Development Cycle Archive
Thread: Thoughts on the Warren?
I usually flame here but. I'd have to say peeps where grouping up on the fly in the warren, and or helping each other out. At least those that were not in big groups. It was something that could be completed by one person (letting others kill or help with mobs) or peeps in a group. That was totally kewl. I'd be running around do my own thing see some one in trouble, help them out then move on, others did the same. It's a kewl way to get peeps to play together make freinds etc. The camping thing kinda sucked trying to get the keys, I didn't have a problem cause i can play 24/7 ( i read you fixed that, i'll try with my other char)
The bugs so you couldn't get in for days or the reactor problem that couldn't be deactivated, now that was just to much. You did a great thing then totally distroyed it at the same time. I know you guys are better than that, give us players on the test center all the cash/free travel etc. so WE CAN ALL GO HELP TEST THIS STUFF GEEEEEZ, it's not going to cost you ANYTHING. (Make sure FS is deactivated on test)
All i heard about the warren after the second day when it was unusable was "Just another SWG screw up"
As I suspected, as soon as people find bugs, the dev's stop posting. They just throw a couple of hotfixes on it and hope we'll "forget" it was broken in the first place.
That's what I call Customer Service! 
I really like The Warren, Holocron, just wanted to let you know.
I went there for the first time yesterday, eager to get badge rewards, and I've spent hours of gameplay there over the last two days.
SPOILER ALERT
I got in and got to the "Medical Center"-like room with the 'A Letter' item to loot off a corpse. I arrived after another man, Gannit, and he took the first letter spawn. I sat around for an hour(!) while the letter respawned, but for some reason I didn't mind too much.
Running around with other players, I got 3 pieces of evidence, and turned my letter in to the widow for a Warren: Compassion badge! The Drum access rights were messed up though, so no one could shut down the reactor and allow us access to the finall boss area of The Warren. OK, no problem. I logged out nearby and decided to go at it right after the server reset. I was lucky enough to loot a couple 'spare' letters too, which I intended to give to PA mates.
This is where my Warren adveture really started to shine... Today, on Shadowfire server, Gannit and I hit the place first. We got the first elevator working and descended. Gannit had to log off soon, so he decided to let me open the Drum beyond the reactor room with the NPC that tells you it's going to blow. By doing so, I had access rights (and ONLY I had them) for the entire day. Gannit logged as soon as he knew we'd secured that part, as I agreed to help him later in the day.
I put the rods in the drum and opened the final area of the Warren! After getting the fourth evidence, the second badge was as good as mine! It was so great, but what was even better was that about three other people were in The Warren with me and desperately wanting that evidence too. I led their group to the final area, and they all got it! There were so happy, it was great.
I'm not saying everything went perfectly. Both days I died several times, and I accidentally mistook the Encryption Key datapad object for an Evidence Disk once, so I went all the way to Theed with only three! But it was alright. It was worth sticking with just because the area is fun to explore... trying to learn all the passages is daunting.
Later in the day, I went back with Gannit! We also teamed with Tentie Cool of DoD PA who had his Compassion badge and wasn't sure how the other would work. Things were a mess again this time, with Gannit and I dying, but we pulled through and ALL OF US collected 4 evidences again! It was wild.
Soon, people in my PA were talking about the Warren, and a couple went there to check it out. I was trying to talk them through it but found it difficult. I gave up and just left for the place, especially since another couple PA mates were on their way. This time, I guided three PA mates totally new to The Warren through the first badge and all four evidences. Two had letters, and I gave a spare to the third. I gave them instructions on "how-to" get the Imperial Hero badge, and they left. Another PA mate arrived and I led him and another around for the four evidences; the non-PA friend didn't have a letter, but there was already someone from earlier in my group camping the corpse (they had evidences though), so we decided to collect evidences instead. We did go by the widow and I gave my last spare letter to my PA friend. Then I left them in the corpse room. Last I know, two people from my first grouping had gotten letters, and one last person was waiting, but they had the stuff for the second badge. One final PA person came, and I showed her around to the evidences, then left them at the corpse, as I was out of letters.
All in all, I've probably disabled the turret 4 times, deactivated the elevator security 3 times, and shut down the reactor 3 times over the past 2 days. It's been awesome to spend time at The Warren, even with all the death/aggro spawning on top of you/difficulty of leading people around those hallways. I got four people in my PA both badges, and one has the second badge and was camping for a letter last I knew.
One final thing that was awesome was how a friend had been complaining in GuildChat that I shouldn't help others get those badges unless I could do it for everyone... Well, when I got back to Naboo from Dantooine, I ordered them to get to Theed from near Keren; they came, wondering what the heck was going on. I lured them over by the capitol building and traded them my four spare evidence datapad items 
I led them into the capitol and said something, in a suspicious mood, like, "Captain Heff will be interested in what you have to say. Speak with him." Imagine their shock when they got a badge and 500 Imperial FP! It was so awesome to be able to do that.
In short, The Warren is good content. Bugged in that one way, but good content. Thanks.
Thoughts on the warren?
Well, Holo, if I could enter the Warren without my passkey being deleted from my inventory .... well, yeah, maybe then I would have some thoughts for you.
As it is now, running out to the Warren is just a total waste of my time. (This is on Starsider.)
Do you guys ever test new code before you promote it to the live servers???
Holo, I believe this was one of your "pet" projects? Maybe it worked when you tested it internally, but has anyoneon your team thought of checking whether it works when it is live?
All it seems to do at the moment is annoy people. Like many other broken aspects of the game - Rifleman / Chef / Food / Buffs / Squad Leader / Droid Engineer / Guild Chat / etc. etc. etc.
The Warren is awesome!
Things like this could keep me entertained for a long time.
There do need to be some changes to prevent camping of items. I suggest quest items be lootable by all but be no drop.
I tried for several hours, and it wouldnt let me or anyone else in that was trying, but my friend was inside and he said it was cool.
Valoris on the Tarquinis server
I think it is unforgivable to have something with so many problems get pushed on to live servers. I have foolishly wasted 3 full play days in this place. But, if I am to assume that anything that goes live shouldn't even be attempted, then why continue to play this game? It is a very good question.
Here are my impressions of the warren:
1. First day there. No NPC. 10 people are camping a tree just E of the compound waiting for it. We all wait for 4 hours. It never spawns. I talk to a CSR. He says it is a known problem on multiple servers. WHAT? Why not tell us or remove the key restriction from entering. People were waiting for hours when this is a known issue. This was an issue for days, not just that one day.
2. I finally get a key. Actually, I had heard the horror stories of the place burning up keys and people getting stuck inside unable to move forward or backwards. I only had room in my pack for 20 keys, so I took 20. I used 6 keys just getting to the medical room. I figured I didn't have nearly enough keys to continue and feared become stuck in this place. So I decided to get my letter and then log off.
3. Six hours later I am still trying to get my letter. No one likes camping. Every modern MMORPG does what they can to prevent camping. SOE purposely DESIGNS a quest that has a one hour spawn PER SERVER and they have it spawn at the same time each hour. I was there for 6 hours the first day and didn't get one. I came back the next day and spent 8 hours. Yes, 14 hours to get a letter. This is what I found. The room would be near barren except for newbs to the place until 5 mins before the letter was supposed to spawn. Then 4-10 people would show up and click like mad and take it. This is why it took me 14 hours to get one. This is simply unforgivable. Anyone that had ever played an online game before, never mind someone that is designing one, should see the flaw in this design.
4. They make the letter instant spawn. But not the other items??? How does this help? It just moves the bottleneck further down. Now people are camping the corpse inside the locked room down below instead. My gawd!!! You finally realize you have to fix the letter, but don't fix the other bottle-necked spawns?
5. Rods are still broken. Even with the new patch to have them be automatically inserted. Apparently, 1-2 lucky groups per day get through. I have attempted 3 times personally and heard dozens of stories. No one I personally know of the now over 50 people I have met in the warren has been able to complete part 2 since the rods never work. I know of some people that were going to wait for a server reset and then run down and try. So, only the first people on after a server reset can do the quest apparently.
6. You make the multiple levels using elevators, which is nice. So, why make the levels so close vertically that they overlap on the radar and on the map page, rendering both of these useless. I can't tell you how many times I ran after my party and caught up to them on the map, only to find out they were a level above or below me. Why not make the levels further apart vertically so they don't overlap? Or just fix the radar, or in figure, don't use levels if this can't be fixed. This quest would have been just as nice as one huge flat level. Actually, much nicer since radar and map views would work.
7. Cannot heal wounds in here? Almost every mob DBs and you can't heal wounds? While this is very minor considering the other problems, why was it designed this way?
To summarize: I have spent 3 full days in the warren now. As of this writing I am still unable to complete this quest do to bugs. This is after this quest has already been patched several times. This should be happening on the test servers. Please do not bring future quests to live servers until they have really been tested.
I don't want to have to assume any new content is broken on the live servers and not do it until after everyone has done it and told me about it. I would like to explore a new area with people for the first time, but I really don't see how I can trust new content going forward.
-- Signed, one extremelydisappointed paying customer on a live server.
I did the Warren last night, but only got the Compassion badge. I forgot to write down the password the Widow gave to open the cell for the girl, so I had to stop.
This brings me to my first point: could, upon entering the Warren or other POIs, have something in our datapad created that would keep relevant information? For instance, which spoken passwords, who you've talked to, certain items you've collected, etc. Most people serious about the game do this on a piece of paper, so I think putting it in game is a good idea.
As for the Warren itself: I like the idea. A lot. It needs quite a bit of fine-tuning (for instance I was able to run through the whole place solo untouched, could be due to the campers though), but the concept I think is a great idea. I think one of the only reasons that the Warren is underappreciated is that there are so very few things like it in SWG that it tends to attract a lot of people, hence overcrowding.
I say keep throwing more and more of these POIs (dungeons, if you will), and you'll be adding in a very much-needed element to SWG.
Shamus McNugent -- Master Marksman, Master Scout, Medic 4-0-0-0, CH 1-1-0-0, BH 0-0-1-0, Pistoleer 0-0-0-0