Development Cycle Archive
Thread: Declaring overt
Larathorn wrote:
My opinion, make it so you can declare Overt anywhere, anytime. To become Covert you have to go back to the recruiter and wait an hour. There is no reason that I should have to be within 50m to put on my uniform or flash my military ID and fight for my ideals.
Holocron Replied:
"That would let you move in armies of safe people to the location of a fight, and have them all go overt at once and ambush... -Raph Koster,"
So please tell me, Mr Koster, isn't what you described EXACTLY what people are already doing with one overt in a group of coverts? As soon as the overt is attacked, suddenly an entire army "declares" while TEF'ed.
I think Larathorn is right. Forget the whole "needing a recruiter to declare"
crus10 wrote:
How about letting people declare overt anywhere, but they won't become overt for 15 mins and they would have a tef the whole time.
No.
Timer or not, this still allows you to bypass any non-player defenses set up around cities or factional bases.
Grossly unfair and imbalancing. Any proposal you guys come up with cannot be allowed to make these meaningless.
shnelle wrote:
Holocron wrote:
That would let you move in armies of safe people to the location of a fight, and have them all go overt at once and ambush...
Uhhh I think that's actually a good thing. I mean isnt hit and run all about them not seeing you coming. I mean if you are at a mainly Rebel or Imp place and suddenly a ton of neutrals show up wont that be a bit suspicious.
I think to make this better you might want to add the idea that if an Imp or Reb dies when they are Overt they can't clone in the opposite side's town.
Bypassing any defenses that the defenders have set up, and the defenders not being able to do anything about it, is not a good thing. It totally destroys any reason to put up any defenses at all.
xxAce05xx wrote:
Holocron wrote:
Larathorn wrote:
My opinion, make it so you can declare Overt anywhere, anytime. To become Covert you have to go back to the recruiter and wait an hour. There is no reason that I should have to be within 50m to put on my uniform or flash my military ID and fight for my ideals.
That would let you move in armies of safe people to the location of a fight, and have them all go overt at once and ambush...
How about having it so you can declare overt, anytime anywhere, but for a minute or two other overts can attack you but you cannot attack them...this would solve the problem of massive ambushes.
This still allows you to bypass any defenses put up around player cities or factional bases. NPCs wouldn't attack you, nor would any turrents and such. This is totally unaccpetable.
AudioOrgana wrote:
Sounds like a great idea.
I'd also like to see a faction perk that allows you to go overt anywhere- sort of a one-shot deal item that when you use it allows you to go overt once.
Audio
I could only see this as balancing if it was a serious amount of faction points - say 5000 or higher. This would prevent eventual abuse of the item.
Better yet, don't even bother with it. Unless the cost of the item is made extremely high, it would be abused.
Kiljoy001 wrote:
That would let you move in armies of safe people to the location of a fight, and have them all go overt at once and ambush...
And this bad because ?
This would be ideal not bad.
Isn't this obvious to you? It would destroy any concept of a defense, You could bypass all NPC defenders protecting the perimeter, along with any turrents and such. It makes defenses totally pointless. This would destroy game balance as far as the defenders are concerned and gives every advantage to the attackers.
Vampiric_Hoshi wrote:
Larathorn wrote:
My opinion, make it so you can declare Overt anywhere, anytime. To become Covert you have to go back to the recruiter and wait an hour. There is no reason that I should have to be within 50m to put on my uniform or flash my military ID and fight for my ideals.
Holocron Replied:
"That would let you move in armies of safe people to the location of a fight, and have them all go overt at once and ambush... -Raph Koster,"
So please tell me, Mr Koster, isn't what you described EXACTLY what people are already doing with one overt in a group of coverts? As soon as the overt is attacked, suddenly an entire army "declares" while TEF'ed.
I think Larathorn is right. Forget the whole "needing a recruiter to declare"
No.
Come on, people, you are very short-sighted here!
One Overt among the Coverts - perimeter defenses such as the turrents open fire on the Overt, kill him, and now the Coverts are totally out of luck once that turrent is taken out (or they are), aren't they?
Any of your suggestions are grossly unfair that allow players to bypass the defenses of cities and bases, that allows them to declare Overt inside the opposing factions territory.
i'm sorry, many will hate this, but its meant for Holo's ears anyway so here goes.
the idea of rubberbanding back and forth from covert to overt and back again is terrible. It is far to convenient to live your life safely within a covert status, pop overt when you wish to and then pop back (with an hour lag time, even so). It makes for alot of cowardly tactics.
Frankly, it should be: you start as a covert and enjoy the anonymity it provides. One day you decide youre strong enough to stand on your own and go Overt. there is now no going back. This would easily prevent the, ''what? a newbie rebel? i'll overt, kill em, go covert again and hide out the 1 hr change over time. haha!'' Youre either in the war..or youre not.
i would like to see at least 1 recruiter for both factions on every planet
and yes recruit camping is awful
Being able to declare anywhere has its good points, however, I think it will open the door for a bunch of whining about getting ganked all the time. Basically we will have parties of 5 or 6 or more going around, watching for overts, declaring and ganking solo overts. On valcyn, where rebel population is far overwhelming to start, this would cause havoc in an already unbalanced environment. 50m is more fair. Especially with TEF in place. I suggest addressing that before adding anymore features.
Devs will NEVER allow for you to be able to go overt on a whim EVER regardless of how many points it takes. Heres why:
To take a factional base you need 4 professions and 1 more of any. Those 5 people could enter a factional base covert, go overt at the terminals and take them down 1 by 1 without ever being attacked. Problems that like that arise all over the place....and if you dont think people wouldnt do it your a moron. The system now is fine as it is, removal of TEF soon, Holos idea if the 50m declare range is great....done deal leave it at that. No way no how should anyone be able to go overt at any given time even with use of faction points.
more value should be placed on the rank attained by a Player.
My take on declaring overt should be that you can declare overt if you are within 50m of the recruiter or if you are within 50 meters of an OVERT player Colonell.
benifts : rank adds value to the position of Colonell
allows
argghh dang lack of edit function..
ok this time the full version...
more value should be placed on the rank attained by a Player.
My take on declaring overt should be that you can declare overt if you are within 50m of the recruiter or if you are within 50 meters of an OVERT player Colonell.
benifts :
rank adds value to the position of Colonell
allows overt player of the opposing side to target them and stop other players becomming overt. It would be important that players who are high ranking have this denoted in some way that is apparent (perhaps by examining there character (ie looking for the badge))
Cons :
chain overting.. where many colonells stand in a line, and sync going overt to a large mass of coverts who then go overt them selves.
how to fix : allow a colonell to only allow up to x number of people to go overt off him over a period of time (10 minutes?) ie: he's only got so many duputy badges on him to thow out to make people go overt. also players that wish to go overt must at least target the player in question to denote who they're shouting they're overt toAND/OR Only allow a colonell to be used as like this if they've been overt for over 30 minutes (so 1 cornel can't over 10 more and inturn have an instant 100 people be able ot come overt off of them). basically it's like having to have the time to set up your communication lines and logistics to support your men "in the field".
Large numbers of high ranking players could then orgainise larger group of sneak attack groups but to do so would require decent co-ordination. And a cirtian ammount of risk in that overt colonells would have to be on radar to any opposing faction member placing them in the fireing line.
Further expansion on the idea :
Allow lesser ranks to do the same but for decreasing ammounts of people and for an increased ammount of required overt time (ie: even a private could let 1 person become overt but they'd have had to have been overt for over 12 hours).
Allow COVERTplayer Colonell's to let players become covert themselves but on a 2 hour timer instead (ie can pull the strings but orgainising fake ID's isn't really there job .. it's the recruiters..)
maybe tie a faction point cost to the whole process so it's not exactly free to do this but it can be done
THROW THE SQUAD LEADER CHARACTER CLASS A ***edit**ing BONE
for pittys sake let the squad leader class influence this whole process in some way shape or form, I don't play one and am unlike to but surely this is the sort of thing that squad leaders will be able to enhance in some way (reduced costs/time, increased number's/distance)