Development Cycle Archive
Thread: Jedi Feedback: Jedi and Combat
Madfiend
Sun Jun 20, 2004 6:14 pm
#54
jedi in PvP:
jedi vs a ranged fighter: very easy win for the jedi
jedi vs melee fighter : very very tough fight => LS accuracy is just too low)
jedi vs jedi : seems to be ok, better combat template wins
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jedi in PvE:
jedi vs low lvl mobs : easy fights, with a decent XP reward
jedi vs high lvl mobs : not possible to defeat stuff even a master swordsman on life can solo atm
=> lightsaber damage seems to be reduced against hvy armor, even though light armor and no armor doesnt grant a damage bonus because of the LS vulnerability. how can this be?
=> moreover lack of armor makes you get just too much damage. keep in mind that not every template will be wether master defense or master enhancer. you want diversity then better give the robes some good resitences soon.
everything else seems to be pretty ok. good job Devs.
jedi vs a ranged fighter: very easy win for the jedi
jedi vs melee fighter : very very tough fight => LS accuracy is just too low)
jedi vs jedi : seems to be ok, better combat template wins
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
jedi in PvE:
jedi vs low lvl mobs : easy fights, with a decent XP reward
jedi vs high lvl mobs : not possible to defeat stuff even a master swordsman on life can solo atm
=> lightsaber damage seems to be reduced against hvy armor, even though light armor and no armor doesnt grant a damage bonus because of the LS vulnerability. how can this be?
=> moreover lack of armor makes you get just too much damage. keep in mind that not every template will be wether master defense or master enhancer. you want diversity then better give the robes some good resitences soon.
everything else seems to be pretty ok. good job Devs.
Locky-1138
Sun Jun 20, 2004 7:53 pm
#55
Lightsaber accuracyis to low to be effective in PVP.
fight a TKM/Fencer with Center of being on, and you will miss 100/100 tries.
compair, the two worst professions for pvp when it comes to hitting your opponent
Commando, 110 accuracy (cant hit the broad side of a barn)
Pike 160 accuracy (swing and miss)
then you have TKM with 205 (they dont miss very often, but they can still miss) <-- this is where jedi needs to be at master saber! try adding +100 accuracy to your base values, 175 for saber 4004, and 200 for master.
Sage1
Sun Jun 20, 2004 7:59 pm
#56
I cant post much because of bd health now or play as much, but wanted to say...
1) Jedi's r not to powerfull at all and the PvP Jedi fights r not to long because if u think about it, its suppossed to be hard to kill some1 who is a Knight or any1 who is trying to do the FRS. The more Powerful the Jedi is the more Defficult it should be to kill, or ppl would cry foul.
2) Jedi in no way to Powerful, I for 1 am a Padwan and Tested myeslf against 1 MBH, and he was Winner bar none, any MBH can kill a real Padawan and Its more of a problem of other Jedi not Haveing their correct Ranking displayed. So MBHs stop crying because ur not supposed to kill high end Jedi yet.
3) It was wrong to do away with Defenders powers of Shield and Armor....... Very bad idea.
40 The 15k xp loss for dieing each time is nothing short of rediculous. I can see it for high-end Jedi, but for us lowlie Padawans with no skills its plain stupid; although 5k would be ok to me.
5) Thanx for makeing me an honorary Jedi and i still hope ppl care enough for my final wish, thanx....
D3st0r
Sun Jun 20, 2004 10:10 pm
#57
Jedi vs Jedi feels just about right, nothing is too overpowered or underpowered imo
Jedi vs other, its kind of hard to tell since there are no real normal profession masters on TC2 other than Bounty hunters
Jedi vs npcs is perfect
But the one main concern I have is our amazingly low Accuracy mods. +100 Accuracy? How does a Jedi Master have only +100 accuracy? We miss way too often, even in the last system we missed way too often now its alot worse. TKA have above +200 Unarmed Accuracy, Carbineers have huge accuracy using ranged weapons none the less, and a Jedi with a Lightsaber is only half as accurate? Something is wrong with that. Unless the system is going to be changed to where +100 means never missing and every other professions accuracy will be scaled down with us sitting at the top, otherwise something needs to change.
Xodarap777
Sun Jun 20, 2004 10:45 pm
#58
I don't plan on going jedi, although I will go FS if I can apply it to other professions.
However, I do have an opinion about jedi vs other professions. At most ranks, it should be possible, but very difficult for a group of players to take ona jedi. However, no one ever hits a jedi with lasers of any kind, unless the jedi is somehow restrained. In Ep 2, you see jedis effortlessly blocking thousands of blaster bolts flying at them from all directions, redirecting many of them back at the droid that shot it. In my favorite scene in all of the movies, which perfectly shows the total invulnerability of a dark jedi master (or jedi master), Han Solo sees Vader in Empire (after being betrayed by Lando), and this obviously master pistoleer / master smuggler shoots at Vader several times. What does Vader do? He blocks the blaster bolts -- with his hands! No saber necessary. He then simply pulls the gun from Han, no problem. This goes for BHs, too. Could you imagine what would happen if Boba Fett would have tried to kill Vader? Not a chance in a chance in Hell. No group of non-jedi, of any number, could have taken Vader. Of course, Vader was exceptional, even for a master. But Obiwan was a master and was even to Vader; Yoda was a master and couldn't have been taken by any group of PCs either. Masters are completely untouchable, and should be. Knights are VERY close to untouchable. Any knight that really knows the game, his/her specials, timing, tactics, etc., should never be hurt by PCs. That isn't to say that a smart MBH shouldn't be able to take out a jedi that's not so quick on his toes.
Just my two cents, yet again :-)
For my part, I just want to be an FS chef or dancer.
Xodarap777
Sun Jun 20, 2004 11:06 pm
#59
Ergh, that was a stupid post from me. Rambling nonsense with no point or purpose. My apologies, I can't edit it 
AldeonAvardulin
Mon Jun 21, 2004 12:13 am
#60
Pick up intimidate.
Netninjax wrote:
Jedi vs Other Professions = Ranged defence is great if your a master defender. Melee is a complete joke. I am a master saber master defender and was creamed by a TK, Fencer. Oh not to mention cant land a freaking hit on them or land a state.
Cheetara
Mon Jun 21, 2004 11:15 am
#62
Reading these, everyone has the same problems I do....
Forced to go Defense and saber line and not enough SP for the useful skills
SP costs need to be adjusted.... This would fix most of the concerns/complaints here.... You should be able to master 2 trees and dabble in the other 3, or master 3 trees + a couple novice trees to really feel like jedi and have enough basic skills + some elite ones to survive in PvP and keep your interest in Jedi...
Zertus
Mon Jun 21, 2004 11:55 am
#63
My summary of testing and balance (jedi v jedi). With the jedi revamp it was planed to make jedis more different but what will happen? Most player will choose a template with Master Lightsaber, Master Enhancer and two lines in Healer. This is the template I saw working well in most longer PvP fights and most other templates did not work. Why? Therefore we need to compare the trees and what they give for Jedi pvp:
Master Lightsaber: high damage, high defense, damage migration
Enhancer: defense, high damage migration, utilities
Healer: Healing
Defender: high defense, damage migration (negative: damage migration not working versus Lightsaber)
Force wielder: damage (negative: very high force cost)
How should it be (my opinion):
Master Lightsaber: damage, defense, damage migration
Enhancer: defense, damage migration, utilities
Healer: very good healing
Defender: high defense, damage migration
Force wielder: very high damage
SWG start again getting that problem most mmorpg have: the balance between a ranged/mage like class and the melee class. For the jedi pvp the balance is strong on the melee side. Most jedi v. jedi battel end when one side runs out of force or when one is not Master Lightsaber.
So now jedi can not only choose to be black or white they can also choose to be unique or uniform jedis what is equal to be gimped or not. It is a bit sad because I see a lot of potential in the new system.
One solution to make this better would be to define what the strength and weakness of a tree are and with that in mind to balance it against the other trees.
Master Lightsaber: high damage, high defense, damage migration
Enhancer: defense, high damage migration, utilities
Healer: Healing
Defender: high defense, damage migration (negative: damage migration not working versus Lightsaber)
Force wielder: damage (negative: very high force cost)
How should it be (my opinion):
Master Lightsaber: damage, defense, damage migration
Enhancer: defense, damage migration, utilities
Healer: very good healing
Defender: high defense, damage migration
Force wielder: very high damage
SWG start again getting that problem most mmorpg have: the balance between a ranged/mage like class and the melee class. For the jedi pvp the balance is strong on the melee side. Most jedi v. jedi battel end when one side runs out of force or when one is not Master Lightsaber.
So now jedi can not only choose to be black or white they can also choose to be unique or uniform jedis what is equal to be gimped or not. It is a bit sad because I see a lot of potential in the new system.
One solution to make this better would be to define what the strength and weakness of a tree are and with that in mind to balance it against the other trees.
NewJedi
Mon Jun 21, 2004 2:19 pm
#64
Last night (Sunday, June 20), my Jedi's PvE damage seemed MUCH higher than previously. I mean, three or four times as high. He was doing 3000-3500 damage a pop with some light saber specials; it used to be more like a few hundred. I solo'd a bunch of Nightsisters without much trouble, except that my Force usage seemed a bit more rapid than before. In general, this seemed more fun.
I didn't get a chance to do any PvP last night, but I'll try tonight.
NewJedi
Mon Jun 21, 2004 2:21 pm
#65
Oops, I forgot to post my Jedi stats, and for some reason my edit button isn't working. I have 0404 saber, Master Defense, Master Force Enhancement.
I'm a Dark Jedi Knight rank 0. I lost rank 1 simply by not playing for a couple of days, which I find very annoying. It's bad enough we have to pay "maintenance" for homes and whatnot, making this game feel like a job. Now even Jedi have to check in regularly. Bleh.
But my major point is that damage finally seemed about right.