVAMP " I really hope you take the time to read these emails that are sent into and not disreguarded as they are in the holocron ingame and along with the CSR replies that dont even relate to what was asked.




Lightsaber Damage


Im sure you have heard all about sabers doing kinetic. Just thought i would agree with this as being wrong. They have been known for being able to slice through a blast door but yet they get 90% blocked from a nice composite set of armor. Sabers should be able to cut right through this armor. The only armor that should have the resist to a saber is one that only a Master Bounty Hunter can equipt. Now i know they can track before they are master so maybe make it so they can equipt certian peices of it after gaining certian skill boxes. Kinda like a certification as you have for weapons.


Bounty Hunter Tracking Droids



Bounty Hunter Tracking Droids should be visible to a Jedi that the BH has the mission on. With that they should also be able to be distroyed by the Jedi. A way to do this that would make it fair is make the driod not show up on the radar but still targetable if a Jedi see's it or just happens to lock on it with autotarget. If the Jedi doesnt see it then he gets tracked but if he destroys it the BH will have to launch another driod and start the tracking process again. This gives the Jedi a chance to move. I mean come on a Jedi would know if he / she was being stalked right?


Jedi Clothing


This i expected to already be in place in the game for Jedi. However it is not. How many Jedi was wearing armor in any of he movies? 1 and it was only a helmet for Vador. None of the other Jedi used any armor what so ever. They wear there own unique clothing. With this inmind they should be able to craft there own look making it somewhat unique. Also they should be able to pick a few mods to place in them since jedi have no resists to anything. Now also i think that there should be certian clothing only a light can make / wear , aswell as a dark. And of course only FS should be able to wear these.


Pearls / Crystals


These should have another attribute to them. Force regeneration.


Terrain Negotiation


Jedi should have equal to a scout with the first box with terrian negotiation.


Jedi Defence


Im sure you have heard alot of people talking about this so i wont go to far into detail. But we was out hunting with 4 total Jedi 2 of which was Padawan. A opposite faction BH had a mission on one of us and took his shot. ONE BH killed ever last one of the Jedi becuase of No defence / saber type damage ( kinectic ) and because you have granted the new geo pistol to the game without even thinking of what this would do to Jedi. I was also in a major PVP battle. ( I am dark now ) we had three 4,4,4,4 guardians and a few dark apprentices. 2 BH / pistoleers took us all down in under a minute! nothing more to say about this but BS? ya


BH Missions


I propose that a BH suffers some kind of a loss as the Jedi do when they are slain! ( Besides just loosing there mission )


Lightsabers!!!!


Light sabers should be able to be TWEAKED but the maker. Jedi as there knowledge increases with the force and they make there own weapons right? Well then dont you think they would know how to tweak them to do more damage? / speed? In the movies luke started with his fathers old training saber but in time made a vey powerful saber in " Return of the Jedi " They should be able to construct higher damage sabers the higher up they are.


Jedi Blocking


Blocking should have been amost mastered by the time they reach padawan. One of the 1st thing they learn is how to block. I think that the driod they used for this should be put in the game and that Jedi can advance there blocking skill as its own leveling process. These should be able to be used in a private house without getting a teff. This would make it so that it was completly upto the Jedi as to how well he was able to block.


Jedi special moves


Jedi can jump, twist , spin, flip, ect during an attack or when trying to evade someone. I propose that something be put in place like this. Also the 2 handed moves that are part of apprentice are the same as the ones from heavy swords? This is suppose to be a Jedi not a wannabe swordsman. Jedi's moves should not look or do anything like any of the regular professions.



_________________________________________________

AKA Arragon / Magi

Another 4 Accounts Cancelled here SOE. NICE GAME! /priase ROFL what a JOKE!
SWG = Sony's Worst Game . Its all in the name so why is everyone suprised?

Quit Nerfing the game and NERF THE DAMN PPL MAKING IT! <--(destroying)
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