Development Cycle Archive
Thread: Friday Feature Jan 23rd Jedi Revamp
Maskius wrote:
Allow me to be unorthodox for a moment.
In order to preserve the longevity and enjoyment of this game the Jedi population has to be strictly controlled.
It does not matter whether there is a holocron or quest-based system in place in order to unlock the FS slot, both are flawed in the long run. In both these methods players will, over time, unlock these slots and Jedi's will become more and more common.
Surely they can lose all or some of their skills upon death (depending on what approach the devs take), but that hardly matters. There will still be a Jedi in the game. Should the controlling player become so frustrated of losing months of work when dying as a Jedi, he will not merely leave the game and delete his FS slot - no, it will go to someone else, most likely through Ebay or whatnot.
Try to imagine how the game will look in the future with the current (and planned) systems. Should they make it less time consuming to become a Jedi, the problems will merely manifest themselves sooner. The result will be the same: The game will be ruined and we will move on to another MMORPG.
My unorthodox suggestion is this:
1. Make the FS slot be awarded completely random and capped by current players vs active Jedi's on the particular server.
2. Implement absolute permadeath. As in 3 deaths and the FS slot is deleted (yes, deleted). Compensate with a stronger Jedi Class.
What this would do is:
Keepingplayers interested, you would never know if you were awarded a slot some day (just as people play the lottery due to the mindset of "it could be me next time..."), it is a solid incentive to keep playing without boring yourself to death doing mindless afk-holo-grinding or whatever is in store next.
It would also result in an extreme hunt for active Jedi's (whom only opposing factions should be able to kill, of course), due to the fact that players know the number of Jedi slots'available' on the server is capped and therefore killing one would open up a slot.. and who knows, I might be my slot.. You know how the human mind works in this regard. Additionally such a hunt on Jedi's is what was intended, yes?
Casual players would benefit as well, knowing that they 'could' be allowed tocreate a Jedi without playing 24/7, thereby keeping them interrested as well.
There would be no race and single-minded focus of pursuing the needed path to Jedi, it would be chance. Therefore players could sink themselves into what proffesions they like and just play the game as intended. No need for insane AFK macroing, no need for single-minded big guild races towards specific Jedi-oriented quests or whatnot (yeah!, I am6thin line for the last Jedi-thing needed to unlock my FSS in my guild, should be around 2 months!!.. you get the idea).
If there is a desire to give players some sort 'influence' on their FSS, then implement ways that they can increase their chances to get selected for a FSS and keep it secret. You would then have players working for badges, exploring, questing and all sort of things in order to increase their chances, but it would by no means be a sure thing. just like the fella that buys 2 lottery tickets have a higher chance than the fella with 1, but no guaranties.
All would be more or less equal (depending on whether the above chance-increase was implemented) in the chance for a FS slot and these slots would rotate as exsisting Jedi's dies and new ones are awarded.
Keep in mind that I understand the frustration of all those who have worked seriously hard to try and open their FSS, but you must realize that the game will die eventually if there is no Jedi population control, which means deleting exsisting FS slots, while new are created.
I know my above ideas will most likely never be implemented, but in the end something along these lines must be done if this game is to survive in the long run. Or else the Jedi population will just continiously increase until a point where it just get stupid and then the players will depart.
Regards
Shar
This is the way it should have been from the beginning.
If it had been like this and nobody knew what was involved and they just found out they mysteriously had their slot opened, everyone would have been ok with this.
All the devs had said was that all players would have an equal chance of becoming a Jedi.
A lottery done every time a Jedi is killed and their slot is removed would be an equal chance among all players.
Perhaps just those interested in becoming a Jedi soon would sign up each round like you have to sign up to play a lottery in real life.
Out of fairness to the players who have worked towards opening their slot and to those who already have:
Current Jedis get to keep their slot. They were (unfortunately) told they get to keep it so the devs can not go back on that. If nobody had to have "worked" to open up their slot and it just happened, people might not have minded having it taken away if they died, had that been part of the deal from the beginning.
Those who have have finished four holo professionswould get four "tickets" / chances in the first lottery.
I think everyone would have accepted this, had this been the system.
I really wish it was like this.
Unfortunately, I think its too late to do something like this.
People would probably be in a bigger uproar.
All I can say is that I hope it's like that in Star Wars Galaxies: Episode 2.
Or maybe this is what the new system will be, minus the slot loss (slot loss is what I believe the system was going to be until a couple months after release). The devs haven't really said much. Like Maskius, maybe these quests could increase your chances, but would not be a cut and dry sure thing way to open your slot.
As far as I know, I have not done a single profession towards becoming a Jedi. I'm trying to look out for the good of the game. I have no vested interest in having those who have done 4 holo professions getting more chances per round, actually quite the opposite. But that would only be fair.
(by the way, Jedi should be added to the accepted word list in Spell Check here on the forums)
My guess is this quest based system they are talking about wont be so easy as people are surmising. It will, in fact, be MUCH HARDER. SOE sucks, but they aren't stupid. They'll put in a quest system that keeps you playing for many many months to complete and then I bet there is still some random luck involved (ie: final task, go kill Joe Shmoe..but you haven't a clue when or where Joe will appear).
Don't think I'll be wasting my $15 a month much longer. Anyone want my stuff? 
"ROFL! 30 pages already. Rather than look through all of this madness, have the devs even posted any responses to anyones concerns?"
nope.....seems like they are still on thier coffee break...
Now that the slot will be put back to some "mystery" method, I will quit and move on. My faith that the devs will cut me a break because I have mastered 9 professions is nonexistent (I wonder why?) I never liked being told I "might" never be able to play a whole section of the game (jedi) when I am paying the same price as those that have unlocked, but knowing if I simply put time and effort into it, I could and would unlock remedied that. If that "known" method for unlocking is removed, that will be it for me.
And no...ya can't have my stuff!! lol
Tharren
After reading through all of this, there is one thing that is definately clear...you cannot please all of the people all of the time..somone will always be upset.
The main problems through all of this are Jedi and how to have the FS slot opened. I Agree that Jedi should be rare and i don't want to see a load of jedis running around everywhere and i don't want to have to grind away at proffesions to open up a slot. The idea of limited Jedi and a lottery seems ok...but what happens when you have achived everything you want and the only thing left to do is get a jedi...a lottery is a gamble and therfore you could spend years paying SOE 13 dollars a month just too see if you might get a jedi...not my idea of fun.
The idea of permadeath deleting your FS slot sounds cool to me..but it would also make a lot of New jedi afrid to open their front door...that would hold up a slot for everyone else.
Based around these two ideas i have a suggestion of my own that i think would be fair to all.
First...do away with the holocron system and replace it with the quest system, hold on..don't panic....next is we limit the ammount of jedi to 200 per server...the ones that have already opened up their slot can keep em.From here on anyone that completes the quests goes onto a list, first to complete goes top of the list and goes down in that order...as a person completes the quests they join the bottom of the que.We then give Jedi a number of Lives..lets say 5 each..that will make sure that the jedi are not afraid of their own shadow and will venture out of their houses, After a jedi looses his five lives then he looses his force slot and must retake the quests and join the bottom of the que before he can see another FS slot..the person at the top of the Que gets his slot and everyone in the que moves up one place and so the circle continues.
I think this would be a fair and simple system for all and would keep the Jedi rare, it would also promote more aggresive jedi hunting as the more jedi that die..the closer you are to your FS slot.
I think this change is excellent... for the simple reason Holo Grinding is teh suq!!!
It is/was a poor attempt to get players to play professions that are considered by many to be very boring. Thats why we have empty vendors everywhere, rotting mineral extractors and factories, tons of afk <insert profession here> grindersin most prime spots.
How do we fix this you ask? Well the first step is to open up at least 2 more slots per server per account for alts. This WILL actually encourage others to make characters in alt professions and play and maintain them when the battle fatigue sets in.. In short it gives us options without penalizing us on our main combat character.
Of course this is just my opinion but I know I would have several other professions on a single server if it were allowed and I'm certain I'm not alone.