Development Cycle Archive
Thread: Live Issues Publish 9: Secrets of the Force
maybe there shld be a timer .. till hes done loading and +5 sec or sth like that, till hes attackable.
shld be same with being overt also, if it isnt already.
I understand that the equip delays are to prevent exploits due to the rapid switching of weapons.
I offer this constructive advice. The problem seems to be:
1. The delay is entered in the combat queue.
2. The delay happens before equipping.
3. The delays are annoying when there is no combat even going on.
I came up with the following idea, which I think would prevent exploit, and eliminate most of the complaints.
1. Keep a timer on each 'slot', slot including armor/clothing slots and wielded weapons.
2. Player can equip each slot instantly, and many slots quickly in succession.
3. However, once equipped with armor or a weapon, that slot is frozen for say, five seconds, AFTER the slot is equipped.
4. During that delay, the weapon or armor can't be removed or swapped in that slot.
5. Since the combat queue is not involved, players can defend themselves in the meantime.
Complaint: Players switching between different weapons with DOT to exploit stacked poison.
Solution: #3 says that once a weapon is wielded, it must be held for five seconds, limiting the rate at which weapons can be changed.
Complaint: Players switching armor on and off rapidly to exploit the game.
Solution: Once worn, armor must stay on for the delay time.
Complaint: Player has to wait 45 seconds to equip suit of armor, standing around in his/her underwear while waiting for segments to arrive.
Solution: Each slot is separate, so there is no delay for each part of the suit. The whole suit can be equipped instantaneously. Each piece of armor has to be worn for at least five seconds afterwards.
Complaint: Target has started to run, player selects ranged weapon, has to wait.
Solution: As long as the melee weapon has been held for more than five seconds, the weapon switch can be instant.
Complaint: Long delay to equip armor when not in combat.
Solution: Delays are now after equip, so suit up!
Complaint: Incapped while waiting for armor to equip.
Solution: Armor equips instantly if the slot timers are not running. Not using the combat queue means that even if you mess up, you don't lose your turn at combat.
Complaint: User interface (toolbar) does not reflect state of chosen armor, causing confusion.
Solution: The delay is gone. If the player attempts to equip/remove armor during the slot delay, give a message to the effect of "must wait xx seconds", just like for medicine use.
This also solves the problem of people wanting to show off their nifty tailored clothes (or image-designed fur!). It's safe to be casual, equipping up if surprised with an attack.
Respectfully submitted,
Rusty
Give you an example... Normal pvp fight for me would be... (against less experienced players and as a pikeman)
Normally I run around with my high damage pike in case I come across an unbuffed subject... so in the event that I find a buffed target...
Swap weapons to Mind Fire Lance
1) Apply mind fire and kd the subject
Swap weapons to Mind Poison Lance
2) Apply mind poison and dizzy the victim
Swap weapons to Stun Baton
3)Warcry and let them sink in
when warcry wears off, hit subject on head very hard with stun baton... When poison/fire wears off/is cured or subject dies...
Swap weapons back to damage pike...
back to stage 1
Now it's more like...
Run around... see a buffed target...
Swap weapons to Mind Fire Lance
Delay so take a couple of hits... if I'm up against a Master Rifleman or anyone with an exceptional/legendary weapon, i'm dead... If I'm still standing when the weapon is finally equipped...
1) Apply mind fire and kd the subject
Swap weapons to Mind Poison Lance
Delay so if the target is a doc the fire is probably now healed so was pointless... pity it has a very limited use, but nm, we continue... oh and still taking hits because in the meantime the target has stood up
2) Apply mind poison and dizzy the victim
Swap weapons to Stun Baton
Another delay, but this one doesn't really matter that much as the dizzy is pointless now as the subject is standing once again... oh and take more hits
3)Warcry and let my Master Pikeman damage (dots are only Pikeman damage as kinetic is useless and so is electric for pvp against 90% resists) sink in, except they don't as due to the delay they have already been healed...
By this time i'm normally dead...
Now, imagine fighting a master doc/elite combat prof who know's what he is doing... I used to have a chance as I could apply dots, state changes, posture changes etc... at the same rate as he could heal them using havla, so that he either had to choose whether to keep healing until his havla wears off, and then run, or try and kill me as quick as possible then heal his dots and states before he dies from them... Now, however, a doctor who doesn't really have a clue how to use his skills in pvp canheal anything I can throw at him way way faster than I can apply it... Unless I don't swap weapons... But after hunting NS forever, I have yet to find one weapon which has average damage, and more than one decent dot... Normally decent fire, poison and disease are on three separate weapons, not all on the same one... Making it essential for a pikeman to change weapons...
I also played a BH character for a while... was great fun, got the feeling of a character who has a multitude of weapons and can swap between them to best suit his situation... NPC running at you, pistol comes out and kd's... carbine comes out and does some damage while dizzying, then move in with a light lightning cannon and shred him... I can only imagine what poor BH's have to go through now...
Thunderheart wrote:
Camrux wrote:TH,
Hasn't the Jedi aspect of the "instant armor" been rendered moot? My understanding is that Jedi are now unable to wear armor or would their robes be considered armor. I realize that there may be other issues that you are looking at as well like swapping DOT weapons and stacking them. Could there be a more effective solution here such as applying a DOT timer instead of an equip timer?
No, Jedi can wear armor - - they just can't wear armor and use Force powers. And fwiw, its not *just* because of Jedi...there were other instances as well. That was just the best example.
Do force powers include sabre specials? If it does not this unbalanes PvP horribly as everything is vulnerable to sabres and even with many unarmed people on a jedi it is easy to use a multiple target special and take them all out easily(this happened last night to my group). Hopefully all the balancing wasn't finished on testcenter.
Thunderheart wrote:
Camrux wrote:
TH,
Hasn't the Jedi aspect of the "instant armor" been rendered moot? My understanding is that Jedi are now unable to wear armor or would their robes be considered armor. I realize that there may be other issues that you are looking at as well like swapping DOT weapons and stacking them. Could there be a more effective solution here such as applying a DOT timer instead of an equip timer?
No, Jedi can wear armor - - they just can't wear armor and use Force powers. And fwiw, its not *just* because of Jedi...there were other instances as well. That was just the best example.
i can understand that. however i disagree with the decision. and i disagree with it because it really wasnt that big of a deal. it made having multiple combat templates viable. it made entire professions viable. bounty hunter is even more gimped than it was before. comando is more than useless and this takes away what little use the FT actually had.
if you want people to group together to go durni hunting just say it. ill go do something else. if me soloing NS elders and krayts is disrupting the world so much ill stop. there are lots of other games to play until JTL.
i loved SWG because ididntHAVE to group to go after the hardstuff. but i could if i wanted to. i had a lot of fun slinking into the death watch bunker solo taking 3 hours to get half way to the bottom. without the ability to rapidly switch weapons and specials it is just getting stupid to play. fun is being removed and it just seems that you guys have blinders on. everything is turned into an exploit.
i just dont understand why it seems the devs are bent on taking out the fun of the game and concentrating on boosting and balancing for the .01% jedi population.
Thunderheart wrote:
Camrux wrote:
TH,
Hasn't the Jedi aspect of the "instant armor" been rendered moot? My understanding is that Jedi are now unable to wear armor or would their robes be considered armor. I realize that there may be other issues that you are looking at as well like swapping DOT weapons and stacking them. Could there be a more effective solution here such as applying a DOT timer instead of an equip timer?
No, Jedi can wear armor - - they just can't wear armor and use Force powers. And fwiw, its not *just* because of Jedi...there were other instances as well. That was just the best example.
so the ONLY valid justificiation for this change is the small population of FOTM whores who see nothing wrong with abusing game mechanics as much as possible, and they're only able to do the lance crap because of Sony's fetish for uber loot and total disregard for crafter economy.
They are inconveniencing every player in the game because of the actions of a minority. This problem could have easily been solved with no trouble to the majority - all they had to do was REMOVE OVERPOWERED DOT LOOT WEAPONS.
Thunderheart wrote:
No, Jedi can wear armor - - they just can't wear armor and use Force powers. And fwiw, its not *just* because of Jedi...there were other instances as well. That was just the best example.
Liakewrrlofro wrote:Vehicles in the toolbar do not work. I see this has been removed from the publish notes - but it did say that Tuesday morning.Group UI is not fixed. In fact it looks the same. I still see the same person 5 times in my list, all on different planets, while he is standing next to me.I can deal with the delay on weapons and armor. In fact, I think it's a pretty good idea. It should not occur when out of combat though. Furthermore, if you want to make it so everything goes in the queue then you need to make a command that immediately purges your combat queue. The Clear button isn't quick enough in most combat situations and it would be best to put something on the toolbar.Unless you're a Jedi or a BH it is like this patch never existed. Jedi got things fixed, BH's got screwed. I'm neither so if you fix the clear queue command I'll be set.
Ctrl+Backspace clears the combat queue.