Development Cycle Archive
Thread: SWG Changes Part 3: GCW Occupation System
Amana
Tue Feb 08, 2005 7:47 pm
#326
dang this is sounding pretty sweet and like the star warsy universe some of us players have hoped for. Can't wait for this to be put in place it will deffinately add that certain bit of being on guard when you get into a city. My only question is what about jedi who are set to permanently over status because they are ranked knights or higher?
Staan
Tue Feb 08, 2005 7:51 pm
#327
Did some of you Dark Jedi actually think you were Vaders henchman or something?
Because what else did you expect, you are definately not exempt because you're fighting for the Imperial cause.
If anything this is part of the system, Dark Jedi fight for the power. And that works top down as well.
You are a threat, and deserve to be treated however the Empire sees fit.
Did you think the Empire was fair? It's not.
WAKE UP DARK JEDI. You are not the Emperors gifted subjects, and never were.
You were not historically more common, All Jedi were uncommon.
But you're also not going to get scanned every 5 minutes, so dont blow this out of proportion.
Because what else did you expect, you are definately not exempt because you're fighting for the Imperial cause.
If anything this is part of the system, Dark Jedi fight for the power. And that works top down as well.
You are a threat, and deserve to be treated however the Empire sees fit.
Did you think the Empire was fair? It's not.
WAKE UP DARK JEDI. You are not the Emperors gifted subjects, and never were.
You were not historically more common, All Jedi were uncommon.
But you're also not going to get scanned every 5 minutes, so dont blow this out of proportion.
Message Edited by Staan on 02-08-2005 11:06 PM
Nemesix
Tue Feb 08, 2005 7:51 pm
#328
if rebels arent going to report light jedi there is no way that imps should report dark jedi. plus its stupid that the stronger we fortify a planet the worse the npc gank squads that our faction sends after us sounds pretty damn stupid
Sifer2
Tue Feb 08, 2005 7:55 pm
#329
To summarize it:
1. Having laws to break is good. Regardless of which faction is in control no one should be entirely safe if they are doing illegal things. This isthe point of having Smugglers. If your a dancer/weaponsmith that just cant stand the thought of being scanned an blasted by the local police maybe you should deal with a Smuggler to help you out.
2. NPC's just became nothing. They can no longer be helped or protected so now thier very existence really does'nt matter. They will be farmed to provide faction to make new bases an that's about it. VERY dumb change in my opinion as the current TEF system is very realistic an Star Warsy. All that needed to go was Group TEF. That was making PvP unfun. Making Combatants completely safe just ruined a ton of the immersion factor. Call me crazy but I find it FUN to blast a few factionNPC's in a city then look over my shoulder hoping no enemy playersare nearby. This new proposed system will just make it farming...yawn boring.
3. Dark Jedi get the shaft yet again. Yes ladies an gentleman since the very beggining Dark Jedi have been getting the shaft. Before publish 9 they had more Force than Light Jedi but thier Regen was insanely lower. So much lower that Light was the obvious choice. The after Publish 9 thier FRS bonus's all effect Force Powers. An what do you know but Force Powers is the most gimped tree of the five big surprise there. And so now we continue this time honored tradition of making Dark Jedi suck by making ever thier OWN Faction kill them at every oppurtunity. So Devs are you trying to give us the hint that you want everyone to go Light Jedi? Despite that fact that Dark Jedi serving the Emperorwere much more common in this point of the timeline?
Message Edited by Sifer2 on 02-08-2005 07:00 PM
EEMAN
Tue Feb 08, 2005 7:56 pm
#330
ok just need to say one more thing to everyone whining that they might get attacked by getting scanned for having illegal goods. This only applies to opposite factions 'ON LEAVE'. IF you are an Imp in a rebel controlled city and are set at 'combatant' or 'special forces' then you will NOT be scanned. Why? Because the NPC's are already going to be attacking you. The opposite faction NPC's will be attacking ON SITE any person registered as a 'combatant' (PVE) or 'special forces' (PVP). I really don't plan on going 'on leave' all that often to be honest.
Crafters:
Sure my crafter will be set 'on leave'. If I need to go to an Imperial control town then I take a smuggler with me. Let me put it this way.. as a rebel I already have this problem at Mos Espa.. theres SOOO many scan teams there I get scanned 3 times walking from the starport to the bank. Guess what? I have been to Mos Espa maybe 4 times since January 2004 because of this. If I do go I either hide my sliced stuff in a droid or I group with a master smuggler. I know I know.. shame on me for role playing the whole road block inspection thing.
PS I think jedi mind trick for the crackdown negating would be fantastic! Especially if other members in the group could see the system message. That would feel very immersive.
Crafters:
Sure my crafter will be set 'on leave'. If I need to go to an Imperial control town then I take a smuggler with me. Let me put it this way.. as a rebel I already have this problem at Mos Espa.. theres SOOO many scan teams there I get scanned 3 times walking from the starport to the bank. Guess what? I have been to Mos Espa maybe 4 times since January 2004 because of this. If I do go I either hide my sliced stuff in a droid or I group with a master smuggler. I know I know.. shame on me for role playing the whole road block inspection thing.
PS I think jedi mind trick for the crackdown negating would be fantastic! Especially if other members in the group could see the system message. That would feel very immersive.
Staan
Tue Feb 08, 2005 8:00 pm
#331
TEFs are confusing and exploitable, they are a partial solution to a complex section of the game.
The removal of TEFs and clear defined PVP rules will actually increase PVP and enhance the SWG experience.
Heck, nobody is fighting to backup the meatlumps being slaughtered outside every city, but when an faction NPC gets shot its suddenly a huge issue with some people.
PvE now plays a minor safe role, and PvP is the way to change your world. More risk = More reward.
The whole system now makes more sense and has a longterm goal.
How anyone can complain about that is beyond me.
The removal of TEFs and clear defined PVP rules will actually increase PVP and enhance the SWG experience.
Heck, nobody is fighting to backup the meatlumps being slaughtered outside every city, but when an faction NPC gets shot its suddenly a huge issue with some people.
PvE now plays a minor safe role, and PvP is the way to change your world. More risk = More reward.
The whole system now makes more sense and has a longterm goal.
How anyone can complain about that is beyond me.
Bowoci
Tue Feb 08, 2005 8:05 pm
#332
Uh.. just a note to everybody having a fit about these changes... this IS the In Development Forum... hopefully they will take some of your rants into consideration while formulating how this will eventually go live??
Karquile
Tue Feb 08, 2005 8:05 pm
#333
It's interesting reading these comments, I hope Gordon is.
Glad a few others have repeated what I posted earlier: letting Rebels have control of core planets in this Ep 4-5 timeframe is crazy. The Rebellion could barely keep a base open at this point. I have no particular love for the Empire, but the thrill and reward of playing Rebel in this game is not supposed to be about dominating the galaxy, it's about pulling off some miracles and fighting the good fight.
Even the name GCW is misleading, as if the Empire and the Rebellion were two interchangeable color-coded factions fighting some "Civil War" on a chessboard somewhere. The Empire is the dark design of the Sith to choke the living spirit out of a once free Republic. The Rebellion is a desperate, improvised campaign patched together by scattered remnants of the free worlds, aided by one or two surviving Jedi. There hasn't been a "Civil War" since the days of Dooku, long before this game is set.
The fake tin-soldier "parity" between Rebel and Imperial is one of the ways this game lets down the Star Wars saga, and these changes are only going to make it worse.
It's also really annoying to read comments from players saying basically "pick a side or leave the game." Not this game! Go say that in some other game. This game supports neutrals. And it had better KEEP supporting neutrals, or it will take a 35-40% playerbase hit in a few months.
Many of my toons are neutral, and their gameplay is just as valid as the biggest PvP stud in the galaxy. I don't mind being aware of the misnamed GCW during gameplay, but I do not want to be "encouraged" to change my alignment by a bunch of changes that squeeze neutrals. So please don't do it.
Message Edited by Karquile on 02-08-2005 10:35 PM
Calandryll_SOE
Tue Feb 08, 2005 8:11 pm
#334
Calandryll_SOE wrote:
Ko-aIri wrote:
Mr. Hanna,
Since you're monitoring this thread at the moment, I was wondering if possibly you could comment on this item related to what you just posted:
Back before Publish 9, Jedi had a limited, random ability to avoid a crackdown scan based on how advanced they were. Once they hit Padawan in the old system, a scan was basically guaranteed to be avoided with an automatic mind trick.
Jedi avoiding the scan, part 1
Jedi avoiding the scan, part 2
Those screenshots are my Jedi, then an Initiate, doing the auto-mind trick. It was one of the coolest things for immersion that happened in all my gaming experience.
Since publish 9, Jedi lost this ability. With the advent of these new GCW changes, there has never been a more compelling time to ask for this ability to return.
Perhaps either a Jedi could automatically do it (like the old system) based on how many skill points are invested in Jedi skills (i.e. a % chance to avoid a scan)... OR the useless Master Force Powers skill "Jedi Mind Trick" could be modified to be a shield or reactionary ability that would enable a Jedi to avoid the scans.
This would be immersive, true to the movies, and a way for Jedi to stay clandestine while traveling.
I thank you for your time and I eagerly await any comment you have. Thank you!
We are looking into this.
GreenMarine fixed this. Should be in the same publish as the GCW changes assumingthe fixpasses QA. 
DarkSmyth
Tue Feb 08, 2005 8:14 pm
#335
Karquile wrote:
It's interesting reading these comments, I hope Gordon is.
Glad a few others have repeated what I posted earlier: letting Rebels have control of core planets in this Ep 4-5 timeframe is crazy. The Rebellion could barely keep a base open at this point. I have no particular love for the Empire, but the thrill and reward of playing Rebel in this game is not supposed to be about dominating the galaxy, it's about pulling off some miracles and fighting the good fight.
Even the name GCW is misleading, as if the Empire and the Rebellion were two interchangeable color-coded factions fighting some "Civil War" on a chessboard somewhere. The Empire is the dark design of the Sith to choke the living spirit out of a once free Republic. The Rebellion is a desperate, improvised campaign patched together by scattered remnants of the free worlds, aided by one or two surviving Jedi. There hasn't been a "Civil War" since the days of Dooku, long before this game is set.
The fake tin-soldier "parity" between Rebel and Jedi is one of the ways this game lets down the Star Wars saga, and these changes are only going to make it worse.
It's also really annoying to read comments from players saying basically "pick a side or leave the game." Not this game! Go say that in some other game. This game supports neutrals. And it had better KEEP supporting neutrals, or it will take a 35-40% playerbase hit in a few months.
Many of my toons are neutral, and their gameplay is just as valid as the biggest PvP stud in the galaxy. I don't mind being aware of the misnamed GCW during gameplay, but I do not want to be "encouraged" to change my alignment by a bunch of changes that squeeze neutrals. So please don't do it.
That's why I've always said the timeline for this game would better fall into the Episode 3.5 era.
Two main points:
1) You would have 2 sides fighting for control, and
2) You would have Jedi and they would be hunted.
Would make a whole lot more sense I think.
Message Edited by DarkSmyth on 02-08-2005 10:15 PM
BlackEdge
Tue Feb 08, 2005 8:19 pm
#336
Really nice stuff.
Now, as a mayor, it would be great if factioned aligned player cities could get involved in this some how. Maybe the ability to have guards patrolling the streets in the cities.
Now, as a mayor, it would be great if factioned aligned player cities could get involved in this some how. Maybe the ability to have guards patrolling the streets in the cities.
Calandryll_SOE
Tue Feb 08, 2005 8:24 pm
#337
Correct. Scans will still occur, you just won't get attacked if you are a civilian.
MedrautHalyd wrote:
IndySWG wrote:
Wait wat wait .... what!?
Imperials wont be scanned by imperials, Rebels wont be scanned by rebels, and neutrals wont be scanned EVER?! WHY SCAN AT ALL?!
They said neutrals won't be attacked from a scan. Not that they won't be scanned at all. As I understand it, everyone will scan neutrals and fine them if they're carrying illegal stuff, they just won't attack them for being members of the opposition, because they're not.
Klif_Hangar
Tue Feb 08, 2005 8:26 pm
#338
DarkSmyth wrote:
Karquile wrote:
It's interesting reading these comments, I hope Gordon is.
Glad a few others have repeated what I posted earlier: letting Rebels have control of core planets in this Ep 4-5 timeframe is crazy. The Rebellion could barely keep a base open at this point. I have no particular love for the Empire, but the thrill and reward of playing Rebel in this game is not supposed to be about dominating the galaxy, it's about pulling off some miracles and fighting the good fight.
Even the name GCW is misleading, as if the Empire and the Rebellion were two interchangeable color-coded factions fighting some "Civil War" on a chessboard somewhere. The Empire is the dark design of the Sith to choke the living spirit out of a once free Republic. The Rebellion is a desperate, improvised campaign patched together by scattered remnants of the free worlds, aided by one or two surviving Jedi. There hasn't been a "Civil War" since the days of Dooku, long before this game is set.
The fake tin-soldier "parity" between Rebel and Jedi is one of the ways this game lets down the Star Wars saga, and these changes are only going to make it worse.
It's also really annoying to read comments from players saying basically "pick a side or leave the game." Not this game! Go say that in some other game. This game supports neutrals. And it had better KEEP supporting neutrals, or it will take a 35-40% playerbase hit in a few months.
Many of my toons are neutral, and their gameplay is just as valid as the biggest PvP stud in the galaxy. I don't mind being aware of the misnamed GCW during gameplay, but I do not want to be "encouraged" to change my alignment by a bunch of changes that squeeze neutrals. So please don't do it.
That's why I've always said the timeline for this game would better fall into the Episode 3.5 era.
Two main points:
1) You would have 2 sides fighting for control, and
2) You would have Jedi and they would be hunted.
Would make a whole lot more sense I think.
Message Edited by DarkSmyth on 02-08-2005 10:15 PM
Or even better the post Return of the Jedi time frame (say, 10 years after RotJ).
- Rebelshave become the"New Republic", making them a government and thus more like the Empire in terms of needing to control cities/maintain order.
- The New Republic forces have grown and the Imperial forces have shrunk so that the war is just about even in terms of manpower/technology/equipment/tactics used by the two sides, which makes balancing the GCW in SWG easier/more in line with the time frame.
- Jedi are growing in numbers again thanks to the efforst of Luke Skywalker
- Players get to play in the "Classic Trilogy" Universe, seeing all of the characters from that trilogy except for Jabba, Vader,and the Emporer (who are just sitting in themeparks collecting dust anyway).
- Imperial equipment has been improved since the movie time frame to have hyperdrives/shields (fits with current SWG system).
- The Empire no longer hasenough manpower to blindly reject alien help (fits with the current SWG system, and allows devs to lower or remove racial penalties for the Empire, further balancing the two factions).
- Fewer changes needed to storylines/quests/npc's than would be needed to convert to a prequal era game.
- And Last (and maybe most important), No Jar-Jar