Development Cycle Archive

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Stooby

Maybe there is a way to do both?

Hypothetical System - FS is determined by the badges you have recieved in the game, showing how much of the actual game you've experienced.

Mysterious Way - you don't know which badges you have to achieve so you go about doing everything you can in the game, ranging from visiting POI's to finishing Theme Parks - eventually you're bound to unlock your slot.

Known Way - There is a way to find out which badges you need (holocrons) but it is a long and involved, and personalized process. Say you take a quest to see a prophet who gives you some information (generated there and then) about where you can start the way of finding the Force. Then, as you continue along this path, you'd have to continually go to different places, do different quests - all with the aim of finding other "clues" which are generated there and then when you achieve those goals and find out which badges you need.

So those that want to can start the process of finding out what they need to do - which will probably take a lot of effort and would still require a lot of actual gaming instead of grinding. And those that don't mind can play the game and still perhaps come across the Force.

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Stooby

Hello folks,

Let me start off by saying that I left the game when the Hologrind was introduced. I tend toward the role-play side of the game, and the holocron implementation took the soul out of the game for me.

I've returned now because I heard they were redoing the FS and Jedi portion of the game. I just hope they get it right.

I've always thought that the Force should be implemented as a type of physics in the world. By reading: collecting texts and artifacts that are non-tradeable etc. you could slowly unlock the door to this separate set of game mechanics. This would include the ability to interact with objects in the game in a different manner than normal characters can as well as the base level force abilities that you see in the movies.

I also think that the starting quests/artifacts should be a mystery. I don't know how to keep it a mystery once fan sites and helpful guildmembers expose the way to become FS, but it should not simply be a normal quest. It's a tough issue indeed. Perhaps by having random quest generation for each character and limiting the number of characters that could work on the FS quest at a given time.

I'm also concerned about the presence of Jedi in the game. A previous poster stated that you can't have one class that is appreciably stronger than other classes in a MMOG. I agree to a point. One way around this problem is to make the death penalty for Jedi extremely harsh. Great risk, great reward. Permadeath should return.

Also, I think that NOT pursuing the path of Jedi should be fullfilling. I would love to have a crafter or a bounty hunter with certain limited force abilities. This would return a great deal of balance to the game. It should also be mentioned that in some of the EU fiction, non-Jedi characters wielded lightsabers. This would be a nice addition as well. I would love to play a FS hack: a character that was too much of a slacker to pursue the Jedi career, and threw together a "poor man's Jedi" template replete with lightsaber and basic force powers (that could fail at the most inopportune times). The lightsaber would also refuse to ignite occasionally as well etc.

Hope this helps.

O.

O.

Intelligence Officer
Imperial Special Operation Command
www.stormcommando.com

The path should be known. As has already been said, as soon as one person knows it, we will all know it. More simply why should I not know how to get the most enjoyment from the game?

We have been told that we will receive credit for mastered professions, how about 1 force sensitive box for each profession mastered when the change is brought in? That way the players who mastered 20+ professions (close to the average number required to unlock under the old system) would be almost complete. And no, I haven't mastered anything like that number myself.

It should be possible to obtain and complete force sensitivitywithout killing a single thing as it is possible to take all 24 force sensitive boxes without taking any combat enhancements from it. The path should not involve artificial time sinks, camping for ultra rare loot, template changing or any form of grinding. There are several static force sensitive NPCs in the game - Vader, Palpatine, Luke, the dark and light Jedi on Dantooine - make use of them to help players along the way, quests something like the Hero of Tatooine sequence.

Above all, make the process enjoyable in itself and not just the means to an end that the old system was

The Capel sisters, Taren & Dyoni
Taren - Dark Force Adept (killed by NGE)
Dyoni - Tailor, Weaponsmith, Artisan (killed by NGE)

I still think the best way to do this is the random professions style you have right now. This allows everyone to have to play many styles within the game and at the same time making it so it takes a great deal of effort to attain one's Force-Sensitive Character. However, I do believe that you should have never put in the holocron system. The obvious fallbacks to that system are already visible; holocron camping/hunting; taking away from other aspects of the game due to holocron profession grinding; making it that much easier to unlock. What I believe should have been done is telling all players the actual system "5 random professions" and letting them play the professions out on their own. Months and months ago I told some of my clanmates on voice what would happen as soon as the holocron system was put in place. I told them that soon there will be practically 5 jedi characters in every starport. Well, it looks as if it has gotten to that point. Now, what makes this so negative is that it turns away from the timeline of the game, with jedi everywhere you go. If the holocron system had not been set in place, there would still be many that have not attained their Force-Sensitive Character, let alone grinded through half of their Jedi Character as it is.
So, finally I must plead to leave the 5 random professions system in place, take out the holocrons, and go from there. We don't need 50 jedi in every starport. (by the way, for those of you who must be a smartass, when I say "every starport", I am being sarcastic, so keep your unneeded comments to yourself). And, one more thing, I have only mastered 2 professions as of right now, so this statement is not made by me because I am close to unlocking.

There are so many ways you could do this, being a game and all. But, why not consider a more "realistic to starwars" approach. Now, seeming that this is going to involve a great deal of amount of detail, bare with me.
I suggest splitting this into Force-Sensitivity Professions and the Jedi Professions (or more commonly known as rankings). For instance, lets go with the Force-Sensitive Professions first.

Your Force-Sensitive Professions will have little to do with being a Jedi at first, besides making you stronger. They are simply your level of knowledge, understanding, and controlling of the force. So, in essence, you could be very strong with the force and be able to weild it in very powerful ways and still never have become a jedi. The FS professions could work similar to a normal characters professions. Like your Enhanced Reflex profession, which could be a prerequisite to maybe Force Reflex (which might have things such as force speed and force jump). A skill point system should still be in place in order to vary and individualize different players. Though, the balance of this system would need to be set in place.

Your actual Jedi path would be different. Instead of making this a profession where someone can grind it in the same way as normal characters, there could be a player-to-player system along with other things you have already thought upon and implemented. For instance, to attain the rank of Jedi Initiate, there could be a long quest system in place that is totally player-to-nonplayer. Some sort of quest system where the player does not have to be involved with other players as of yet. Also, this quest could be done differently for each player. There could be paths within the quest that follow the Light-Side and/or Dark-Side. Once they reach the end of Jedi Initiate, by finishing the quest system, the player would be given a mark as of Light or Dark depending on how they went through the quest. Also, they would be directed by the last part of the quest to seek out a player Jedi of the same side, Light or Dark, that is willing to take them up as their Padawan. Thus, changing their rank from Initiate to Padawan. This should not be allowed to be done until the Initiate phase is completeed (and it should be long).
In the Padawan rank you would now gain skills and knowledge through your master (who would have to be of higher rank of course) by either increasing the speed at which you can go through the Force-Sensitive Professions and/or learning those skills from the actual Master. Now, one might wonder why someone would take on a Padawan? Well, besides the true feeling of actually role-playing (which some people don't care about) the benefits would be the next step after Padawan. Once you take on a lower ranked Jedi you change from Padawan to Jedi Knight. In order to further yourself along the Jedi ranks your teaching and knowledge you pass on to a Padawan would gain you additional experience/skills that would take you closer to the next step. Though, this would also need to be a long path. Now, if you really wanted to make this out the way a Jedi should be, you don't want to have Jedi Guardian, for instance, be the next step. Jedi Guardian is not a rank, but more a standing within the Jedi Order. Perhaps, once you take on a Padawan, you are given the rank of Knight, and at the same time able to choose which standpoint within the order you wish to go. Following other Starwars games I have played, you could easily split it into Guardian, Consular, and Sentinel. Each of these could be a class all their own, with different abilities and powers respective to the class. To advance from Jedi Knight to Jedi Master, three things will need to happen; 1) taking on a Padawan; 2) using up all skill points into force professions; 3) completing a Jedi Knight player-to-nonplayer quest. This Jedi Knight quest should involve more Light and Dark-side type missions, depending on which side the player has followed after the Jedi Initiate Quest. Once the quest is completed, the Jedi would then be given the rank of Master.

The next phase, and something totally different from the rest, would be the Jedi Council. The Counsil would be made up entirely of actual players, done with a voting system within the Council. The perks of being in the Council could be anything. For one, there could be player generated quests to be given out to other Jedi of any rank past Initiate, which could add more fun and rewards for players. Also, the fight against Light and Dark could be decided here. Unlike Bounty Hunter missons, a visit with the Council could give you the location of the opposing-sides Jedi, in order for them to be hunted down. The actual reward for doing this would not be any type of currency, item, or experience, but only the will to fight for your side and strengthen what you fight for. The Council itself would need to somehow be split into a Light Council and a Dark Council.

There are many other details, and more specific things I have thought on, but to write all that out would be simply too much to put on a forum post, and this post is already long enough for now. So, hopefully this post can offer some insight into the players mind, and maybe provide a base to go from when constructing paths within the game, for the future.

Due to the fact I rarely read these forums, I have added my email address below if anyone has any thoughts or would like to contact me and talk about these things. Thank you. Nonsense emails will simply be deleted.

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You are wise beyond your years, a sage for the ages, the master's master. That's why your Star Wars type is Yoda. Which character are you?

Read this and remember it is just a game...

Hummm Jedi themepark.I don't know,I have mixed feelings on this.Sure I'd like it to be known but I would also like the path to be unique for every player like a message or mail that says you hear a mysterious voice saying meet me at so or so place then you get there to see a npc that gives you tasks according to your profession,killing stuff,crafting things,dancing for high ups like Jabba,heal people from a dantari village that got a plague and so on.

So yes for me these kind of quests would be great.Should it behard?No,hologrinding was accessible to anybody not only to peeps that can align a zerg force of 20 people,So I don't see why the quests should be extremely hard and you would need the help of friends.The path should be soloable,after all when a jedi groups doesn't he or she generate visibility?Plus where is the mystery and mysticism if you are grouped,jedi should be like an initiatic quest that you alone experience.Now I don't say make it easy so that it's done fast.Length versus hard,I would prefer a very long path with lot of easy and doable quests than an average length quest path that is way too hard for the average player to complete.

KeithJedi / Ookarra, Starsider

I believe it should be known. Thanks for asking

If this is how its sopposed to progress. Then I saw really known. if it gots:

figure out how tounlock-----> unlock force sensitive--24 slots--> Padawan Trials---> Padawan Initiate---->cont.

Then i say that the figureing out how to unlock the sensitivity should be rather easy and really known. ive been at it for a year now. And feeling like ill never even taste Jedi.

br>I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending to much Liberty then to those attending too small a degree of it. Thomas Jefferson 1791
Smugglie = Smuggler + Lie
Liberty Or Death

IT Should be a small chain of random well made story based dynamic quests. that change over time. And it should be KNOWN. Or at least the starting point should be known, and it shouldnt leave yo hanging. no matter how long it is. some of us will one day not give up till we get Jedi. so at least show usthe path, don't just say "Their is a path!".

br>I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending to much Liberty then to those attending too small a degree of it. Thomas Jefferson 1791
Smugglie = Smuggler + Lie
Liberty Or Death

I think you should make the path a known because eventually the path will be known and posted everywhere. This will also allow you to give more development time to the quest, and make a better all around product instead of dividing time to make a fun quest and a mysterious one.