Development Cycle Archive
Thread: Should Force Sensitivity be a known path or a mysterious one? (II)
DarthHossith
Sat Jul 10, 2004 8:20 pm
#235
Tw0flow3r wrote:
They're leaving it up to us?
Most people vote known because they're lazy SOBs. The path should not be known at all.
Maybe we can get new hints from Holocrons (giving them a use again) like where to go to seek answers or whatever, but telling people right off the hook where to go and what to do?
No sir, that's the stupidest thing I ever heard in my entire time playing SWG.
Use Holocrons for advice, make them rare, make the path as unique to people as you possibly can within the boundaries of coding and sensibility, and there you have a winning formula for an interesting and challenging experience if I do say so myself.
Wait, that sounded familiar...
I like that Idea but throw it in with mine... make a random NPC give you a holocron as the trivia answer or something
DaManiac
Sat Jul 10, 2004 8:21 pm
#236
personally id like for it to be known, if it was mysterious it would only frustrate people and thats the last thing this game needs, it should also be very quest and stroy oreinted, and fun, not where u ahve to go from point a to point b, kill a few mobs so that u can complete a checklist, i thought htat was a pretty stupid thing hte devs did witht he knight trials, but what can i say no one pays me for my opinion.
NotSevLaurence
Sat Jul 10, 2004 8:30 pm
#237
Though I have a Jedi the path should be a mystery. I would like to see the game SOMEHOW return to the TRUE timeline. I dont like seeing 10 Jedi running around everytime I play. I like to be unique and having a FS character makes me so. I put in lots of time to be unique even before the path to unlocking was known. If everyone knew how to be FS do you think anyone but a few RPers wouldnt be. The FS bounses to any proffesion would be impossible to resist.
Suba
Sat Jul 10, 2004 8:38 pm
#238
NotSevLaurence wrote:Though I have a Jedi the path should be a mystery. I would like to see the game SOMEHOW return to the TRUE timeline. I dont like seeing 10 Jedi running around everytime I play. I like to be unique and having a FS character makes me so. I put in lots of time to be unique even before the path to unlocking was known. If everyone knew how to be FS do you think anyone but a few RPers wouldnt be. The FS bounses to any proffesion would be impossible to resist.
Your being unique means jack to everyone else hate to say. I appreciate you want to say haha i got jedi screw everyone else but we pay the same as you. Cause i did 8 professions less then you does that mean i didnt work as hard as you? No it simply means I decided i wanted to play and have fun and stop hologrinding.
The General consensus is we dont want the same screw up as the old system. Majority of those saying make it take a year or whatever are almost all exclusively jedi with the same mentality of "HAHA I have jedi and you dont and I dont want you to have it"
Known is really the only way to go and I think people dont realize that Known does not automatically equal easy and quick. It could be a long and complex series of quests. Just cause we know what to do doesnt mean its gonna fast and easy.
Message Edited by Suba on 07-10-2004 09:39 PM
sirsri
Sat Jul 10, 2004 8:46 pm
#239
Look at it this way, if you don't make it known and completable in a reasonable time frame the only people left playing this game will be hard core grinders who will do it regardless of how difficult you make it. And you'll spend all your time making content for jedi who are master lightsaber, master enhancer, a bit of something else.
To translate into suit speak: The reason SWG has only 200k accounts and EQ has peaked over 450k is because you even have to ask questions like this.
What you have to do to progress must always be clear, achievable, not competitive between players (and not be dependent on fixed spawns). Anything else will cut your user base dramatically, create huge animosity in game and wreck marriages. Yes I realise SOE likes wrecking marriages but the EQ team finally clued in that its a bad idea in the long run. Just because its good roleplay (and good in a movie) doesn't make it good gameplay, and usually its directly counter to good gameplay.
Fundamentally the answer to this question has nothing to do with the current player base. The question you need to ask is what type of user do you want (for whatever reasons, the game may be more interesting with 200k hard core semi roleplayers than more moneyw ith 500k people with no roleplayers and a lot more casual gamers). If you want young men under 24 (school and unemployed), and no one over that, then pick mysterious. If you want people to whom star wars appeals in general (say men from 13-60+), then pick known. Your user base will (and does) adapt to how you behave, don't do what your users want, do what will attract the users you want.
Enough good people have left this game because they got bored with 'mysterious' (random) elements in progression to being force sensitive. Its up to you if you want to lose more.
To translate into suit speak: The reason SWG has only 200k accounts and EQ has peaked over 450k is because you even have to ask questions like this.
What you have to do to progress must always be clear, achievable, not competitive between players (and not be dependent on fixed spawns). Anything else will cut your user base dramatically, create huge animosity in game and wreck marriages. Yes I realise SOE likes wrecking marriages but the EQ team finally clued in that its a bad idea in the long run. Just because its good roleplay (and good in a movie) doesn't make it good gameplay, and usually its directly counter to good gameplay.
Fundamentally the answer to this question has nothing to do with the current player base. The question you need to ask is what type of user do you want (for whatever reasons, the game may be more interesting with 200k hard core semi roleplayers than more moneyw ith 500k people with no roleplayers and a lot more casual gamers). If you want young men under 24 (school and unemployed), and no one over that, then pick mysterious. If you want people to whom star wars appeals in general (say men from 13-60+), then pick known. Your user base will (and does) adapt to how you behave, don't do what your users want, do what will attract the users you want.
Enough good people have left this game because they got bored with 'mysterious' (random) elements in progression to being force sensitive. Its up to you if you want to lose more.
Warmaker01
Sat Jul 10, 2004 8:49 pm
#240
Unknown mechanic, by all means, pleeeaaasse!
No holocrons
No hints
No Magic 8 Balls
NONE!
"If they can be fooled, they can be killed."
Aakhperkare
Sat Jul 10, 2004 8:58 pm
#241
No matter the decission, it will just be implimented badly just like everything else.
By the way. If you feel you worked by grinding professions to get your slot, then you really need to re-evaluate what a game means to you. A game shouldn't be work, it should be fun...
Tauro
Sat Jul 10, 2004 9:00 pm
#242
Hi,
Please make it a known system, developed with this fact in mind "your entire player base is going to attempt it, and wants to bea jedi"
If u prepare for that, then how can u make a mistake?.
Example:
If its a physical place in the galaxy, everyone is going to be there. "bad"
If its a physical object, everyone is going to want one. "bad"
If its a quest everyone is going to be doing it. "bad"
If its a rumour everyone is going to want to know it."bad"
If it can be exploited in any way, everyone will."bad"
Those systems wont survive the hammering of the entire server population. Nor will they alloweveryone a chance.
You need to create a random generator that is going tosplit people off todifferent quests on different planets, different cities,with different objectives and rewards. Maybe when the space addon is in, give people some quest for jedi in there if they have the addon, only for the opportunity to add some diversity and spread people out a bit more.
No "one" system is going to suffice, for this.
Goodluck with this Devs, your going to need it. A lot of people are sensitiveabout this one.
I salute you.
Tauro.
Galoopa
Sat Jul 10, 2004 9:00 pm
#243
It should be known. Some of us worked very hard to unlock, but due to bad luck didn't make it. If we have to waste months stumbling around in the dark looking for Eyes of Mesra to unlock we will have had it.
Make it story driven, but without a lot of time sinks in it. Just let us play the game and have a chance for fun again.
SPYDER068
Sat Jul 10, 2004 9:02 pm
#244
Make it known how to get jedi the new way ?? WOO HOOO looks like this will be jedi wars, no one will be any of the other classes then.
It should be unknown how to get it.. Tell everyone how to and the game will be ruined. Look what happened after the first time we were told how to.. Gee i think 1/4 the people quit within 4 months of it. Tell everyone how to get it again, even more people will quit. I think the only reason you have people still playing this game is because of Jump To lightspeed.
I thought you said jedi was going to be rare ??? The hell if it is rare now, make it quest based. Tell everyone how to get it.. Wel why dont we all just go play jedi acadamy. The best part of ths game is the few jedi there are and the OTHER NON JEDI CLASSES.
But if were all jedi.. whats the point of using another combat class if you know your gonna get your ass kicked bye a jedi when over half the people fighting will be one. And if you make it quest based... Tell us all how to get it. Wel then everyone will be jedi then.
I think im going to start looking for a new game. Im not going to pay for my 2 accounts monthly just for a game that is gonna turn out to be **edit** and all jedi.
tell ushow to be jedi...i will be cancelling my accounts the day after.
Oh wait i just wasted my time typing this because the dev's really don't give a damn and will most likely never read this
thezabrakprince909
Sat Jul 10, 2004 9:31 pm
#246
I think it should be known,i mean yea if we were at the very begining of the game and wanted jedi to be rare unknown would be a good way to keep it rare,but now there are countless jedi and on my server almost on every planet there are several jedi or at least one or so,so since it isnt rare anymore i think it should be a known way,but i mean not EVERYONE will decide to be a jedi,some people get kicks on killing and hunting jedi,i mean it would be bad if the whole game was filled with jedi and BH's but some people will not decide to continue down the jedi path.......just my 2 cents 
Flynn_Nomad
Sat Jul 10, 2004 9:33 pm
#247
EfuAby wrote:
Hojo_Hominygrits wrote:
It needs to be known. Stop with the mystery crap. As I said in the other thread, you had your shot at "mystery" and it was a huge failure. You guys need to make the Force accessible for everyone at varying levels. Be it the hardcore powergamer, or the guy with a wife and kids who only gets a few hours a day to play your game, we should all have access. I don't want to be denied because I have to jump through unknown magical hoops for 6 months to a year to become force sensitive. I want to know what I'm doing, and where I stand on my journey to Force sensitivity. And I want to see progress in a reasonable amount of time. That gives me a goal, and it keeps me playing.
It's quite obvious to you I'm sure that Star Wars, in spite of all its many other aspects, will ALWAYS be about Jedi and The Force. Many of us were running around with wiffle-ball bats pretending to be Jedi when we were kids. When we "played" at Star Wars, no one wanted to be anything BUT a Jedi. At least, not any of the kids I played Star Wars with. You're seeing just that in your game. At this point it's the understatement of the century that a lot of people are passionate about Jedi. So why put some limit on it? Make it rare and special on the back end (to quote another poster). Make the fight against the elements in the game (players and non-players) the limiting factor, but don't deny people from at least experiencing it. That's just plain dumb. So give the "mystery" junk a rest and give us our Force.
Message Edited by Hojo_Hominygrits on 07-10-2004 01:13 PM
The pathhas to be random and mysterious to some degree or we will have "Walkthroughs" posted on how to be Force sensitive.
BUT! The methodshould be known. With the hologrind, no one made any progres until the method was known.
For example they should come right out and tell us...
1. It involves HOW you treat npc's and how you interact with them.
2. It doesnt invole your gcw faction.
3. It isnt affected by dueling.
etc. tell us what it vaguely involves.
AND dont make the method campable! (ie. kill 100k meatlumps and youre force sensitive)
dont make it grindable!
MAke it require character and class and patience and all the other rl qualities (lol rl jedi qualities) that one would need.
And FWIW when I played SW as a kid I wanted to be a scoundrel like HAn Solo, not a Jedi, and I wanted to shoot people under tables!