Development Cycle Archive
Thread: AT-ST changes on Test Center
Well here is my personal opinion
1. AT-ST is no compotition for flames from commandos. When 3 shots from flames specials will kill it perm. Its not worth it to grind hours upon hours to get an AT-ST for 9.5k to a human, much less aliens. I think i heard and may be wrong on this a zabrak needs 19k faction points to get one, when it will only die in 4 shots for the over popular commando class. I have watched a commando take 4 of them down with flame, before he finally died. So for a human thats what 38k faction points down the drain? Or perhaps a portable method of extinguishing the flame on them. Like a fire extinguisher of some type.
2.The lack of ability to repair them, other than datapad, but by the time you would have a chance of storing them, if they survive they have 90% wounds and that would take like a month of not using to heal. Give us back the option to heal them.
3. AT-ST in faction missions WHAT IS THE**** POINT! You still dont get faction points for the kills your AT-ST does, much less getting half or 1/4 faction points for ones you shot but is shots also. great i kill a rebel npc on a mission with my at-st i shot it 20+ times and it shots it once and i get 2 faction points. If your going to restrict it to faction only missions, dont have it steal the faction points from you as it IS THERE TO HELP YOU ON THAT MISSION, AND ONLY THAT MISSION TYPE!
4. 1 Pet at a time out. Thats fine. No change there much, because some imperials cant even keep 1 long enough to get a second. I know i couldnt ever keep multiple of them.
5. Rank - mentioned early in the first couple pages, was rank, i am very much a fan of this impliment as it will help in theory to reduce the over usage of AT-ST's.
Side note. Dev's study every character on every server and came out with that results that something like 15% of everyone on every server was rebel, where imperials were at a huge amount of 7%. Then you ask us what can be done to encourage people to join the imperials. But then after that you take away the major remaining advantage that Imperials have over rebels. Is this your way of encouraging people to join the side of the imperials? Because if it is i really think that you should re-think what you would call encouragement.
--Draconius--
Flurry Server
Like people have said, where are all the droids? Where is the big picture? Why all this energy to remove any reason to be involved in the galactic war? Since you actually will be under fire, there should be a good reason to join a faction. One pet, and suspect armor will not cut it. Add to that the dubious AT-ST, it's the last straw...
Let the number of faction pets be decided by rank, as a number of people have mentioned... Creature handlers or no creature handlers, you destroy faction benefits here, and not in a minor way either.
The only strong point I saw in joining the Imperial faction, was the pets... The rest of the stuff is mostly junk... And I am killed quite often... I need some kind of incentive to stay with my faction. Can you possibly see what you are doing here? I believe the big picture need some adjustment.
The galactic war is a centerpiece in this story, not some kind of afterthought. I guess you want a lot of blue players around, it's certainly how I would have done it...
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Ummm rebels cant heal faction pets... why should you be so special.. your stormies are twice as stong as rebel troops... use those. get over it, the ATST is WAY overpowering and you all know it and are just complaining because they are finally doing something to change that. as long as you can no longer usethem to camp force sensitive and camp kryat ect...then it gives everyone a equal chance at killing and getting good loot. it's not right that you think the olny thing about being imp is the faction pet. and even WORSE you think ATST are a REASON for being faction. that just shows how pathetic the atst is that you cannot continue your way of hunting without it. Maybe you will have to rely on something called SKILL and good grouping to killPVE now... not just big tanks. Rebels have been doing it for ages. when was the last time you saw a reb pull out faction pets killing kryat? NEVER. how manyrebels pull out faction pets to raid? NONE. so you are better? or just less skilled? I'm sorry but think, if you are griping about THIS when imperial faction pets have about 12-30k HAM while rebel faction pets have about 9k you are griping about the wrong thing to the wrong people. seriously isnt all your whining about the uberleetness of commando? yes Commando are uberleet so how come somany are griping about the ATST who's OLNY weakness is a commando and not griping about the uberness of commandos? you are placing importance on the wrong point... yes you are right Commando can kill a ATST fast. but do you see any other classes killing ATST? NO. according to your complaints you prove that commando it too uber for you to handle.When I hear you say : " that pistoleer killed my atst" then I'll think you MAY have a argument about it's weakenss... but EVERYTHING but commando are easily incaped by them. So quit your infitile whining.
We are all at the mercy of commandos. not just the atst and you all know that, but wont state the real complaint.
it may be a little late to add, but please don't make the AT-ST vulnerable to ANY DoT effects. I know commandos are supposed to be better able to take these things out, but when's the last time you saw a US ranger take down a tank with a flame thrower? Missiles are supposed to be the bread and butter of AT-ST removal, so please make it that way (which also means upping their damage to be more in line with other heavy weapons that cost the same but do half again as much damage.
Also great fix on the only 1 pet thing. ! and great fix on the at-st's not chasing down wild animals.
The problem most Imps see is the COST of an AT-ST Human 9460 FP non human 18920-28380 FP and there is no way to heal them at this time
Gorath/Imp
What does being a creature handler and having pets have to do with commanding troops. Pets are stupid animals, no intellegence they only handle simple commands and perform those tasks with reckless abandon if handled correctly.
Troops are intellegent beings, creative thinkers and as a result should be easier to command.
You ever see a woman walking three poodles down the street on leashes? They get all tangled up, run this way and that, the woman is screeching at them to stop, and basically she has her hands full.
In the military I have been able to command a squad of troops. Tell them the objective and direct them to the best way to get there. Line them up and have them walk in unison down the street. Leashes are not used, though sometimes it could be argued they are needed.
In short, limiting to three factional pets makes little sense, I agree that they should be fighting the way and I only use mine to that end, but I still should be able to use them, heck I don't even have an AT-ST
Grrr...
I work out that as a mon cal it's gonna take me 84 hours of faction missions to get the 28000 fp needed foran atst. Thats just over 3 DAYS NON-STOP FP GRINDNG! Nobreaks,no sleep... not even timeout to go to the medical center lol.In real Life terms thats gonna take me a good 4-5 weeks because I actually wanna do other things in the game, not just running back & forth from a recruiter everytime I get a chance to be online for a goodcouple of weeks. And at the end of it I get something that can potentially die the first time I get it into PvP?!
That's why, since I joined the Imperials a few weeks agoI have at no point seriously considered or wanted an at-st. It would be one of the biggest wastes of my time and space (and money, considering I'm paying for this game). In gaming terms it'd be likere-mortgaging my house to buy a sports car so that I could enter into a destruction darby!
You'd have to be mad to consider it!I am in totallly agree that we should get somthing back for all the time put ito raising the faction to get an at-st. I spent months grinding faction to get my AT-ST's and now u guys are lowering faction costs as well as usefullness of the creatures. It is not fair that we should be penalized for playing the game since launch. The rebels are always crying because we have AT-ST's. But are they gonna cry when space expansion comes out and they get x-wings that are vastly supirior to tie fighters. Since Imperials are sooooo outnumbered in this game I feel like our voices are never heard. I feel like we are always getting nerfed because there are so many more rebels that thier voices drown ours out. It is not fair that we should suffer for being outnumbered. I started this game with 70 other players from my guild. We are now down to 10 because of various changes u have made nerfing different professions. I am also master smuggler which is just about as useless in PvP as an architect. U guys spend all ur time taking things away so that less rebels will whine and have still never fixed what was supposed to be Han Solo's class in this game which was supposed to be one of the best. I have no bonuses to accuracy, aim, while moving, unarmed, nothing. But please hurry and remove some of the only perks I do have. I guess majority rules in this game and that majority is rebel. So good luck balancing out ur war. I am sure people are gonna be racing to go imperial now. U could just strip us of all our pets then maybe the rebels would be happy. We are already disadvantaged enough by the amount of rebel players. We cant even hold our own cities. Can u just leave us with what we have, cause it's not much........
Thanks again sony
Pretty much, I'm going to sum up what I think is the best way to handle this debate..flamers ready....
1. Make the AT-ST a combat vehicle usuable only by the highest ranking players, and at an insanely high cost.
2. Have the AT-ST have a single damage bar which can be wounded, and does not regenerate pool damage. Pool damage may be healed only with items that work like batteries (perhaps a new item addition, such as a power core, or some device that recharges large equipment), repair droids, or Players with a specific skill that allows them to do so. Wound damage must be taken in to either NPC repair depots, or to Players with a specific skill that allows them to do so, such as droid engineering.
3. Upon incapacitation, the AT-ST's entire pool damage meter will be wounded, and will not be usable until it is taken in for repairs. If, after a certain amount of time, the vehicle is not repaired, it begins to decay, and eventually will be unable to repair. If the player is inside the AT-ST, he immediately is killed (slain).
4. Tie both Faction Pet levels, and Faction Pet numbers into either Faction Rank, or -both- Faction Rank and Squad Leader. As with creature handler, faction pets will be bound by their difficulty levels, which will determine what you can call upon, and how many (personally, I can see myself controlling 5 Stormtroopers, as opposed to 2 or 3 Dark Troopers). Upon incapacitation, these Faction Pets will permadeath, though it would be convenient if a Surgeon were able to revive them, within a certain amount of time.
5. Whatever you do, do NOT tie faction hireables you may call to what -Creature- Handler level you are. Doing so is completely ridiculous and should not even be concidered, though matching the CH system and using it with another profession (such as Squad Leader), or Faction Rank is probably one of the smartest ideas possible, aside from creating a brand new proffesion all together.
There, I've said it. Some of you have probably already posted some ideas very alike to a few of these, and if so, sorry for repeating it. Personally, I feel the Squad Leader proffesion should grant you a few faction bonuses, especially if something like Smuggler can at least make faction items cheaper. I'd be more than happy to post extended information on these ideas, but I fear the post would be too long. Anyway, I'm done. Later.
Frankly, I have to say this is a load of complete crap. The best creature pets (specifically graul and to a lesser extent rancor) have a number of very excellent advantages over the AT-ST. Allegoricaaly, I have been told a graul/rancor will beat an AT-ST, they have very similar HAM, armour and damge. Perhaps the upcoming patch will change this. ButI will justifymy opinion of the current AT-ST weaknesses, as follows:
1) creature pets' damage can be healed by medics, AT-ST's can't except by being stored for a significant period;
2) creature pets can have mind damage AND wounds healed by a relatively trivial pet trick, spammable once combat finished;
3) creature pets' wounds can be healed by medics and food, AT-ST's can't, not even by storing, they can never heal damage;
4) creature pets can be buffed by doctors, AT-ST's can't;
5) AT-ST's cost 9450 fp (for a human, more for non-humans), a lot harder to get than big creature pets once you have the skill, just capture and leave in data pad until grown;
6) very significantly, AT-ST's cannot be healed of current disease/poison, a major reason for AT-ST wounds, creature pets can (and how the SW:G developers can justify having a mechanical device suffer disease/poison is completely beyond me);
6) Creature pets don't die, AT-ST's do;
7) And soon, AT-ST's can only be used factionally.
At least CH's will have a limit on the number of levels they can have called, this is much the same as only being able to have only one AT-ST out, but CH pets can be used on all occasions.
CH's will have a big advantage in the GCW, they can get and maintain creature pets a lot more easily than Imperial non-CH's can get AT-ST's. And SOE are wondering how to get more Imperial players?
Easy. Add a repair skill to a elite artisan profesion to maintain AT-ST's (and vehicles of all sorts, any future Rebel combat vehicles included). And make creature pet wounds treatable by a single profession (BE or Doctor), not just any old cretin who spends 15 skill points on novice Medic.
Further, why is an AT-ST available to any jerk who has the 200 fp for the very basic Imperial private rank? Why not make this a rank privilege (say, Captain or over)? Why not make the level/number of factional pets you can call also dependent on rank, much the same as the number of creature levels callable by a CH?
Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't this concept a design goal advertised on the previous SW:G development boards (rank will have pet privileges, in the number and quality of factional pets available)? Where did this get lost?
I'm tempted to become very critical of SOE SW:G developers, most especially the project leader, but I'll bite my tongue and leave it at that.
I've not read over the entirety of this thread yet, but has anyone mentioned the fact that a rocket launcher has heavy armor piercing?
If AT-STs armor is lowered to medium (which by the way is the same level of armor some humanoid bounty marks have), then a rocket launcher will do nearly 1.5x it's normal damage against an AT-ST.
If the commando doesn't want to DOT it for 55k Health damage, he can simply shoot it three timeswithrockets and flat out kill it. If it ever dawns on people that 3 commandos working together can slaughter an AT-ST in 2 seconds, you'll never see them again I fear, except maybe in a museum.
IF they make my AT-ST worthless to me, I'm outa here. And its not because I need one to play. Its because if they make them useless the time I spent obtaining one a farce.