Development Cycle Archive
Thread: Developing a Solution for the Faction Base Issue
Yes I saw this tactic being used by rebel players at the imperial outpost dantooine. It is impossible to get them in PvP then. No way. They build hoses just outside of the outpost and raid it occcasionally. This is no flame, it's even clever, I must admit, but this way you cannot beat them.
with regards.
Bria server - Near IMP Oasis on Tat
Rebel placed home there to grief the IMP's
His home name was "Blank home of lame tatics"
While I feel this is a bad way to play - It is also a valid use of the game mechanics - The same as wearing armor or having 5 friends hiding behind a rock
Since this issue is in the DEV eye - I have a few ideas to fix it
1. Make ANY structure that will keep someone out during combat - Attackable - no to destroy but to enter during combat only.
2. Make structures restrict anyone in combat
Item 1 would make the game more fun and the griefers would get whats coming to them 
. But it would also make running for home to hide from the bad guys impossable. Lets say 5 Rebels are camping your home ...you leave and they attack you...you dive in you home and then they beat down the door and kill you in you home. Great - now they do this over and over = Griefers
Item 2 Would make someone not have a safe zone. Lets say you are heading home after a hard day busting caps in rebel scum and the same 5 guys are waiting for ya - bam they jump you - you run for your home and can not get in to hide - Great - now they do this over and over = Griefers
I like item one with one small change - allow the person in the home to end combat and logoff to end the seige on his home.
Or
Lets say Rebel Scum attacks 3 IMPS outside his home...now all parties are in combat
The home then becomes open to outside fire and becomes like armor for the people inside.
The griefers get to hide with limited armor - but be pinned down
and
The outside parties get to attack the griefers - and or run from area
This would be fair to both sides
Hope these help
I vote for the Structure TEF system combined with the TEF lockout system.
1) Private structures will gain a (STEF) Structure Temporary Eemy **edit** when the owner or a PC on the Admin List enters the house with a TEF. Basically making the structure public w/o access fees for10 minutes, or however long you want to make the TEF, just make it match the players TEF timer.
2) Players that are simply on the "Entry List" cannot access the house with a TEF because they do not have the necessary skills to administer the house.
Now if you are a TEF on the entry list and you are following a player with a TEF in the admin list you'd be able to get in because him entering makes it public using the STEF.
The same rules would apply for Overt players.
Some ideas I like so far :
A no build zone around Factional HQs.
Make buildlings inside a certain range for Factional HQs attackable. Really if you build a house in range of a Factional HQs, your asking for trouble.
Make is so only the person placing the Factional HQ can give someone "admin rights" to place a structure inside the Factional HQs no build zone. But again, if you take this route, I still believe anything placed inside a Factional HQ range should be attackable.
Not so hot ideas:
I don't like making the TEF rules too complicated. I've been reading this thread ( 65% of the posts) and they can get confusing. Houses that turn public all of a sudden... Maybe its just me but this sounds like more exploits will come out of this then it will fix.
PLZ DEVS - think this out carefully.
Ok, this may be a little off the wall, but how about something like a Reverse TEF if you enter a private structure while in combat mode? ... Meaning that you can run for cover in your home if you need to, but for 5 minutes you can not re-engage if you go back outside. Would this not solve the problem of the hit and run to cover and come back and hit again?
Just a thought
There is a super-easy extra-simple way to handle house damage:
If you are in combat with someone from an enemy faction, and you enter a house, and that enemy is for whatever reasonunable to enter that house, that enemy may shoot the house, causing damage directly to the maintenance pool.
"Imperial_Player uses Full Charge Shot to cost House_Owner 1598 credits"
Since the only situations in which the enemy player wouldn't be able to enter the house would be:
1) It is a private structure, and the person fleeing into the house is on the entry list
2) It is a public structure, and the person outside the house is on the ban list
...one way or another, that's now a consentual PvP house.
How about not allowing anyone inside a house to target anyone outside the house. That way people would not be able to drag anyone outside the house inside. Current target would be dropped as soon as you entered the house so you couldn't run out to fire a shot then duck back in.
As for the idea about not entering with a TEF, I think that's a bit too much. If I killed someone in Coronet, then ran 3 minutes to my house, I shouldn't be prevented from entering. Likewise, my PA constantly has Imp spawns appearing around our PA town. If we were to get TEF killing that, it wouldn't make sence to prevent us from going in the houses/hall for 5 minutes.
My solution wouldn't prevent people from ducking in and out to attack, but it would make it harder for them. They would have to come out of the house to target someone, at the same time they're doing that, someone could easly hide around the corner waiting for them to come out. The person coming out wouldn't know where they were hiding out, while the ones outside would.
The title of this thread is about faction bases but all i see is TEF on hideing in houses......
If we are talking about Actual Faction bases that players can get there are many many many things wrong but the #1 things that needs to be addressed is WHY can every person that views the terminals tell when it is vulnerable?????? and on top of that it went to it cycles up 2 hours every day, an example of this would be today it is vulnerable at 2pm Est, but tommorrow its 4pm est and so on.......
Now this is 2 good ideas but together because of the last patch this is Horrible, there is No way you can get people to defend a base that may or may not be attacked at all these diffrent hours of the day, when we first placed it, i picked a time i knew everyone was on and we could defend but theres no Way we can get a group on to defend at 7am Est, and the other side can however find enough people on to go attack, and i would have to find everyone of my faction on to come to defend that is in the area in only 5 minutes.....
Who ever did this in the last patch is causeing all the hard earned bases go up in smoke without even a battle for them because they attack when nobody is on, and i know if my base gets destroyed i lose 60k Faction points and i will not save up for it again and im sure many others would never do this with these options in the game, either you lose the vulnerability time speeding up 2 hours a day OR you lose the ability so everyone can run in the base and check what time it is, Smugglers can buy FP run into a base look at the time leave the faction and go back to the opposing and tell everyone, and not to mention the people with 2 accounts............
THIS needs to be addressed more than TEF and people hideing in houses, i can Avoid a guy in a house and just let him stay in there all day but loseing 60K FP at 6am while everyone isnt on due to school or work and we dont even have a chance to defend the base isnt right at all even with mine fields turrets(which there is still issues with these things)
Reading some people's solutions make me cringe. Can we please have a solution that isn't artificial when it doesn't have to be. Identify the problem. Make a fix that directly addresses THAT problem without breaking something else.
1. Combat Medics tossing disease out of the house then running back in.
2. Medics dragging people inside the outside.
3. People setting up houses in mission zones.
4. People attacking bases then running back into their house.
Solutions:
1. Drop current target when entering a house and do not allow targeting from inside the house to anything outside the house.
2. Do not allow opposing faction or neutral houses within a certain distance of faction base. 150 to 300m sounds good.
Those 2 simple, non-belief stretching ideas would solve 3 of the above problems. Problem #3 isn't really a problem that the devs need to code against. Simple solution would be to take missions where their houses aren't.
Please don't make the TEF system even more complicated than it already is. More complicated a system is, the more prone it is to bugs and failure. Don't mess with access fees, they work for another part of the game (though I personally don't use them). Fix the problem without creating more problems. Small solutions work best.
No, the problem is that peopleCHOSE to bein PvP mode but have a way to curcimvent that system to gain an unfair advantage. They might as well have a command that makes you invulnerable. Shoot, then hit /invulnerabe. Shoot, then hit /invulnerabe. Or, hit /invulnerabe and you can still heal people. You are basically turning your TEF or Overt status off and on at will. These small solutions solve nothing. You can still hit /invulnerabe. Baring people from these structures is the only reasonable way to stop this. Besides, it would be ONE more rule instead ofTWO, and beleif has nothing to do with it.
Trystan1969 wrote:
Reading some people's solutions make me cringe. Can we please have a solution that isn't artificial when it doesn't have to be. Identify the problem. Make a fix that directly addresses THAT problem without breaking something else.
1. Combat Medics tossing disease out of the house then running back in.
2. Medics dragging people inside the outside.
3. People setting up houses in mission zones.
4. People attacking bases then running back into their house.
Solutions:
1. Drop current target when entering a house and do not allow targeting from inside the house to anything outside the house.
2. Do not allow opposing faction or neutral houses within a certain distance of faction base. 150 to 300m sounds good.
Those 2 simple, non-belief stretching ideas would solve 3 of the above problems. Problem #3 isn't really a problem that the devs need to code against. Simple solution would be to take missions where their houses aren't.
Please don't make the TEF system even more complicated than it already is. More complicated a system is, the more prone it is to bugs and failure. Don't mess with access fees, they work for another part of the game (though I personally don't use them). Fix the problem without creating more problems. Small solutions work best.