Development Cycle Archive

Thread: Friday Feature Errata... Part 2...

Thunderheart
Wed Feb 04, 2004 3:53 pm
#53












Imperio59 wrote:

Sorry to Hear TH had to take the blame again for a design decision. I personally KNOW TH Cares, but some people see him as an information dispenser where they can push his buttons 24/7 and get back info about upcoming stuff.


And like with dispensers, when it doesn't work to their liking, they kick it and beat it around until it DOES work and give them the right info. TH is a real lvie person with feeling, let's make sure we don't break him, cuse he's a VERY valuable asset, hmm'kay?







Thanks


I understand you guys get frustrated and I can handle that, just try to help me think through challenges so we can get really good answers to challenge the devs with. FWIW, I do care very much and the reason this came up today is I went BACK into the pit to get this decay thing worked out.(and let me tell you, people hereare starting to groan when they see me coming.... ).


Here is the important thing. There is a huge community for this game. Roughly 20-25% of the game community come by the boards and roughly 10-15% post regularly.


*inserts sap and corn*


If we make this a nicer place to be, more and more people come to the forums and get involved, conversations become more interesting and stimulating. We really can work through this to make this the most fun game possible and the best forums, but it takes time and cooperation.



*rolls up sleeves*


Im not going anywhere, how about you?






Kurt "Thunderheart" Stangl
Community Relations Manager
AnXdiety
Wed Feb 04, 2004 3:53 pm
#54

I just want one thing explained out of this. Yesterday TH valiantly proclaimed over and over and over and over that a death is a death is a death. That you have no manner of tracking it. Now you come back to us and tell us that we have to wait yet another month for the removal of decay in PvP. By adding a 'faction perk' that removes decay from pvp orientated situations means that TH's entire arguement yesterday was all for not. Since you can add an item that tracks the aforementioned why then can you not remove the decay from PvP entirely as was promised to happen this month.





Anxdiety / Anx'ty

and all those voices in my head have every right to be there

Hoonge
Wed Feb 04, 2004 3:55 pm
#55

How is decay important?


Armorsmiths don't need more business. I don't know how many want more business. I don't die in PvE. I just don't. I don't PvP much (yet... I'm back on the fence now that you are leaving the decay in the game for some asanine reason) so I don't die. My armor decays with use. I don't know if you guys understand this or not because I think if you did you'd make armor function as weapons do. As it stands, there is a double penalty for dying. If we died (especially in PvP) we obviously had damage done to us. So our armor decays for that ammount. Then, if we die, insured... we have 1% taken off. Most good composite has at least 34,000 condition. 1% of 34,000 is 340. Not a lot, but its still a sizeable chunk on top of what was already incurred when just using armor.


Tailors, yes they need help. But decay isn't doing it. Our clothes still work with 0 condition. Even the mods work at 0 condition. Also, a large market for tailors is entertainers. I personally have had the same clothing for the last... 3 months or so. I'm not the target market. My dancer friend has 4 or 5 outfits that she wears on any given night of entertaining. She doesn't fight. She rarely leaves the cantina. Nothing of hers is decaying. So this isn't helping anyone.


Decay makes no sense. If you insist on making things decay, then have them decay if they aren't insured. Make insurance matter. Hell... slap a 10-15% decay on uninsured items, but make NO DECAY on insurance (thats the point of insurance, no?). I think thats a nice compromise that would please both sides. Coupled with this new idea that makes little sense, it could make PvP something that people want to participate in, while making death in PvE something other than an express shuttle to the nearest city.





Nizro Norea
Getting back to my melee roots...

Dewdus
Wed Feb 04, 2004 3:55 pm
#56

Thunderheart, since you aren't going anywhere how about answering the core issue, why does armor decay twice, when weapons don't?



Ruldon Otta
Master Bounty Hunter
undeadrooster
Wed Feb 04, 2004 3:56 pm
#57

Overlooking the covert exploits... the GTEF exploiting... theissues of Defense Stacking and wookie armor(all of which I'm hoping will be either hotfixed or settled with Patch7), I've thought from the implementation of decay that it was ridiculous for armor and weapons to suffer decay twice. They have an inherent decay on their own. Thankfully, the weapons decay was removed. The armor decay though is still in. I can understand if armor has to have decay in order for clothing to decay(if they're somehow linked in the code?).

The reality of the situation ingame is that it if you die frequently and don't have a doctor on hand with you, you can go through a set of 300k-500k composite in a week. With the GTEF issue, if you PvP, chances are you're going to die a lot in a few minutes. Throw in a couple of big PvP events in a day, and your armor is now completely worthless in a few hours.



_________________________________________________________
I got banned from Bria and all I got was this stupid T-shirt
"I swear I did not have sexual intercourse with that Bantha."
Strength of an idea doesn't involve silly things like the truth or logic, you just make proclaimations as loudly as possible without leaving room for compromise.
TickTock
Wed Feb 04, 2004 3:57 pm
#58






WickedAsh wrote:

FYI Folks .. decay drives the buying and selling going on in the universe. If you never had a suit of armor go bad why would you replace it? This creates a demand, thus the great cycle of capitolism is born in which you the consumer need something and we the manufacturer provide the services.









Armor decays by taking damage, halfwit. I can burn through high quality ubese pieces in as little as a few days, and they aren't cheap either when you have the 70+% stuff. There already is high demand. Why do you think armorsmiths fill their swimming pools with heaps of cash? It's not a slight to armorsmiths, but they aren't exactly hurting for business...
Rezael
Wed Feb 04, 2004 3:57 pm
#59

JustG, TH, Q3P0, Anyone Who Will Listen,


You guys need to step back, and think. This game is a game of conflict. Leveling is too Easy. I can Master a number of professions in a Day and all the others in a Week or Less.
Content? The monthly story arcs that come out every 3 months and i can finish in an hour? How about missions and content? They suck.-- You know I am telling the truth here, The missions are lacking any imagination and devoid of any real challenge....

Whats Left - High Level Content/MOBS

They are soo out of wack that its impossible to kill a krayt/NS without using the cheap commando burn tactic.

PVP - This is where the game highlights....
Players Mix and Match Professions and Have All Out Battles!

But due to decay and our items gettings destroyed and insurance costs youve taken away the only real reason to play this game. and then when you said decay was gone from pvp the Forums Echoed Woot! We Have Been Heard...and Now you screw us.... Faction Perk for no decay??? So now i have to spend some faction, to go pvp all day, and if i die I lose MORE faction and then I AM FORCED to grind more FPS to PVP because i dont know about you i cannot afford 500k for composite everytime i want to do some pVp and with your totally Out of Wack TEF system PVP NEVER ENDS.

So Developers HEAR US OUT NO DECAY ON PVP DEATHS.

NO DECAY ON PVP DEATHS!

NO DECAY ON PVP DEATHS!

Got it?

Rezael I am God. And God Says "No Decay on PVP DEATHS"

GOT IT?



~ Rezael Slyblade ~
~ SYN~

~ Stacking Your Naritus ~

~ Turning Fine Imperials Into Skeezers Daily ~
MCPrimetime
Wed Feb 04, 2004 3:57 pm
#60

Screw this. DO YOU GUYS WANT A WAR OR NOT??? Get rid of decay, put the stupid faction perk in publish 7 fine, but get rid of all decay for publish 6.



MCPrimetime
Jingles
Jrockin

Arnwald
Wed Feb 04, 2004 3:58 pm
#61

JustG,


ty for stepping in, Th sorry for all bad that was said, don't worry you are still doing a good job and we love you *HUG*


Now JustG, your team messed it up and you have to repair the mistake that was done long ago : decay on non insured item. You agreed people don't want it and you are still thinking it is good for us and the game. Let me tell you I don't understand you in this...


Some ideas, in case you don't know what to do now... *grin*


Constructive alternative on decay :



Remove 1% decay on insured items on PvP AND PvE


Constructive alternative on death penality (from former doc):


  1. bring back corpse run on non insured items
  2. make cloning a painful process :


  • BF wounds (you need some love, go and watch some entertainment)
  • Temporary loss of random skills (you have to recover your mind after cloning)
  • High wounds on non cloned death

Constructive alternative on"love" for crafters:


  1. Actual allready decaying stuff with usage :


  • armors
  • weapons
  • food
  • meds
  • vehicules


  1. Improvements :


  • clothes decays with usage
  • tools decays on usage
  • harvesters decays on usage
  • houses decays with time so you need to buy an house repair tool from an architect instead of paying maintenance fees


Constructive alternative onmoney sink:


  1. remove the maintenance fee from houses
  2. replace it with a tax on houses based on the number of items you have in it
  3. implement structures and / or furnitures decay
  4. create an architect repair tool to repair the structures


TY

BatosaiB
Wed Feb 04, 2004 3:58 pm
#62

you Know TH I know your trying to make both sides happy but we are the the side that feels cheated I mean we were sooo happy that we can finaly PVP again!!! I called lots of my friends that quit this game due to Decay and unfair deaths (LD while PVP) they all got excited about this and were resubscribing until this came up


Atleast remove PVP decay ............


/sigh I donno whats going on there............



Batosai-x
~ Master Swordsman ~
~ Master TKA ~
" And there was much teasing.............."

ArteL
Wed Feb 04, 2004 3:58 pm
#63

Sorry TH, but I think I may just have to go somewhere.... and for this exact reason...

you finally come and post on this thread... AFTER having JUSTG come and cover your ass (which he should have, don't get me wrong)


and then... NOT ONE MENTION of any of the points that are being brought up in this thread.


Can you comment on anything???

Explain how this is helping Tailors and Armorsmiths again?

Explain how the system can't track deaths?

Explain how this whole thing was put in writing in almost 4 different places, and yanked at the last minute

Explain how you see JUSTG every morning, and you go into meetings non-stop and talk about our issues, and then NOT get this information communicated to you?


Could you PLEASE try and answer any of these questions?


If not, then I will roll down my sleeves and go somewhere else.
TickTock
Wed Feb 04, 2004 3:58 pm
#64






Fatcheen wrote:

The only valid complaints against decay that I can see are...


1) Factional armor

2) Regular armor


...since both of those decay by themselves as it is, and factional (namely ST) armor costs a bunch of FPs.


The rest of the stuff should decay, Is it really that big of deal that you have to buy another 100 credit surveying device? If you don't want something to decay leave it in your house or in the bank.







Most people don't really care if their survey device decays. But at the same time, it (like camps and other nonsensical things) costs 250 credits to insure one survey device. People want the convenience of 'Insure All', but they don't want to insure meaningless crap like survey devices in doing so.
JustG
Wed Feb 04, 2004 3:59 pm
#65

Glad you brought up the Droid post. Let's use that as an example of how things change.


I said, in my newsletter, thatthe January publish would be focussed on Droids. After that, Lucas and SOE agreed that Publish 6 would be focussed on the Imperial Crackdown, for two reasons:



1) Increase the feeling of Imperial oppresion to make the game more Star Wars feeling

2) Give us the time necessary to treat the droids with the amount of energy they deserve.


In Publish 6 (the publish I referred to), the following things are happening:


l Added general module slot to the advanced Binary Load lifter droid, and both basic and advanced protocol droids.fficeffice" />


l Droid storage compartments are now using droid experimentation rather than artisan.


l Droid customization tool now gives droid crafting xp instead of general xp


l Droid socket modules can no longer be plugged into one another.


l Multi-crafting station module droid capabilityfixed for some cases where one type would over-ride another type.


l Combat-related stats removed from examine windows for non-combat-capable droids


lItem Storage Module 2's now really are that, instead of becoming data storage module 2's during the crafting process.


l Added transition from combat to normal idle for Probe Droid.



So while Droids are not the MAIN focus, we are addressing some of the DE issues. In the next two publishes, after crackdown, we ARE focussing specifically on Droids. We plan on implementing combat droids (< level 10) in P7, and Utility Droids in P8.



Herein lies the main problem with telling the players anything. Things Change. Things change based on the current state of the game, and the desires of our publisher. And the second that they change, you drag up old posts and start screaming LIARS!!!



Do we lie to you? No. Do we tell you information that changes? Absolutely.



But things are going to change. If you want more information, you have to be prepared for that information to change. That is the very nature of MMOG's.



I want to keep you very informed about what is happening in our studio, for your game, because it really is your game. We are trying to have open discussions with you. We are trying to get the In Concept> In Dev > In Test > In Live system working. Please understand that this business is extremely unpredictable at times.



thx,



- g





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