Development Cycle Archive

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Calandryll_SOE wrote:
Tracking
The system will track the status of the GCW for each individual planet. Players can affect the status of the GCW through placing factional bases, both PVP and PVE. The longer a base remains in the world the more it benefits the faction. PVP bases count far greater than PVE bases. Initially Tatooine, Corellia, and Naboo will be affected by this system.

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All well and good. But.

How do I win the war? Can it even be won? Or is it just a sliding teeter-totter sensitive to sniping that is utterly meaningless as an endgame mechanic?

What's the endgame?

--doogie

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Legej wrote:

Darter wrote: "the Rebels want to keep the population drug-free just as much as the Imperials."

I disagree, the rebels are not a police force. They're a military force trying to free the galaxy from the tyrany of the Empire. The laws would be left up to the loval government. In the case of Imperial occupation, they consider their laws to override any local laws.

Anyhow, this is not a game breaking item and would have little impact, just my 2 cents for Star Wars accuracy.

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I think it's in the best interest of the Rebels to keep their ranks drug-free, yes? If a Rebel carrying spice gets scanned by a Rebel force, then they're getting penalized for not maintaining discipline. The Rebels surely don't want a bunch of drug addicts fighting for control of the galaxy, both from a perspective of needing a well-maintained fighting force as well as the public image they'd like to avoid. The Rebels are trying to stand for everything that's good and pure, and spice doesn't fall into the category.

And if you're an Imperial carrying spices...well, they won't care about the sice. They're just attack you because you're Imperial.

Message Edited by Guamarhea on 02-09-2005 04:45 PM

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DoogieHozer wrote:

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Calandryll_SOE wrote:
Tracking
The system will track the status of the GCW for each individual planet. Players can affect the status of the GCW through placing factional bases, both PVP and PVE. The longer a base remains in the world the more it benefits the faction. PVP bases count far greater than PVE bases. Initially Tatooine, Corellia, and Naboo will be affected by this system.

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All well and good. But.

How do I win the war? Can it even be won? Or is it just a sliding teeter-totter sensitive to sniping that is utterly meaningless as an endgame mechanic?

What's the endgame?

--doogie

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Guamarhea wrote:

Just to clarify Darter: I am not trying to cut you down, nor am I one of the "vocal minority PvP players."

From the sounds of your post, we probably have a lot of similar experiences in-game. I am left out sometimes too...but then my character is a Smuggler so I don't always want to be smack in the middle of the GCW

I honestly think our true problem really isn't with TEFs or the GCW per se (although the GCW does need a lot of work). It is with the handful of uber-leet players with a template that cannot be beat. Frankly, I see a lot of those folks as being on par with or better than Jedi...ie some kind of mythical super being. While every profession should have some advantages over others, there is simply no trade off right now because of templates and stacking. A "perfect template" with buffs and armor beats all comers. Period. Hopefully the GCW changes and the CURB will address that.

As a Master Marksman or Master Pistolier, I wouldn't mind getting attacked by other players if I thought I had a chance. Instead, the current system allows melee players to overcome ranged weapons at great distance. Furthermore, the disparity between the uber players and simple master combatants is SO great as to be ridiculous. I'm not saying that certain templates shouldn't be better, but they shouldn't be THAT MUCH better...just make it a little more reasonable is all I'm asking. If the Dev's did that, I think the even current TEF system would be a lot easier to swallow...and acceptable to a lot more people like us

Message Edited by Guamarhea on 02-09-2005 04:40 PM

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I agree with you, but I think that the new system will really create a much more open-ended game for all the players. People avoiding the GCW due to the "uberleet" players can now participate if they wish and avoid them.

For PvP players, the game isn't changing at all for the negative. The existing PvP system will still be in place for the most part, and there will be whole new opportunities. The only difference will be you can't go after the people who don't realize they have a TEF. Now PvP players will only be able to fight people who WANT to fight, and not people who either been suckered into something or caught in a bad situation. Sounds better to me.

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Guamarhea wrote:

Just to clarify Darter: I am not trying to cut you down, nor am I one of the "vocal minority PvP players."

From the sounds of your post, we probably have a lot of similar experiences in-game. I am left out sometimes too...but then my character is a Smuggler so I don't always want to be smack in the middle of the GCW

I honestly thinkour true problem really isn't with TEFs or the GCW per se(although the GCW does need a lot of work). It is with the handful of uber-leet players with a template that cannot be beat. Frankly, I see a lot of those folks as being on par with or better than Jedi...ie some kind of mythical super being. While every profession should have some advantages over others, there is simply no trade off right now because of templates and stacking. A "perfect template" with buffs and armor beats all comers. Period. Hopefully theGCW changes and the CURB will address that.

As a Master Marksman or Master Pistolier, I wouldn't mind getting attacked by other players if I thought I had a chance. Instead, the current system allows melee players to overcome ranged weapons at great distance. Furthermore, the disparity between the uber players and simple master combatants is SO great as to be ridiculous. I'm not saying that certain templates shouldn't be better, but they shouldn't be THAT MUCH better...just make it a little more reasonable is all I'm asking. If the Dev's did that, I think the even current TEF system would be a lot easier to swallow...and acceptable to a lot more people like us

Message Edited by Guamarhea on 02-09-2005 04:40 PM

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I agree with you here. This has caused PvP to be exclusive. This and gear.

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thule wrote:

I have said it before and i shall say it again..the people who are so opposed to PvP combat is due to the fact that as the game stands now none of the npc's (factioned or not) use any of the same special abilities as players despite their difficulty...aside from a mild damage mod (undone by armor) and more HAM (more shots) there is no difference between the imp private and the storm trooper. If the npc's of level presented an appropriate challenge (not just high resist and HAM) then it would matter less if it was a PvE or a PvP battle that sent you to the cloning chamber. If a character is able to do battle with an npc they should be a viable combatant in PvE as well.

Let me remind everyone that when the CURB hits it shall provide a fix to many of the problems we currently face with combat..and thus with PvP combat. All of these things are not unrelated issues..they are all part of the same game and each fix,update and patch brings the game one step closer to bringing us all into the GCW, regardless of profession.

There are a few good points made by both sides of the PvP vs. PvE disagreement and i believe it will get fixed...my biggest concern IS watching a bunch of combatants (from either side) running amok killing npc's of the opposing faction while a bunch of special forces look on helplessly...so here is my suggestion.

Let special forces players (overts) have access to a strike team command..only to be used against combatants of the ouher factin who are actively engaged in battle wiht faction npc's.

Reinforcements for the overts..to aid the PvE defence of bases or cities. I do feel that the Devs. are taking steps to ensure that PvP is still both viable..valuable..and entertaining as ever. With PvP bases counting for much more in the GCW the players who choose to fully support their factin will be deciding the outcome of the war. For those who don't like the idea of player called reinforcments why not? PvP'ers will be dropping the PvE bases as it is.

Major Mazrath Thule

Imperial army

Flight officer of the imperial inquisition.

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Message Edited by wookie-mart on 02-09-2005 04:48 PM

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Valkyrie36 wrote:

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DoogieHozer wrote:

All well and good. But.

How do I win the war? Can it even be won? Or is it just a sliding teeter-totter sensitive to sniping that is utterly meaningless as an endgame mechanic?

What's the endgame?

--doogie

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I would vote for teeter-totter. I have played games (WWII online) where the war was won or lost. Come back the next day and everything is reset back to the the start. I think this will be a struggle where the side can claim advantage at times. That in itself is a victory. The question of "who is winning the war" will be readily answered at all times.

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And how would this be any different from the current GCW, except for more explicitly exposing the score? In fact, it can be said that on many servers, one faction or the other already dominates, effectively "winning". But, their efforts are meaningless, since there's no way to win with finality. I fail to see how lacking an endstate will not result in the same sort of apathy that already exists.

Some would assert that one is "Not supposed" to win, due to the period. So, then, why bother? In fact, it might even more interesting for the bored, hard-core PvEer or bored PvPer that one be on the -disadvantaged- side, since the threat level is higher.

In my opinion, it would have been more imaginative for the Devs to come up with a system where factions were really "meta guilds" that could be formed between participating guilds, and the score kept track of at the "meta guild" level. Therefore the participating guilds could stage their own wars and have a game mechanic keep score for them. How they managed endstate is up to the "meta guild" cooperative... one might provide several options.

Similarly, one might have "Hutt" and "Valarian" factions vying for control, alongside the "Imperial" and "Alliance" factions, all within the same "meta guild" framework. You can conceive of all sorts of cool wars one could stage if there were a little bit of cleverness applied to the design.

--doogie

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Straker_Atrella wrote:

Carry your sliced and illegal stuff in droids then. Those don't get scanned. YOu can carry up to 50 illegal items in droids (10 each.)

Maybe instead of complaining about great changes, you should use all your available assets.

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I would like to point out that unless they change the way scanning works, it is possible to be detected as a member of the opposing faction even if you have NO illegal goods on you.

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Valkyrie36 wrote:

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thule wrote:

I have said it before and i shall say it again..the people who are so opposed to PvP combat is due to the fact that as the game stands now none of the npc's (factioned or not) use any of the same special abilities as players despite their difficulty...aside from a mild damage mod (undone by armor) and more HAM (more shots) there is no difference between the imp private and the storm trooper. If the npc's of level presented an appropriate challenge (not just high resist and HAM) then it would matter less if it was a PvE or a PvP battle that sent you to the cloning chamber. If a character is able to do battle with an npc they should be a viable combatant in PvE as well.

Let me remind everyone that when the CURB hits it shall provide a fix to many of the problems we currently face with combat..and thus with PvP combat. All of these things are not unrelated issues..they are all part of the same game and each fix,update and patch brings the game one step closer to bringing us all into the GCW, regardless of profession.

There are a few good points made by both sides of the PvP vs. PvE disagreement and i believe it will get fixed...my biggest concern IS watching a bunch of combatants (from either side) running amok killing npc's of the opposing faction while a bunch of special forces look on helplessly...so here is my suggestion.

Let special forces players (overts) have access to a strike team command..only to be used against combatants of the ouher factin who are actively engaged in battle wiht faction npc's.

Reinforcements for the overts..to aid the PvE defence of bases or cities. I do feel that the Devs. are taking steps to ensure that PvP is still both viable..valuable..and entertaining as ever. With PvP bases counting for much more in the GCW the players who choose to fully support their factin will be deciding the outcome of the war. For those who don't like the idea of player called reinforcments why not? PvP'ers will be dropping the PvE bases as it is.

Major Mazrath Thule

Imperial army

Flight officer of the imperial inquisition.

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Bomber strike for the ground . Its an Idea i'll give you that.

But honestly, the people killing the NPCs are not doing anything to disrupt your game.

The flip side was that you could disruptour game. Now the PvP folks can play their game and the PvE folks can play theirs and we can all be happy. You may even end up with some more PvPers when the choice is now in our hands and the stakes are higher. I know I will only put up with having to fight my way to the starport for so longbeforeI decide it in my best interest to help clear out some PvP bases on my planet.

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