Development Cycle Archive
Thread: Great Expectations, Major Schedule Changes and making SWG the finest MMORPG ever
DarthBrundleFLY
Mon Jul 19, 2004 12:09 pm
#2146
Aakhperkare wrote:
The developers of this game just baffle me.
It's not just because of this delay and being lied to and all that, it's everything. It's incredibly hard to believe that these are some of the people that designed the game from scratch. It's like they are working on a project they know nothing about. Just about every decision or almost every idea they have/make kills the game that much more...
Your definately not alone in that feeling....lol
I came across this early dev chat transcript here http://www.swgalaxies.net/chat/log_sept202001.php3
It gave me a good laugh...especially the following...
XDARKX asked: Do you plan on having enough servers and bandwith to encounter the demand when the game first goes online and people play 24/7
BoShek said: Yes...we will have the bandwidth and server capacity for launch of SWG. We have a lot of experience with EQ. This is not our first game.
We all know how day one went.....are they really sure this is not thier 1st game......
Master Bounty Hunter 
Lieutenant Imperial Army
Getoc
Mon Jul 19, 2004 12:15 pm
#2147
is it possible to get armor certs earlier and while ure at it please make encumb matter like thatu can only wear armor if ure standard base secondarys allows it . ignoring all buffs on these pools at this point.
TantraSin
Mon Jul 19, 2004 12:48 pm
#2148
We appreciate your continued participation in the SWG community. Please continue to give us constructive feedback on our message boards as it helps us keep focused on your needs and priorities. -TH
The masses have spoken. I'm foolishly pre-paid, so i have months left to be here. But it's a noble sacrifice. No JTLS for me, no renewing my subscription. In World War 2 soldiers did not undie to make the world a better place for those who came after. I also know the empty friends list feeling, and yes, it got worse this weekend. I'm one of them. No fix can bring me back. I'm behind many, no promise at this time means anything to us. We stopped listening. Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me. Fool me 3 times shame on who?
As ex-musician, current architect on tempest, no value to me to get a combat revamp. I was closing shop weeks ago, reason I didn't go then? Everything will be fixed in the combat revamp. GCW will solve these major issues. I accepted that I got architectural schematics for lights that were bugged. Why again? Because I knew that the Core Game needed repairs. I was thinking of going back to Music for those rare moments i log back in, but decided not to. I don't want a new song. I wanted a stable core to build on. I saw swoop tracks, I still haven't gone to them. No matter what I might want, or what I might request, or whine about, it does not change in the least bit that the core game system needs attention. I'm not saying fix it now. I'm not saying fix it tomorrow. I'd request it get fixed yesterday.
Amazon.com, reviews/recommendations for JTL "Do not buy", various sites have it. We can keep this up. I've already personally recommended people away from this game. I've honestly said to potential customers the strong and weak points of this game, and honestly lead them elsewhere. Reviews of JTL currently from independat reviewers are less than "exceptional". On it's currently time table for Christmas release, JTL will not see the light of day. My personal opinion on the "sleepless nights" was not over being publicly flamed, TH has been flamed before. The Devs are loosing sleep over JTL. A sub-par game is pushing out the door, again. Consumers can see it. From everything I've seen in every other space-shoot-em-up, JTLS is going to be rather, inferior.
I thank who ever in this thread (sorry i forgot to look at the poster) posted the link to SW:Battle grounds. That looks like a galactic civil war. One that's coming out in September. To battlegrounds i can say wow, no need to dust off my old copy of SW:Force Commander.
Sig below, couple bad reviews for SW:G. If you take 10 minutes, there are more sites, with previews of JTLS that are not positive either. Begin sig.
CreoVex
Mon Jul 19, 2004 1:02 pm
#2149
TO: Thunderheart
FROM: SWG Community
You are no longer a welcome member in our eyes. You talked about how you related to the community and cared so much for this game and the development and yet you get promoted and walk out on the community concerning THE MOST important issue this game has had since before you became another Forum Drone of SOE. As for your comment about sleepless nights, tough $#!T, how do you think your going to be sleeping in 5 years when your applying for another Community Manager position at another gaming company? I mean with SOE's successes like "Core Combat" for Planetside (another example of forgetting about the flaws for an expansion) and this current slap in the face of not only the long time players but also the corespondents (who have repeatedly given you the info on how to fix professions...ie Smuggler) I would say you are making your future look dim outside of SOE. Stand up for the community, don't just take it from your bosses, go to them with the numbers and show them the proof of past lies, the cancellationsand make them see it our way. Maybe then you can earn our respect again, for now, you vision quest is a perfect parallel for falling to the darkside. Once you were good and we valued what you had to say, now you are just another SOE PR puppet who they are using cause you used to be one of us.
TO: SWG Developers
FROM: SWG Community
Don't you think its about time you delivered on what you promised? Don't you get tired of having to lie everytime a question is asked? I mean, wouldn't it be an easier working environment if you didn't have to fear the forums but rather where respected and praised inthem??? Maybe you should bring that up in a meeting, and start making promises you can keep, fixing things that should have been fixed a long time ago, and start realizing that the community is what pays your paycheck. If the community leaves, is SOE going to be keeping all of you around for a dying game?? SUGGESTION: Earn our respect, and stop lieing to us. Also, we don't mind schedule changes, but over a half a year of promising changes that are needed and then putting a "non important time period class" (AKA JEDI) as the priority has done nothing but insult us. Star Wars = Star Chat (bring the War element) and we will bring the people. (ALSO: please stop posting Swoop Tracks as if they mean $#!t, we all know how easy it is to place a waypoint, stop boring us with "New" Crap and fix the elements that make the game)
TO: SOE Management
FROM: SWG Community
Did you not learn your lession from Planetside, Everquest and other games that had pushed expansions over current game breaking issues? I am assured you someone in your office thought that the Episode of South Park with the Underwear Nomes was funny but you should never have adopted their business model.
Phase 1 - Collect Underwear (SOE - Sell game with lies attached to promote growth)
Phase 1 - Collect Underwear (SOE - Sell game with lies attached to promote growth)
Phase 2 - ??? (SOE - ???)
Phase 3 - Profit (SOE - Sell new expansion while not fixing major previous issues and continue to promise items that will never see the light of day as to continue to string along subscribers to the "next great fix")
You admitted you made a mistake in EQ and I think its about time you slap around those idiot financial advisors who somehow got a spot managing this project and believe that more capital is the answer to this problem. Well you just are creating a loop for disaster in believeing in this model:
"New product > new captial> which can be used to hire more employees > who will get stuck on new projects > which starts this cycle over again"
"New product > new captial> which can be used to hire more employees > who will get stuck on new projects > which starts this cycle over again"
SOE, spend the money now, increase your personnel, fix you management style, learn to prioritize from your customers, not from your financial sheets. And yes, most of us know that the true reason you want to increase capital and tend to release your expansions in fourth quarter of the fiscal year is to fancy up your financial statements to impress the stockholders. That is why you are not pushing JTL back in favor of the Combat Balance.
FINAL THOUGHT:
MAKES US WANT TO BE YOUR CUSTOMERS!! Don't believe us? Look at similar games, City of Heros, Everquest, Space and Beyond, FFXI, and tons more.... We wanted to play Star Wars Galaxies, not Jedi Academy. We wanted to experience the life in Star Wars, not just experience life in the stars.
-NightRaven (ingame)
RohmEnari
Mon Jul 19, 2004 1:04 pm
#2150
In case you devs can't tell, you have about 2,000 people calling you out.
In the words of Mick Foley.....
SHOW SOME TESTICULAR FORTITUDE AND RESPOND TO THE PEOPLE!!!
Saratoga
Mon Jul 19, 2004 1:06 pm
#2151
Lydyann wrote:
SWG:
2,301 accounts lost and counting
= $34,500 = 1 job lost.
It isnt lost on many of us the number of positions being advertised as open and Q-3P0 moving on to greener pastures. Something is happening behind the scenes.
Message Edited by Saratoga on 07-19-2004 04:07 PM
Xziac
Mon Jul 19, 2004 1:10 pm
#2152
RohmEnari wrote:
In case you devs can't tell, you have about 2,000 people calling you out.
In the words of Mick Foley.....
SHOW SOME TESTICULAR FORTITUDE AND RESPOND TO THE PEOPLE!!!
non-star wars post:
Foley is God
zenbabe
Mon Jul 19, 2004 1:10 pm
#2153
I've been impressed, while reading this thread and much of the buried one, over how many literate, thoughtful, mature players there are on so many live servers, many of whom have been here from the beginning, many of whom have a low post count, but who are posting now..
... and they are angry.
... and they are leaving.
... and they are unwilling to finance a new game they will have to buy in lieu of what that money was supposed to support.
Our very high monthly fees were supposed to finance continual, massive bug fixes, profession tweaks/fixes, and genuinely interesting content, like the monthly stories. If we say we've been promised these things since November (though really, that was the deal they stipulated when the game first came out, right?), then these changes are currently eight months late, and they want us to wait eight more (at MINIMUM)... lol. I can see it now, next January, after not really fixing anything in the ground game.. and probably leaving the space game with lots of annoying bugs.., TH or his replacement will come in and say, all innocent and naive and enthusiastic "So! What kinds of things do you all need fixed? Tell me! Help me help you!", clearly revealing that s/he has not read one single thing from the correspondents or the general player population for months on END.
Ugh. You either laugh or you cry. If my friends said they were all jumping to a new game tonight I would cancel in a heartbeat.
By the way, remember that Thunderheart has shown himself, time and time again, to be more than willing to take the praise for anything that happens to be fixed or improved, and people are usually more than willing to give him all the credit in the world for these things. But for bad news, TH is suddenly just a mouthpiece.
Either way you view him, powerful or mouthpiece, it's going to be difficult/impossible for the vast majority to believe another word he happens to type, huh. Or any red name, for that matter. They desperately need to up the level of communication right now, of course, but only action can possibly save anything, at this point.
I'm thinking Galaxies has officially "jumped the shark".
Ah well. At least I met some very cool people I wouldn't have otherwise
... and they are angry.
... and they are leaving.
... and they are unwilling to finance a new game they will have to buy in lieu of what that money was supposed to support.
Our very high monthly fees were supposed to finance continual, massive bug fixes, profession tweaks/fixes, and genuinely interesting content, like the monthly stories. If we say we've been promised these things since November (though really, that was the deal they stipulated when the game first came out, right?), then these changes are currently eight months late, and they want us to wait eight more (at MINIMUM)... lol. I can see it now, next January, after not really fixing anything in the ground game.. and probably leaving the space game with lots of annoying bugs.., TH or his replacement will come in and say, all innocent and naive and enthusiastic "So! What kinds of things do you all need fixed? Tell me! Help me help you!", clearly revealing that s/he has not read one single thing from the correspondents or the general player population for months on END.
Ugh. You either laugh or you cry. If my friends said they were all jumping to a new game tonight I would cancel in a heartbeat.
By the way, remember that Thunderheart has shown himself, time and time again, to be more than willing to take the praise for anything that happens to be fixed or improved, and people are usually more than willing to give him all the credit in the world for these things. But for bad news, TH is suddenly just a mouthpiece.
Either way you view him, powerful or mouthpiece, it's going to be difficult/impossible for the vast majority to believe another word he happens to type, huh. Or any red name, for that matter. They desperately need to up the level of communication right now, of course, but only action can possibly save anything, at this point.
I'm thinking Galaxies has officially "jumped the shark".
Ah well. At least I met some very cool people I wouldn't have otherwise
DakkTunon
Mon Jul 19, 2004 1:16 pm
#2155
This says so much...
(so when did he last log in 07-19-2004 10:04 AM ... and he's offline now... hmmm... maybe in a meeting?... /dream)
As does this...
(Last post was 07-16-2004 06:45 PM... are they just cowering under desks or getting their resumes in order...?)
Serenius
Mon Jul 19, 2004 1:19 pm
#2156
Well this certainly explains part of the bug-laden enterprise that is SWG (pulled from the careers section of the announcement forum).
Somehow I doubt the smaller bolded part will go well with the larger bolded part.
Job Title: Senior Server Programmer
Location: Austin, TX
Link to Job Title: Senior Server Programmer
Requirements
Primary Responsibilities:
- Design, Develop, Document, and Debug quality code
- Design and implement server side game code for massively multiplayer games
- Work with a team of highly talented programmers, artists, and designers
- Provide status reports, and recommendations to team members
- Accept and provide direction, work well under pressure, and handle multiple tasks
Requirements:
- 3+ years C++ Experience
- Strong experience with client/server/network Programming (TCP/IP, UDP, Sockets)
- Experience programming in a multi-threaded environment
- Experience with Win32 and Unix Platforms
- Experience with GDB
- Experience with SQL Database (optional)
- A passion for games
Compensation/Benefits: Sony Online Entertainment offers a competitive salary and a generous benefits package that includes Medical, Dental, 401K, Vision and additional perks.
SOE is an equal opportunity employer
UKMars
Mon Jul 19, 2004 1:25 pm
#2157
Lydyann wrote:
SWG:
2,301 accounts lost and counting
2,302
You have been given ample time to respond DEVS. The obvious conclusion here is that you don't actually care about the player base. This is a disgusting turn of events and I am so thoroughly disillusioned by your behaviour that I will NEVER touch another SOE product in my life.
It is such a terrible, terrible waste. I suppose there is a sense of honour to be gleaned from this debacle, I have witnessed firsthand the death of a game. All that potential...GONE in a flash.
Still, don't worry too much DEVS, I hear McDonalds are hiring for the Summer
<---The smiley killed the game!
KzinKiller
Mon Jul 19, 2004 1:27 pm
#2158
Geez, knowing how highly they value C++ in hiring reminded me of this quote ...
"C makes it easy to shoot yourself in the foot; C++ makes it harder, but when you do, it blows away your whole leg."
- Bjarne Stroustrup
How true ... how true ...
"C makes it easy to shoot yourself in the foot; C++ makes it harder, but when you do, it blows away your whole leg."
- Bjarne Stroustrup
How true ... how true ...