Development Cycle Archive
Thread: Roundtable Discussion: GCW and TEFs
Please go back and read Kade's posting. You simply do not understand how these systems are interconnected, and how if we are ever going to have a dual-sided war in SWG you must be held accountable for your actions against a faction by ALL members of the opposing faction - NPC and PC.
Spend your time "campaigning" for a completely different game - I'll spend my time enjoying what little dynamic content is already in the GCW, and eagerly awaiting the Devs making faction truly matter.
Go play PvE - there are ten planets full of MOBs that you can kill without consequence. Your problem is that you want to kill a specific type of NPC (Stormtrooper/Imperial officer) yet you are unwilling to accept the consequences that have been a part of the game since beta.
There are many, many locations (not just Rori, that was a single example) where many of us do factional missions all the time and don't have any problem. When we do, we take it like a soilder and move on.
Group TEFs and trade-TEF's need to go, but TEF is here to stay, and if it wasn't what little GCW we have would vanish. Whine all you want, myself and others in this thread have tried to help you, but you cannot help those that refuse to look outside their box and help themselves.
Good luck with finding a game that meets your criteria,
AO
AudioOrgana wrote:
Silver, one has only to look at your current .sig (saying anyone that participates in PvP is a "PK" - just that term is a bright, flashing red light) to know that your arguments are entirely based on stereotype.
No, it says the PK mentality of PvPrs ruin it for the test of the players. The PK mentality is not shared by all PvPrs, but is mandatory for the most successfull PvP players. They win at all cost, useing any and all advantages, including exploits and cheats to gain an advantage over all other players. The true and honerable PvP players are few and far between, and are the exception that proves the rule.
Please go back and read Kade's posting. You simply do not understand how these systems are interconnected, and how if we are ever going to have a dual-sided war in SWG you must be held accountable for your actions against a faction by ALL members of the opposing faction - NPC and PC.
I see nothing in Kades posting that says that PvE cannot be more included into the GCW.
I see it more as a rant against not enough opponents to play against because most of all the Factioned players play Covert.He thinks if they did away with the Covert Faction altogether, that these players would switch Factiontoo Overt and that the GCW would flourish.
IMO he is mistaken.
I thinkif they remove the Covert Faction, maybe a small percentage would go Overt, the vast majority would go Neutral.
If they wanted to PvP as an Overt, they would be an Overt already.
As it is, they are doing what I want to do, play the GCW as PvE, but are moreforgiving on the occasional PvP that comes thier way.
Spend your time "campaigning" for a completely different game - I'll spend my time enjoying what little dynamic content is already in the GCW, and eagerly awaiting the Devs making faction truly matter.
Interesting. Your saying im "campaigning for a completely different game" when im only asking for a few changes and additions that would make the GCW fun for everyone, not just a minority. What is interesting is that your resorting to this type of extremism in an attemptto win your point.
And have fun with your "Dynamic Content". Most players prefer actual created content that follows a storyline. I guess there are exceptions to that rule too.
Go play PvE - there are ten planets full of MOBs that you can kill without consequence.
Thank you. I am doing that now. I can kill one animal after another no sweat. ButI can do that in EQ, DOaC, WoW and any other MMORPG out there.But its not Starwars.
Your problem is that you want to kill a specific type of NPC (Stormtrooper/Imperial officer) yet you are unwilling to accept the consequences that have been a part of the game since beta.
Yeap I sure do. They are of the Starwars Storyline. And you are right, I wish to have no part of PvP. Just because it was in since Beta, doesnt make it enjoyed by the majority of players. No matter what the Devs do, Overt population of the game will never rise above 10%. Holocron admitted this a long time ago.Its time to stop catering to such a small minority.
There are many, many locations (not just Rori, that was a single example) where many of us do factional missions all the time and don't have any problem. When we do, we take it like a soilder and move on.
Im happy for you.
Group TEFs and trade-TEF's need to go, but TEF is here to stay, and if it wasn't what little GCW we have would vanish. Whine all you want, myself and others in this thread have tried to help you, but you cannot help those that refuse to look outside their box and help themselves.
Gee thank you for allowing me to whine all I want ( interesting that you have resorted to calling my posts "whines" ). I am greatly appreciative of of all the help you and others have tried to give me (even if it was in the tone of S.T.F.U., be happy with how things are.).
It is not me that has to look outside my own box, but for those like you to take the preferences of other players into consideration.
Good luck with finding a game that meets your criteria,
This game meets all criteria for me, except a few corrections that will bring PvE backinto the GCW like Holo and Q-3P0 promised origionally.
AO
Limbonik wrote:
silversaber wrote:
Ok, then letstake away 30% from the Neuatrals. Naw, lets go 50%. A nice andlargechunk that can pretty much cover the additional dummyaccounts you claim there is.
ThatSTILL leaves a significant portion that is still over twice the amount of percentages ofall the Factions COMBINED, Reb and Imp, Overt and Covert.
That says something.
Yes, it does. It says you are poor at math. If you take 50% from 73.69%, that leaves you with: 23.69%
If you add the totals of all faction stats (14.79% + 10.69% + 0.34% + 0.49%), that gives us: 26.31%
Tell me...where is this "significant portion" that is still "over twice the amount of percentages of all factions combined" you are so vehemently speaking of?It appears to methat puts us "evil PKers" at a +2.62% margin...
Message Edited by Limbonik on 07-12-2004 10:48 PM
Yea yea, rub it in.
My calculator broke! yea thats it....
Bad calculator!
Anyways, I contend that 50% of all Neutral accounts is to high a percentage for dummy accounts, even though there is not way to prove it.
The truely telling stat is the Over percentage. If you add together the combined Reb and Imp Overt percentages, its less that 1% (double checks his numbers) Yea, 1%. Even if you manage to get ten timesthe amount ofplayers to goOvert, that would stillbe less than 10%.
A clear minority, no matter how you look at it.
marsala wrote:
Sorry if this was allready posted.
You can PvE anywhere and not have to PvP.
Thank you for letting me know this.
Attacking a npc member of the oppisite faction should give you a tef and you should be able to be attacked by another player.
The "should" in your staement makes it an opinion, not a fact.
The Devs promised us a way to PvE in the GCW without TEFs in the form of Battlefields,but took it out promising to return it later. I am merely trying to get back the PvE GCW promised, but was taken away later.
If you put it to where if you PvE kill a imperial and no tef then you can have ones faction farming people's bases and base defences. Nothing better then haveing a rebel farm the imperial players base and then when done have the rest of the rebels attack with no base defences.
Your not reading my posts. I agree if they took out the TEFs, that purchased Faction bases would be exempt. But I seriously doubt that TEFs will be taken out completely
GCW has PvP a major part of it.
A situation im trying to correctMy intention is to make the GCW more balanced between PvP and PvE, instead of being dominated by PvP.
If you do not like that then do non faction PvE. Get mad at the hutts or those spice guys.
Sorry, not an acceptable alternative.
Whats so fun anyway about PvE GCW. Nothing beats attacking a storm trooper that has no chance at beating you or to stupid to know to come in numbers.
If you have to ask, then you wouldnt understand the answer.
silversaber wrote:
Yea yea, rub it in.
My calculator broke! yea thats it....
Happens to all of us, even on our best days.
Anyways, I contend that 50% of all Neutral accounts is to high a percentage for dummy accounts, even though there is not way to prove it.
The truely telling stat is the Over percentage. If you add together the combined Reb and Imp Overt percentages, its less that 1% (double checks his numbers) Yea, 1%. Even if you manage to get ten timesthe amount ofplayers to goOvert, that would stillbe less than 10%.
February was an exceedingly stressing time with Combat Medics in the GCW. A great many of us refused to go overt in an attempt to get the Devs to implement fixes to the bugs the CM profession were suffering from. (Hell, I think the vast majority of us completed the final story act covert as well.)
Unfortunately, it takes Jedi complaining in order to get it rectified now...after the damage was already done. Also after February there had been noticeably more Imperials remaining overt and while not as many Rebels, more were remaining overt as well. Bottom line is that we've been waiting on the GCW being fixed since August 2003 for the most part, so alot of us, while not being overt as often as we would like to be, remained covert until fixes were made which would give us the dynamic we had been waiting for...or at least gave us a reason to be overt.
As of this moment, we're still waiting on said fix. If they were to have fixed things plaguing us since beta (base shutdown exploits, ability to stack most of the professions needed to shut bases down onto 1 character, useless turrents, broken mindfields, broken battlefields, migrating base times, etc) you could be certain that the numbers would have been much, much higher.
-REMOVE TEF TOTALLY
-IF YOU ARE COVERT YOU CANNOT TAKE PART AT PVP
but with this change you also need to change the following things:
-MORE FACTION POINTS FOR REAL PVP, it should be the faster way to gain faction points.
-MORE FACTION POINTS FOR RUNNING FACTION MISSIONS WHILE OVERT
-IF AN OVERT DIES, HE IS COVERT FOR 10 mins, then automaticly turns back OVERT.
-in order to become COVERT he again, he must seek a recruiter, but there will be an 1 hour timer until he becomes covert again.
what this system will do: you will see way more OVERTS. GCW will finally be fun again, no more group tef issues, no more blue dots attacking you..... you always see your enemies. this will lead to an active PVP scene.
1. Get rid of Group TEF if you want to attack you should be overt. I can't tell you how many times I see one or two red dots, attack then all of a sudden there are 10. The other tactic I've seen used is the Coverts take up flanking positions, then the overt runs in, then the Group TEF'rs join in.
2. Bring back the Jedi TEF. If they use their force powers and somebody sees them, they should TEF. Since this was removed this has basically become Jedia Academy, with Jedi regularly camping starports and ganking non-Jedi, and it has also given them the freedom to grind away (I've heard of people making master in a matter of days grinding high level spawns).
3. Healing an overt player should give you a TEF (as it does now), buffing an Overt player should not.
4. Allow some way to get people hiding in public houses. Consider this scenario. Overt runs into public house, then put's on a looping peace macro. Anyone trying to attack them is TEF'd out of the house, but since they have the peace macro running they don't auto attack back and TEF themselves out of the house. The person is overt but untouchable really. You should be able to use a commando to "smoke them out" or some other method that allows you to finish the fight.
5. Attacking any NPC's of opposite faction should give you a TEF (as it does now).