Development Cycle Archive
Thread: SWG Changes Part 3: GCW Occupation System
IndySWG wrote:
Calandryll_SOE wrote:Gordon's comment was about those people who are not in a faction. If you aren't in a faction you won't be attacked from a scan.
Yogol wrote:
SOETyrant wrote:Jeez people, we are not eliminating a Civilian/Neutral/Crafting lifestyle. But the GCW will affect the environment.
Yes you are. You are forcing people to PvE against scanners. And don't say "then don't carry sliced stuff", because that is impossible, sliced stufff is up to 30% better. so, yes, you ARE forcing people to fight or die.
And there is no escape, not even for people "on leave" (which is by far the most reidiculous term I ever heard, BTW, why not just call it covert ???)
Wait wat wait .... what!?
Imperials wont be scanned by imperials, Rebels wont be scanned by rebels, and neutrals wont be scanned EVER?! WHY SCAN AT ALL?!
Not only does that eliminate the value of smugglers ability to resist it completely eliminates the "membership has privledges" idea of faction. The idea of high ranking officials getting pass only makes sense from a "ah you're one of us" stand point...but apparently...we're encouraging people to opt out of the war...then they are ALWAYS safe.
And as for the smugglers... nevermind them ... my faction (or lack there off) can smuggler far better than their 121 skill points ever will.
Message Edited by IndySWG on 02-08-2005 06:22 PM
Jeeze, you'll still be scanned and might be fined credits and possibly faction points with that faction... so there's still a negative, you just won't be forced into combat, run or die if you're neutral.
This change is awesome.
IndySWG wrote:
Calandryll_SOE wrote:
Gordon's comment was about those people who are not in a faction. If you aren't in a faction you won't be attacked from a scan.
Yogol wrote:
SOETyrant wrote:
Jeez people, we are not eliminating a Civilian/Neutral/Crafting lifestyle. But the GCW will affect the environment.
Yes you are. You are forcing people to PvEagainst scanners. And don't say "then don't carry sliced stuff", because that is impossible, sliced stufff is up to 30% better. so, yes, you ARE forcing people to fight or die.
And there is no escape, not evenfor people "on leave" (which is by far the most reidiculous term I ever heard, BTW, why not just call it covert ???)
Wait wat wait .... what!?
Imperials wont be scanned by imperials, Rebels wont be scanned by rebels, and neutrals wont be scanned EVER?! WHY SCAN AT ALL?!
Not only does thateliminate the value of smugglers ability to resist it completely eliminates the "membership has privledges" idea of faction. The idea of high ranking officials getting pass only makes sense from a "ah you're one of us" stand point...but apparently...we're encouraging people to opt out of the war...then they are ALWAYS safe.
And as for the smugglers... nevermind them ... my faction (or lack there off)can smuggler far better than their 121 skill points ever will.
Message Edited by IndySWG on 02-08-2005 06:22 PM
Ok .. seriously SERIOUSLY frustrated here ...
So everyone not in the GCW has free reign to cary about ilegal good!? And everyone who is it is too .. I mean they aren't going to get scanned by their own faction, and the others will shoot on site and not bother with scan.
WHY SCAN!? WHY HAVE SMUGGLERS?!
SpaceCrazy wrote:
LaughingWolf wrote:
Something not to forget, SpaceCrazy.
To quote the official statement:
Two cities on each planet will never change faction. These are the stronghold cities. Anchorhead, Coronet, and Moenia will always be Rebel. Bestine, Bela Vistal, and Theed will always be Imperial.
So a crafter who is in a faction can decide to stick to his faction stronghold city for travelling, etc.
On Naboo, yes. On Corellia and Tatooine, not necessarily. There are no starports in Bela Vistal or Anchorhead. In order to travel to another planet, you will have to travel to another city that could be controlled by the opposing faction.
Hmm...what a strange turn of events that one of the cities without a starport is rebel, and one is imperial. It's like they want it to be like this!
MedrautHalyd wrote:
Well... how else should it work? If you're a known member of an illegal organisation (or a known member of the military oppressors), what should the other side do if they find you? Assess your level of combat ability and then let you go if you're not tough enough to put up a fight?
The risk is part of the choice of being a member of a faction. And besides, as things are, being a member of the rebel or imperial faction is essentially a military choice isn't it? You can support the rebellion or the empire without actually enlisting in the faction. And is there actually anything rebel or imperial faction-related that's purely crafting?
How exactly is the enemy going to know that a crafter is a member of the opposing faction (Other than "because they are programmed to")? I could easily see how a combat character could be identified on sight. You kill enough of the enemy, the enemy will get to know you. But if you are just walking on the street, having never fired a weapon, how will the enemy know you make food or clothes for the enemy - in a shop that your side probably shops from too?
No there isn't currently anything faction-related for non-combat characters...and that's something that needs to be addressed because there should be. Then perhaps you could make a case for the enemy knowing a crafter on sight, being barred from their shops or something.
IndySWG wrote:Wait wat wait .... what!?
Imperials wont be scanned by imperials, Rebels wont be scanned by rebels, and neutrals wont be scanned EVER?! WHY SCAN AT ALL?!
They said neutrals won't be attacked from a scan. Not that they won't be scanned at all. As I understand it, everyone will scan neutrals and fine them if they're carrying illegal stuff, they just won't attack them for being members of the opposition, because they're not.
LastEE wrote:
Jeeze, you'll still be scanned and might be fined credits and possibly faction points with that faction... so there's still a negative, you just won't be forced into combat, run or die if you're neutral.
This change is awesome.
SpaceCrazy wrote:
How exactly is the enemy going to know that a crafter is a member of the opposing faction (Other than "because they are programmed to")? I could easily see how a combat character could be identified on sight. You kill enough of the enemy, the enemy will get to know you. But if you are just walking on the street, having never fired a weapon, how will the enemy know you make food or clothes for the enemy - in a shop that your side probably shops from too?
Don't you need a certain amount of faction to enlist in the first place? Can you get that without attacking the other faction in some manner?
not only that but it's a requirment to be imperial to be a dark jedi. seems kind of like a slap in the face to me.
Shiznat9000 wrote:
Calandryll_SOE wrote:
Additionally, if a Jedi is scanned s/he runs the risk of being exposed. Should this happen, the police may panic and call for help, bringing a very powerful force on the Jedi. Note that Imperial allied police will call forces to attack any Jedi, regardless of faction. Rebel aligned police will only call guards to attack Dark Jedi.
Ok I know you're trying to stick to the story line here and make it seem like Imperials want to destroy all Jedi, but in this game it'sjusttoo contradictory to the system that's already in place.
- Obviously Dark Jedi can already join the Imperial side and do all the same thing that normal Imperials do. Get faction points, buy equipment, get promotions, etc.
- Imperial npcs do not attack Dark Jedi even if they have high visibility and have their sabers out.
- Dark Jedi can even do the Imperial theme park and take missions from Vader.
Clearly you've set the game up in a way where Dark Jedi are welcomed by Imperials. So why now have you decided that Imperials at npc cities will start attacking Dark Jedi? Either Dark Jedi should not be allowed in the Imperial faction, or Imperials should not attack their own kind.
Calandryll_SOE wrote:
Got a couple more answers from the Dev. Team:
Why are Imperial forces attacking Dark Jedi?
The Empire has a campaign against all Jedi. The soldiers of the Empire have no knowledge of what differences there are between Dark & Light Jedi. There is nothing to indicate that the Emperor and Vader want Dark Jedi around.
What is the reasoning for allowing high ranking faction members to avoid scans?
High ranking officers aren’t going to be scanned by their own army, but they will be scanned by the opposing army. This isn’t anything new. We haven’t touched the code or the percentages at all. The only difference is that now, Rebel officers are protected from Rebel scans.
For the first point, I wholeheartedly agree. In fact, the SW canon states that there are always two Sithat any given time. Yes, I know there's a distinction between Dark Jedi and Sith, but Vader and the Emperor (the two Sith) would hardly want competition, would they? Vader's plan with Luke was to train him so that he could help him overthrow his master, and the Emperor seemed to be trying in ROTJ to provoke Luke and Vader to duke it out in the best Darwinian fashion (that's survival of the fittest, for the slower ones out there). Thus, the Empire should indeed be actively hunting ALL jedi.
For the second point. Yay! Rebels get immunity at high ranks! Rebels get saluted by NPC soldiers! /cheer
MedrautHalyd wrote:
Don't you need a certain amount of faction to enlist in the first place? Can you get that without attacking the other faction in some manner?
You can get the faction points without combat by running faction delivery missions - no combat required.
Calandryll_SOE wrote:
Additionally, if a Jedi is scanned s/he runs the risk of being exposed. Should this happen, the police may panic and call for help, bringing a very powerful force on the Jedi. Note that Imperial allied police will call forces to attack any Jedi, regardless of faction. Rebel aligned police will only call guards to attack Dark Jedi.
Shouldn't this mean that Jedi and Dark Jedi will now be in separate factions, out of the GCW? It makes no sense for Dark Jedi to remain "Imperial" if other Imperials will be attacking them.
Jedi and Dark Jedi need to be moved into new factions, outside of the GCW.
And while you're at it, fix the FRS and make it possible to advance, and the rewards tangible. Do that, and most Jedi will be happy to be removed from the GCW.