Development Cycle Archive
Thread: IC 1-5: Combat Roles; Commando
Commando is the Heavy hitter. He may not hit fast, but when he hits, its a big hit. He is not the grunt, he is a support role. He needs a group, he can not take on a strong opponent with out help.
What basic combat elements should they possess?
He should not be in the back, he should be helping the melee, support for both the ranged, and melee classes.
What offensive abilities?
Hits hard, big front end damage. Pro at hitting with Heavy weapons. Can use other weapons, but excells at using the big toys.
What defensive abilities?
Very little. He should not be able to solo the hard stuff. He should need to use support to kill.
What unique abilities?
Heavy weapons, grenades, and destroying Vehicles, and structure.
Should add what advantage or asset in group combat?
Makes everyone happy when he is in the group. A commando should be needed when destroying a base. He also should be needed for taking out ATST's.
What should be their unique role in the Galactic Civil War?
Needed for taking out Vehicles, bases and heavy vehicles.
Commando should be a pure support role -- the tank busters and demolitions experts, NOT the power hitters like Riflemen. One does not fire an AT-4 or a Javelin against a single Iraqi guerilla, one uses an M16A2 assault rifle.
What basic combat elements should they possess?
Support functions: demolitions, mine-setting and clearing, anti-tank/vehicle weaponry, etc.
What offensive abilities?
Grenades, demolitions, and so on.
What defensive abilities?
Get rid of the flamer and acid rifle lines, and replace them with support weapons. Why oh why oh why are there no E-WEBs in this game? This would be perfect for the Commando profession -- allow them to set up E-WEB and other heavy weapons emplacements, much as a Musician sets up a nalargon or ommni box. Give Commandos the T-21 light repeating blaster as well, for less concentrated but more mobile support fire.
What unique abilities?
See above.
Should add what advantage or asset in group combat?
The ability to lay down a large volume of fire as well as anti-tank and specialized demolition roles.
How could/should they interact with other professions?
Require an assistant to maintain a good rate of fire with the E-WEB, or a loader for rocket launchers and the like.
What interaction / dependencies should exist with other combatants?
As above.
What should be their unique role in the Galactic Civil War?
The support kings, they provide specialized damage and abilities, but have little direct combat abilities against the core combat professions.
What defensive abileties?
I think commandos should be very hard to knockdown with "knockdown specials"
How often do we see a commando in anymedia or realitybeeing knocked down without a good fight??
To me Commandos was always somebody trained in infiltration and guerrilla tactics. In SWG concept, however, commando is nothing but a heavy weapons specialist. In SWG's reality, commando is the guy waving the flamethrower.My notes are based on the first notion - trained infiltrationist.
What defines theCommando role in combat? Ability to sneak-in "behind enemy lines", and cause a major ruckus, by using either bare hands, explosives, or heavy weapons
What basic combat elements should they possess? ability to use bare hands,variety of weapons, explosives, and stealth tactics
What offensive abilities? should be the only ranged class to be able to take on multiple enemies at ones,and win.
What defensive abilities? stealth. should be able to camouflage within environment, or dissapear in the night/storm/etc.
What unique abilities? engaging multiple enemies, stealh, explosives
Should add what advantage or asset in group combat? act as a Spec Ops unit. can either reinforce the group's fire power with weapons/skills, or use stealth and explosives to set up an ambush
How could/should they interact with other professions? needs equipment and heals. Not as good in unarmed orin basic ranged weapons as elite classes. Not as good in stealth/scouting as scouts and rangers. Yet, is a unique class, due to a combination from all basic skills, and a unique skillset.
What interaction / dependencies should exist with other combatants? should depend on help frommelee fighters in unarmed combat, and assitance from ranged fighters in a blaster-fight.
What should be their unique role in the Galactic Civil War? Infiltrator and guerilla fighter. Capable of sneaking in behindNPC patrols,setting up ambushes, taking oncouple targets at once, using explosives, and being able to camouflage from other players.
What defines theCommando role in combat?
Area o
What basic combat elements should they possess?
What offensive abilities?
What defensive abilities?
What unique abilities?
Should add what advantage or asset in group combat?
How could/should they interact with other professions?
What interaction / dependencies should exist with other combatants?
What should be their unique role in the Galactic Civil War?
Currently, I think Commando is more set up as a "Shock Trooper" or "Heavy Trooper" with its flamethrower, acid rifle, and heavy weapons. A true "commando" is more based on demolitions and stealth. However, using the current build I think "Shock Trooper" is more interesting, and my repsonse is based on that theory (so lets change the name from Commando to something else, ehh?)
What defines theCommando role in combat?
"Commando" should be a damage dealer of the highest order, but somewhat fragile. Extremely powerful short range attacks with the flamer and HAR to clear bunkers and buildings; Extremely powerful long range attacks with HW's against hard (armored) targets; grenades for short range state changes.
Area of effect anti-personnel attacks;
Area of effect armor-resistance debuffing
Heavy Weapons anti-armor attacks
What basic combat elements should they possess?
No special state attacks (except for armor debuff and DoT)- pure damage dealers on normal weapons;
Grenades applying AoE state attacks specific to each grenade type
What offensive abilities?
Two main attack weapons:
Keep flamethrower as is, but reduce its long range accuracy beyond 20m with a HUGE penalty
HAR- specials should have an armor de-buff that reduces a targets armor resistance % by a certain amount for a certain period of time, working as a DoT.
What defensive abilities?
None. Commando's role is pure damage dealing.
What unique abilities?
Massive AoE DoTdamage with Flamer but at short range;
Armor de-buff with the HAR;
Status effects with Grenades (dizzy, posture change, root);
Heavy armor penetration with Heavy Weapons
Should add what advantage or asset in group combat?
A massive damage dealer used to take out large armored targets or many smaller soft targets; grenades for status effects; armor-debuffing with the HAR
How could/should they interact with other professions?
Commandos will be sought after for their ability to deal raw damage through specials and DoT's, as well as reducing armor resistances with acid attacks
What interaction / dependencies should exist with other combatants?
A very very poor tank- relies on all melee classes to aborb damage
Need riflemen for long range support (HAR and Flamer having short ranges, HW's having limited shots) and Carbineers for aggro control
No med skills so relies on medics/docs/comm for healing and buffing
What should be their unique role in the Galactic Civil War?
Clearing trenches or bunkers with Flamer; Destroying turrets and bunkers and armored vehicles with HW's; Acid attacks to reduce armor benefits; a Shock Trooper that is first in to soften the enemy or standing fast in the rear launching heavy weapons.
Given the basic considerations listed above, please answer the following questions:
What defines theCommando role in combat?
Firepower, Commandos are the clenched fist of military formations. They are the ones who's singular responsibilityit is to stand face to face with an enemy at range and blow him off the battlefield.
What basic combat elements should they possess?
Heavy Ordnance, EOD (the ability to disable minefields), Breaching (the ability to bypass or destroy defenses like doors and walls), Demolitions (the ability to destroy a fixed target by means other than melee combat. Placing bombs, wiring explosives and whatnot)
What offensive abilities?
Their currentRanged combatabilities are acceptable, though some additional Hand to hand attacks would be welcome. Commando CQC is NOT a martial art like Teras Kasi, its closer to dirty fighting. Sucker punches that KD, Dizzy or Blind should be a part of their repetiore as a part of the Field Tactics line.
What defensive abilities?
Current Damage Mitigation for ranged is fine, some thought should be put into adding Melee Mitigation in concert with adding some hand to hand abilities. This is more an offensive class, it should be fairly weak on the Defense
What unique abilities?
I think you guys have given them acceptable uniqueness, just round them out a bit more. Some weapon like the Flamethrower or Acid Rifle with AP3 should be considered. LIke a Plasma Cannon or something.
Should add what advantage or asset in group combat?
What they already add, unparalleled offensive firepower.
How could/should they interact with other professions?
As the fist of a formation.
What interaction / dependencies should exist with other combatants?
Dependencies on others ought to be for healing, precision fire (sniping, bleeding), status ranged attacks (KD, Dizzy, etc.), and tanking (CH or Melee specialists), enhancement (culinary, chemical, or medical), and obviously crafting of weapons and armor.
What should be their unique role in the Galactic Civil War?
They ought to be asdreaded a sight for a base defender as they are for an ATST commander.
As a further note, a true "Commando" would make more sense having prerequisites based on unarmed, pistols, and all of Scout. Stealth and demolitions and specific specials based on pistol and unarmed in the tree would be used, while dropping HAR, flamethrower, and the HW's.
The "Commando" as SWG has set it up, with the Flamer and HAR and HW's, is a Assault Trooper/Shock Trooper/Heavy Trooper type build.
What defines the Commando role in combat?
This actually should be, what should define our profession in combat, because we currently don’t have any real definition. We are simply a person with a powerful DoT; and that is all. We need to be better defined. More along the lines of:
The Commando profession is a crowd controlling, anti-tank/facility, overall an armor cracking profession. They should have some means of controlling advancing crowds, an E-Web, even if deployed by another profession, would help. We have Heavy Weapons, have them reflect this, the damage needs to be on par with the things they are meant to destroy.
Basically going one on one with a ranged elite, should not be a good idea for us. This is because we are not a fast gunning type of guy. We don’t run and shoot all that well; but if you ARE hit by us, you should feel some large amount of pain. We crack armor like it’s nothing, and we can show this with AP damaging weapons, and lots of them.
What basic combat elements should they possess?
Basic combat abilities should fall under weapon usage. Things that their pre-requisites show for; so having Unarmed abilities, as well as having the Ranged tree is Marksman effect the Commando combat bonuses would be something good and basic to start with. Also they have a tree called Field Tactics; this should either be re-named Demolitions and made with said demolitions skills... or give us something that fits the field. *A field camp, or terrain negotiation makes sense here*
What offensive abilities?
Commando needs to be a high damage dealing profession, with crowd control capability, almost like making them an EQ Wizard/Enchanter combo. If a melee catches up with us we’re gonna get smacked pretty good, but we should have escape tactics for this, and we should hit hard but with a decent delay. Although we are Warrior *Ie: Meatshield* too, because we have to be up close and personal using some of our anti-personnel skills, which explains us being a hybrid.
Now as a starting Commando, you should see this damage output, a sort of "WOW!" factor. Now as you progress this damage gets an increase, with the weapons you use, and access to better Heavy Weapons. This keeps you going "WOW!" but now the speed and accuracy get even better. So you can see a definite improvement with all of your abilities.
So essentially, the Commando for offense, needs some way to deal high-end damage, but with the risk of a delay to this. Though this damage should balance with the DPS of all the professions out there. Currently in a 30 second combat time frame the Commando cannot compete with the other professions out there on damage output.
What defensive abilities?
The Commando is required to take up Unarmed 1-4 before they become a Commando; and yet these skills are rarely used again by a Commando. Defensively the Commando needs some form of escape tactic, to get out of Melee range *making their Unarmed requirement make sense* and back to shooting.
Also the Commando is the big burly type of fighter in my eyes. Them and Swordsmen are the two I see as similar, just one ranged, and one up close and personal. A Commando should have some ability to put armor on with less cost, making their toughness make sense. This would help define them.
What unique abilities?
For the Commando only; we need demolitions skills, of some type. Grenades to blow up groups of players at a distance, Det Packs to take out Turrets and AT type vehicles. Destruction of bases should also be our specialty. Those and the only one able to man and use effectively the E-Web blaster cannon.
Should add what advantage or asset in group combat?
The Commando should armor cracking, all around damage dealer. If you need Acid, we have it, cold, done, heat is covered, etc. Also you have a problem with a high HAM with AR3 NPC/Critter we’ll punch through that armor for ya.
How could/should they interact with other professions?
The Commando should rely on some of the other professions for help. They need Weapon and Armorsmith obviously. Doctor and Medics, Entertainers, the usual support people. But when it comes to combat the Commando should rely on and fear Melee as tanks. Though when it comes down to a ranged player they should be able to take the brunt of the hits to themselves and keep on coming to take that person down.
What interaction / dependencies should exist with other combatants?
Well this is essentially the same as above, fear and need melee as a tank, but ranged just doesn’t seem to drop them. *Think of the scene is "The Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers" where the Orc with a torch just keeps going, no matter how many shots Legolas plugs into him*
What should be their unique role in the Galactic Civil War?
Unique role? Simply they should be the demo team that can take out a Turret or Tank harassing their group. Run up to said AT-AT, Turret, AT-ST and set an explosives pack. Now run out of there with Burt Run A.S.A.P. before it goes off and does 6 digit damage to a 40m AoE. Now to balance this, the packs need to be very expensive, can be disarmed by Slicers, and can hit anyone *friend or foe* within the 40m or whatever the AoE is.
I personally just think the main problem with commandos (I"m a master commando) is their lack of diversity. I mean every other profession has a good selection of specials to choose from to add depth to them, commandos have 1, flameSingle. I don't even count FlameCone as a seperate special as it's the same except is an area attack. Now, while flame is awesome, and high dmg, I would love to have a wider varietly of unique specials at my disposal. Then there's the Heavy Acid Rifle (HAR), this is by far the most pathetic weapon in the game. Besides shooting invisible balls of acid, it is slow and weak, and all round ineffective and basically a joke compared to the Flame Thrower. The first question you should ask yourself when evaluating that weapon is, "why would I use this over the flame thrower?" The answer will be there is no reason, even fighting mobs 100% resistant to flame, and vulnerable to Acid, you'd still be better off using your flamer with a DoT, that's how useless this weapon is.
So, my suggestion for commando would be to give us more diversity, add more unique specials for us to use so maybe we can do something besides flame single 2 all day long, revamp the HAR to at least make it viable as a second weapon.
In general though, for all professions, I feel they all need more weapons, currently we're basically using the same weapon throughout the course of the game. Carbiniers are using laser carbines from carbine 3 in marksmen, on through master carbinier, that's not right. FWG5 comes at pistols 4 in marksman, and is still one of the best, if not the best pistol through master pistoleer, save the scatter if you go BH with it.
There needs to be more profession specific weaponry so everyone isn't running around with the same weapons for the length of their gaming life.