Development Cycle Archive
Thread: IC4: Path of the Jedi
PakRendo
Sun Mar 07, 2004 10:16 pm
#807
I agree with the previous posters that Jedi should NOT be wearing any armor period,it just breaks with continuity too much.If they do, there should be a severe defensive penalty of some kind.On the other hand tho, Jedis should be very difficult to land an attack on when wearing the traditional robe and/or regular clothes.While we are on equipment, why are lightsabers even slicable?Code it in where they are NOT.
On the topic of changing the path to becomming a Jedi, I welcome a quest based system to do this.Luke had to travel the entire galaxy doing different things, meeting new and dangerous individuals before he discovered the true meaning of the force.With hologrinding, in theory a player don't even need to leave his/her home planet, and just grind away until their slot opens up.In the quests themselves, I would like to see some that are non-combat quests mixed in with the usual lightsaber show.I just want quests a little deeper than "destroy waypoint A" and return.Maybe a Jedi will have to run a message/item delivery to some old guy on a mountaintop on Yavin IV somewhere, or observe some various NPC encampments/movements?Just a few Ideas.
As for the trials, and titles, I really have no opnion on, I am confident they will be done in a satisfactory manner.
MCorvinus
Mon Mar 08, 2004 2:43 am
#808
My idea for jedi revamp would be:
1. The quests are given by the holocrons, no NPC may give quests before a certain level of jedi skill has been obtained (I really like Holos as a part of the SW saga, without them it will just not be the same!).
2. The Jedi skills can only be teached by NPC jedi trainers, and this trainers should only be able to be identified by FSC.
This is my ideas, dont know if someone else had these before, in that case Im sorry for republish. Otherwise I think the quest base of the jedi trade is a great idea!
Mr_pepsi
Mon Mar 08, 2004 7:45 am
#809
I totally agree that the holos are the ones that should give out the quests, but another point is, the trading of holos SHOULD be nurfed, why, because those seeking to unlock their FS slot, should be doing a quest basedupon finding the holos that they need (also because their are too many holos out on the market now, and plenty of ppl making credits off them), and doing each quest, that each holo gives, but keepit the way it is now as far as not being able to seeing the next profession you have to master, in case this case no being able to see the next quest, as opening another holo before the current quest is done, it wuld just get repeated.
Now each quest, could be set up as such that each holo quest could have a series of sub quests, say maybe 10, each sub quest could be completed in any order thus player disires, but each sub quest no mater what order it's done in, must be completed before being able to move onto the next sub quest, each sub quest would take a person to any part of the galaxy, that way ppl will have to go to other planets in order to do the actual sub quests, instead of the way it is now, where some don't even have to leave their own planet. The duration of each sub quest would have to last a certain amount of time, if you fail to complete said sub quest in that given time, you will then have toeither the quest over, by having to goto another loacation on another planet & trying to complete it their, or select a new sub quest to do.Now as far as the actual holos go, they could be set up by using say a maxium of4 holos, say 1 for crafting, 1 for combat, 1 for healing, and 1 for entertaining, but that's something that could be played with. Also each quest for a holo would depend on what side of the force you wish to belong too, dark or light side (sith or jedi holos)
Ok lets say a person gets a combat holo, and a sub quest is said that you must kill a jedi (a sith holo sub quest), and a person say has 40 mins to kill this jedi, but is on Yavin IV, and the jedi is say on Dant, the timer would not start until the player has arrived on Dant, or could make the timer 50 mins and start as soon has the pleyer picks that sub quest (the jedi to kill would reflect upon the players combat ability, and based 20% stronger then the player (or group) as to make it too easy for the player(s) to kill the jedi (light side)), if you die while trying to kill he jedi, no matter how many times you do, that timer would still count down, until either you killed the jedi, or the time runs out, in which case either you can accpet to retry the mission, meaning now that mission would spawn to another location on another planet, or pick another sub quest to do.
Anyway thats what I've come up with.
SWEzekiel
Mon Mar 08, 2004 7:57 am
#810
a way to stop jedi wearing armor is to allow them to gain armor protection as they become more powerful. This would either work like armor taking off parts of damage through the force or just give them damage reduction when they are hit. Jedi do not wear armor and it ruins RP if they do..
jbeazy47960
Mon Mar 08, 2004 10:19 am
#811
We are keepers of the Peace, not Soldiers
Perhaps there should be missions that would help certain people out of trouble, rival Politicians, trade disputes, etc. While there will be dangers to overcome during this, the Jedi could figure out who is really behind it, unravel a mystery, what ever. Hunt someone down, solve a puzzle. Real missions, real fun, something outside slaughtering animals, or needing 10 people to help you kill an 80 per resist to everything 250000 ham Dark Jedi Master. Maybe at the end of the quest, maybe it would take you and an appretice. Also, I think Jedi master's or near masters should be able to steer a padawan in the right direction, or take him on missions with him for xp for both of them. There is a real chance here to take this game over the top and make it the best ever especially with space expansion coming. Let's do it!!
r31909
Mon Mar 08, 2004 10:33 am
#812
for all the people that think holo grinding is the way let me give you an example of how it ruins the game'
I ask john doe if he wants to go hunting or kill some imps his reply is no i need to go afk macroing those last few boxes of dancer so i can drop it and do the same thing with another proffesion. oooohh yea if you want some junk meds or 1 extraction rate heavy harvesters let me know cause i have loads of both from when i grinded those proffesions. and please dont bother me to go hunting or anything for the next few months i will be grinding all classes till i get my fs and even then dont bother me cause i will be grinding jedi to cause a pawdwan jedi is gimp so i need to get up in the better trees before ill do anything with my jedi.
GET THE POINT I HOPE SO ITS PREETY SIMPLE.LOL
EMC2
Mon Mar 08, 2004 11:18 am
#813
1. No more crystals orpearlsfrom loot - This gets rid of the afk macro mob campers, krayt spawn campers and a player economy developed around a "hold another profession at ransom" mentality. By the way, for you flamers out there, I am not suggesting Jedi are the only profession affected by the "ransom" mentality. But THIS is the Jedi forum and I am focused on that profession with this post. I suggest krayt dragon loot be moved to quests for those who wish to craftjedi lightsabers (from pearls),weapons (from tissues), and armor (from segments), and perhaps have a more unique loot item like a very decorative krayt skull as bragging rights for killing one of these amazing beasts. The camping by elites is just ruining the opportunity for many players to face this challenge (just for the risk of doing so).
2. Enable dynamic* daily** quests for Jedi only - These could be given by hermit style (like RIS Armor Quest) NPCs and give the Jedi some remotely located andchallengingmissions to accomplish where they get some story plot, experience, and a crystal reward (with random properties of course, same as it is today). You could limit this to one reward per day per Jedi to keep yet another economy from developing, and at least Jedi could find a good crystal once in a while on their own merit. Take this concept a step further, and have a VERY challenging quest where the Jedi can earn a Krayt Pearl as a reward, but limit it to once per week per Jedi to keep them rare. Obviously higher risk and higher reward should be applicable.
Developer Corner: It seems that the NPC converse menu could offer a daily quest line and a weekly quest line to the individual Jedi to facilitate this process, and it could probably be tied into a quest counter on the avatar that gets reset daily for the daily ones (server reboot) and weekly for the weekly ones (weekly update). In other words, the avatar gives up theavailable quest counter in each category (daly, weekly) just like surrendering skill points for training.
*Dynamic = Similar to the /findmytrainer process, we could use a /findmyquest command to locate the NPC of the day for our character to initiate the quest. Perhaps make the trainer the sameNPC to give us a quest each day (keeping the command consolidated to a /findmymaster or /findmytrainer). Afterall, this would bring great jedi game content, remove the player economic pressure on jedi, and provide some continuityand adaptation bydoing missionsissued by your"master" to gain experience and rewards that mean something to you as a student (being able to improve your lightsaber or craft a new one).
**Side note on "Daily" = Personally I think the /findmytrainer process should give a Jedi a different NPC each day so that if we discover that one of the trainers is across from the starport entrance of Coronet, or in the Kor Vella area (which is about to become an Imperial Crackdown stronghold), we have the option to wait another day for training in a less risky place to travel. Having a static NPC trainer for the life of a Jedi is a really boring and high risk absurdity.
Expansion of concept - Similar quests could be provided to earn additional experience rewards, like 5,000 Jedi Experience points for completing an assigned mission issued by this NPC "master" who is training the Jedi.
AlphaWolf
Mon Mar 08, 2004 11:22 am
#814
Two ideas.
One, jedi trainers at some level, perhaps not the earliest are unreachable by non-force sensitive characters.
This can be accomplished by creating a location in a mountain, hill, forest, whatever, that is only 'open' to force sensitive characters a la private houses. Inside would be a suitable setting for yoda, or whomever to do the training.
Second, To achieve any top tier skill box, i.e. the master box, one must seek out and destroy another opposing force sensitive character of the same status.
This is done by creating a 'master candidate' flag that is set(once until death or completion, i.e. not a toggle.) Once this is set one would have to seek out a dark candidate(various quests could be devised to provide a candidate with information regarding their new nemesis), or vice versa, to battle. This battle would not be completely incongrous with the existing story lines, and would forceably (no pun intended) thin out the prospective jedi candidates. This would add another layer to the process of creating a rare progression toward powerful jedi. At the same time it could lead to some potentially huge conflicts with very real life and death consequences.
To prevent ganging up during these trials, perhaps a candidate flag would take the jedi off the bounty hunter lists. This would be akin to Vader claiming 'this one is mine.'
Halkhan
Mon Mar 08, 2004 3:54 pm
#815
My ideas for unlocking the FS slot:
Establish a baseline set of accomplishments that must be performed before getting to the "Trials of Force Sensativity". (examples could include: be the master of your chosen profession for3 months, complete x number of theme parks, complete x number of monthly acts, master x number of professions, etc.) After completing this portion then the character is givin the name of a guide. Finding the guide should be a difficult mission. The guide then puts the character on the "Trials of Force Sensativity"...
Isolate the traits of a jedi. (honor, sacrifice,compassion, patience, etc..) then have a series of tests for each of the traits. Make these difficult and lengthy and themed to the trait. The idea is to weed out those that don't belong.
Each person attempting the "Trials of Force Sensativity" deal with their guide. The guide is responsible for giving thecharacter on trialmissions/tasks to perform and also judging the results. Should a character fail at any point during the trials the guide leaves never to return. The character then must find another guide and start over. It should be possible for SOE staff to take over the NPC guide in the later trials.
Require a number of missions be completed with a group. Require a wide range of skill sets to complete a mission (example: a terminal only opened by a smuggler, a sick person only healed by a doctor, a hide only harvested by a ranger, a creature that will only duel a master TKA, etc...).
Keep the missions tough and make sacrifices steep. (example: You need to save an small town, kill the thugs responsible and donate 500k credits to help rebuld the town. You need to help a small town prevent a disease from killing the inhabitants, locate x artifact (maybe a ground up dragon pearl) and give to a scientist to help devlope a cure for the new disease, etc...).
Have length missions that require interacting with numerous NPCs that need tasks performed that will lead to Jedi exp and other rewards (Example: force crystals, dragon pearls) Make these required to be able to train 4th box on any level jedi skill tree and also for attaining the master box for every level jedi. Make it so that other player jedi can assign tasks to younger jedi that when completed allows the senior jedi to teach the younger (for 4th box or master box only).
Remove force crystals and dragon pearls from normal play and make them only attainable by jedi. Make these quest based rewards.
No titles unless only viewable by other jedi. (you should allow jedi access to a few of the other starting trees so that they can at least put up titles of that profession. Even if its only the novice box.
SKoT9
Mon Mar 08, 2004 4:26 pm
#816
Sorry if this has been stated before but i didnt want to read 36 pages 
. I am close to my silent holo, and if i do not make Jedi before the change, i HOPE to god that the Devs make it much easier on the person who is on his silent holo to get FSCS than someone who has never read a holo. My $.02
. I am close to my silent holo, and if i do not make Jedi before the change, i HOPE to god that the Devs make it much easier on the person who is on his silent holo to get FSCS than someone who has never read a holo. My $.02
Farimar_Storm
Mon Mar 08, 2004 5:02 pm
#817
I have no idea were otherpeoplegot the idea that doing quest to gain skills in a tree is a good idea. SWG is not a quest based game. It just wont work, no one wants to run 40 million quest to get a skill. SWG is an action based game, you just dont have classes that run quest. You have marksman/brawler who fight and get there xp fighting and medics who get it healing and crafters crafting. A jedi is not some crafter nor is he a doctor, a jedi is a fighter which there for means that in order to gain skill a jedi should be just like the marksman and brawler trees which I want to add they already are and its just fine. The jedi system does not need a revamp jedi are notorious for being guess what? STRONG AND KILLS THINGS. Who wants to run around talking to different NPC all day or doing some stupid quest? The only thing that realy needs revamp is the way of unlocking ur FS. NOW quest to unlock your FS hey thats fine but all these people talking about doing quest to get saber skills or force skills? That is not how SWG is played. For those people who think that doing quest to unlock you FS is a bad idea and all just think realy hard on this one.
First lets start with the quest to unlock your FS. All the devs need to do is make three different quest. For those that like fighting make them have to solo some hard but i might add not imposible mob. In doing this you require players get atleast some background in the fighting system of the game. Lets just face it no one wants some little newbie being a jedi. Second you can make a crafting quest that requires a person say craft X ammount of items based on what class they are going and atleast hold master rank in two different crafting trees. If you are a doctor or entertainer just set a number on the ammount of wounds/bf you have to heal to get your FS. Depending on how you acheive your FS will determine your characters strengths. Say if you go through fighting you will get high modifiers to lightsaber techniques and direct damage force powers. If you go through crafting you will excell in crafting elite lightsabers that another jedi of a different unlock wont be able to achieve. If you go through medic/entertainer way you will excell at passive force powers. This way people that want to fight, craft, or heal will excell at what they like doing and do it better than other people. Now im not saying the people who dont go through the fighting way wont use lightsabers. Everyone knows that all jedi have to have some skill in the saber. Everyone should have all the powers, just a character should recieve modifiers in different areas based on what way they chose to unlock the FS.
Second i know that everyone is gonna say with a system like this you will have an explosion in the jedi population. If anyone knows basic economics they will see the lie in this statement. First off with the skill loss system only the more dedicated players will put up with the risk of losing a skill. Second paying BH an extreem ammount of money to get rid of the Jedi is a great idea on the devs part and congradulations to who every came up with that. If there is a "boom" in jedi population this means that there will be more BH eager to take advantage of the easy money. I for one would go BH just to harass the newbs that have no right to be a jedi knight. With the increase in BH hunting jedi morepeople would go crafter to take advantage of the BH that need newer and more powerfull weapons and same on armor and medics who will be their to buff the noble BH. I know I know, what about the other combat profs that wont get to hunt BH, No one will go them will they? Well to fix this just open Jedi hunting missions to all attacking professions.
Im all for this system of unlocking the FS and its clear that basic economics can show how the jedi might boom for a short while but supply and demand for other parts of the game will limit this boom and find an equalibrium population for all classes at a point. I would like to congradulate the devolopers on the work they are doing,they have managed to make it this far without making a major screw up. But if jedi becomes some class UNLIKE all the other professions in that you have to do quest to attainskill which is not an SWG thing (hey go play KoTOR if you want to do quest thing) it is a very safe bet that the more advanced SWG players who have been playing for content will move on to other games that are comming into the market, at the moment im sure to alot of players tired of being jerked around with the ways to attain jedi World of Warcraft is looking very interesting.
Darksidian Hayden, Master Bounty Hunter, Wanderhome
Farimar_Storm
Mon Mar 08, 2004 5:03 pm
#818
I have no idea were otherpeoplegot the idea that doing quest to gain skills in a tree is a good idea. SWG is not a quest based game. It just wont work, no one wants to run 40 million quest to get a skill. SWG is an action based game, you just dont have classes that run quest. You have marksman/brawler who fight and get there xp fighting and medics who get it healing and crafters crafting. A jedi is not some crafter nor is he a doctor, a jedi is a fighter which there for means that in order to gain skill a jedi should be just like the marksman and brawler trees which I want to add they already are and its just fine. The jedi system does not need a revamp jedi are notorious for being guess what? STRONG AND KILLS THINGS. Who wants to run around talking to different NPC all day or doing some stupid quest? The only thing that realy needs revamp is the way of unlocking ur FS. NOW quest to unlock your FS hey thats fine but all these people talking about doing quest to get saber skills or force skills? That is not how SWG is played. For those people who think that doing quest to unlock you FS is a bad idea and all just think realy hard on this one.
First lets start with the quest to unlock your FS. All the devs need to do is make three different quest. For those that like fighting make them have to solo some hard but i might add not imposible mob. In doing this you require players get atleast some background in the fighting system of the game. Lets just face it no one wants some little newbie being a jedi. Second you can make a crafting quest that requires a person say craft X ammount of items based on what class they are going and atleast hold master rank in two different crafting trees. If you are a doctor or entertainer just set a number on the ammount of wounds/bf you have to heal to get your FS. Depending on how you acheive your FS will determine your characters strengths. Say if you go through fighting you will get high modifiers to lightsaber techniques and direct damage force powers. If you go through crafting you will excell in crafting elite lightsabers that another jedi of a different unlock wont be able to achieve. If you go through medic/entertainer way you will excell at passive force powers. This way people that want to fight, craft, or heal will excell at what they like doing and do it better than other people. Now im not saying the people who dont go through the fighting way wont use lightsabers. Everyone knows that all jedi have to have some skill in the saber. Everyone should have all the powers, just a character should recieve modifiers in different areas based on what way they chose to unlock the FS.
Second i know that everyone is gonna say with a system like this you will have an explosion in the jedi population. If anyone knows basic economics they will see the lie in this statement. First off with the skill loss system only the more dedicated players will put up with the risk of losing a skill. Second paying BH an extreem ammount of money to get rid of the Jedi is a great idea on the devs part and congradulations to who every came up with that. If there is a "boom" in jedi population this means that there will be more BH eager to take advantage of the easy money. I for one would go BH just to harass the newbs that have no right to be a jedi knight. With the increase in BH hunting jedi morepeople would go crafter to take advantage of the BH that need newer and more powerfull weapons and same on armor and medics who will be their to buff the noble BH. I know I know, what about the other combat profs that wont get to hunt BH, No one will go them will they? Well to fix this just open Jedi hunting missions to all attacking professions.
Im all for this system of unlocking the FS and its clear that basic economics can show how the jedi might boom for a short while but supply and demand for other parts of the game will limit this boom and find an equalibrium population for all classes at a point. I would like to congradulate the devolopers on the work they are doing,they have managed to make it this far without making a major screw up. But if jedi becomes some class UNLIKE all the other professions in that you have to do quest to attainskill which is not an SWG thing (hey go play KoTOR if you want to do quest thing) it is a very safe bet that the more advanced SWG players who have been playing for content will move on to other games that are comming into the market, at the moment im sure to alot of players tired of being jerked around with the ways to attain jedi World of Warcraft is looking very interesting.
Darksidian Hayden, Master Bounty Hunter, Wanderhome
Deebo1
Mon Mar 08, 2004 8:38 pm
#819
Can some tell me around wut month the jedi path is even changing