Development Cycle Archive
Thread: Declaring overt
Possibly in addition to what one guy said to the effect of: only being able to declare once in a certain timeframe, say 15mins or more. I would add that perhaps"declaring" be on a delay, even a few minutes. This way you can declare anywhere, however you can not attack anything outright, and possibly give you the 5min TEF in the meantime in addition to it.
I believe that to be sound solution, but I'm don't see everything from every angle, so...
MCH/MRanger
MD/MCM
The way to revitalize pvp is simple. Provide incentives to being overt, not disincentives. People who don't "love" pvp have no incentive for going overt if doing so only causes them hassles from the potential of dying and losing their time. There is virtually no gain for going overt, so if you are a player who is on the fence about pvp, the vast majority of the time you'll likely be covert simply because its not worth the risk. Why not restructure the system to give incentives towards being overt and therefore pvping?
Give major incentives to going overt. Such as (if overt):
1) Increase FP's earned from missions by 50%
2) Decrease FP lost in pvp by 50% (disincentives kill pvp for people who don't "love" it)
3) Double FP's earned from DB'ing players.
4) Make item decay always only do 1% if DB'd by a player (again, major disincentives kill pvp)
5) Give a "salary" for time being overt. Imperials get 2k credits, Rebs get 1000 for each in game week spent overt.
6) Fix the darn TEF issue where people die and still have a TEF. Gets rid of bind camping, which will be a HUGE problem after item decay.
7) Borrowing an idea from above, make most faction perks require ranks, and after a certain mid-level rank, require the player to always be overt if they want that rank and therefore the faction perks.
There are many many ways to provide incentives to pvp. It makes the game more healthy, it does not detract from crafters, etc. More pvp = more death = more item decay = more buying items = more fun for all. And best of all, makes it so there is "more to do" after you've done it all if there is a healthy war going on.
The whole covert / declare / undeclare system favors ganking when the odds are stacked in your favor. Not an environment where you can need to expect pvp while exploring, it really only occurs near cities because it is so rare for people to be overt. The statistics the devs gave said that only 3% of the population at anytime were declared? What does that tell you? That tells me that the GCW is not as "vibrant" as many hoped. The simple way to fix this is to provide incentives.
Sorry, I cannot edit my post. Here is my edited post:
I DO NOT DECLARE OVERT - I want to be covert and just play the game.
I am content with PvE running my missions from my faction based mission terminal. I think the solution is to allow people to openly declare PvP or not. This could be set anywhere any time and allow them to have TEFs and everything else and fight each other to their hearts content. Only persons in PvP can actively particpate if they want. If thatwere the case than I wouldn't have an opnion on declaring overt or not.
I was NOT attracted to this game to fight other players. In the future I may change my mind, but right now it is not my playing style. I am still trying to get a handle on the game and I don't like being "hit" by other players when I am not quite sure what I'm doing. Some of the people playing have been playing a lot longer than me and have a distinct advantage.
I've just recently learned to macro my commands and use them in that fashion.
I am not into PvP at this time. I am to new for that. My problem is the TEF.
Currently, I am content with PvE. I have no problem getting a TEF when talking to the Imperial Recruiter or getting Imperial Destroy missions. However, I do have a problem with getting a TEF whenever I take Destroy Missions from the Mission Terminal - or kill an animal or something on the way home.
I also do not like when I have a TEF and do NOT know it. Perhaps allow a person to pick to be openly PvP and only those people can be attacked. Like I said, I'm not a big PvP person. It was my understanding reading things about the game that I could pick to NOT do this, however, I find out I don't have that real choice.
So my vote is to keep the game the way it is or allow those of us who do NOT want to PvP play the game for ourselves and interact with others and do our group destroy missions against the NPCs. Those who want to PvP - go for it - it's what YOU LIVE FOR.
Scratz wrote:
This is difficult to answer until we have some real world experience with the new changes. But I'm prone to liking any system that eases declaration. Its too akward right now. These are good proposals, but I think we need more. My suggestion:
-- An overt leader of a group can declare party members
This would make raids have a particular target for both offense and defense. Toss the TEF matches aside for a full blown battle to remove the heirachy of the opposition. Once the leader has been removed and loses his declaration, you can then pick off the lower players. Until that point, cloned players can redeclare and keep up the fight. This way there is a real end goal, rather than the TEF tag "clone wars" that have no end in sight other black HAM bars or bored players.
Sure, the leader could then hide in another city or far outside town, but doing that would decentralize the attack and weaken the group. Any cloned player would have to seek out the leader to redeclare.
Just my two cents. Flame away.
This is a brilliant idea (I know you're not the only one mentioning it)
It reminds me of a little game we used to play in JK2 called knights and kings where 2-3 defenders would have to guard a "king". If the king fell the other side won. It was great fun.
As it is now, there is no goal in PvP unless you are on a battlefield. Man I wish we used those more.
I know this may be a little off topic, but I think only one faction should be able to use a cloning facility at a time. And the control of the cloning facility could be switched through a terminal in the clone center or something.
brmatty wrote:...So my vote is to keep the game the way it is or allow those of us who do NOT want to PvP play the game for ourselves and interact with others and do our group destroy missions against the NPCs....
The game does allow you to exclude yourself from PvP. Just don't join a faction.
VERY simple.
As an Imperial I am trying to still decipher why Rebels are allowed to attack any overt Imp on site. Shouldn't this be the other way around? Given the time period in which the game is apparently supposed to take place...the Empire should be much more prominent and MUCH more capable than the Rebellion. I am not interested in creating an unbalance in the game, but why can't I walk into a rebel populated city and declare that they are ALL IN VIOLATION OF IMPERIAL DIRECTIVE 6.2A (or whatever)and proceed to RESTORE ORDER!
As an OVERT Imperial it would be nice to have an equal opportunity to strike first.
Well, Ioshi, I understand your point it is very simple to NOT declare a faction. However, I understood it to be different and found out it was not as I thought.
My point is: doesn't a neutral still get a TEF when trading or healing an Overt?? If this is true, then if and when I decide to "resign" from my faction. It will still be difficult to get the XP I want or need without getting a TEF. When a player has a TEF I am "temporarily" in PvP mode which I do not want.
I am new to this game. I just started playing. My character does not do much yet. I am stillworking on marksman and I am thinking of medic. I joined a PA for player assistance and friendliness. As a newbie, there are things that can be frustrating. I did NOT mean to upset you by my post. I was stating my opinion.
I still feel that I should be able to declare a faction and not PvP. PvP is not my thing at this time. I can barely take on a flewt lair - song rasps even do me in. It is still my feeling that this should be "declare PvP" or not "PvP" which is an altogether different issue to me.
IMHO - Perhaps the bigger issue is that a new player (for the first month) should be UNABLE to PvP no matter what.
Another reason for this being a great idea is accidently "retiring". I had a friend who did that by accident. He was a Warrant Officer 1, and when you leave a faction you lose rank. Naturally, he was quite annoyed at having lost that much faction points and standing. Its quite possible. I myself ALMOST misclicked before when attempting to go overt, and clicked the resign button. Luckily I caught myself instead of habitually clicking yes to confirm your intent to go overt.
I do hope you guys implement this in the upcoming patch. I'll be quite satisfied to see this feature present in the game.
Solution to all the crappy PVP battles.
First...You have to be within 120m of recruiter not 50m. At 50m people can still camp but if you extend to 120m that is enough area to stop the campers at recruiters.
Second...When you declare Overt you are Overt even if you die...you still would need to go to the recruiter to become Covert and and hour or so for becoming Covert is fine. Now to add to this, if you die and you are Overt you DON'T become Covert...you have 2 minutes to get to a safe area and at the end of2 minutesyou then become Overt. You would still be Overt but not appear Overt for2 minutes(allow enough time to get to safety and stop camping) This would stop camping at clone stations and stop camping at recruiters which would not happen if you made the 120m rule distance from the Recruiter. Also in the 2 minute period AFTER CLONING you still appear as RED but you are not attackable. This would stop people from ambushing someone by appearing Covert during those 2 minutes.
Third...Do away with any temporary flags...you are either Overt or Covert by the recruiter and that is it. Why should i be able to turn Overt by helping an Overt. NO! If you didn't declare you are not going to use some temp flag to sneak into the battle and backstab....Declare properly or stay out of the battle. It is all this temp junk that is ruining the battles. If you are Covert you CANNOT help...simple as that....if you want to help, go declare!
Fourth...To also help while travelling from planet to planet you would make an Overt a Covert for 2 minutes as soon as he landed to stop camping at starports and shuttle ports. After2 minutesyou then become Overt. This would be slightly different than the clone station 2 minutes. After landing you would not appear RED for 2 minutes so people can't just follow you as you land. When dieing and recloning you DO APPEAR RED because you died from battle and are not traveling. Get it?
Fifth...If while you are Overt and you die 5 times in 20 minutes you become Covert and cannot go Overt again for an hour....this will stop endless battles around the clone stations. There MUST BE A PENALTY FOR DEATH! I think 5 times would be sufficient. This would allow the battle to be long enough but not go on forever as they do now with everyone just recloning.
Sixth...Add alot more recruiters...both Imp and Rebel so if a battle is going on and you want to declare you don't have to hunt all over the **edit** place to do so. With the rules above implemented i don't see this as a problem.
Seventh...I believe you have a 75% less dmg in affect. Make it 95% less damage so fights can be fun....no fun dying after 2 shots or even one. Make gun fights last longer sotactics can come into play, not just target and run all over like it is now for so many.
Lastly...Beef up servers around the main battle ground spots like Anchorhead and Bestine so the lag isn't there. These are where battles are occurring in great numbers.
Note the 2 minutes mentioned can be adjusted based on testing. Also 95% damage can be adjusted to more if needed, based on testing.
SOKO