Development Cycle Archive
Thread: IC4: Path of the Jedi
Jedi Quests - For the Jedi, not to become a Jedi
First off, the quests should be varied in nature. Combat should be only a small part of it. Not all Jedi have access to millions of credits, crystals, pearls and an unlimited stash of uber sabres.
To obtain the quest, perhaps the holocrons should come back into play. Use it to obtain the location of your next quest. First quest could be to create a holocron (non-sellable, Personal use only).
Some quests could be based on force power use, depending on level. Others could be seach for an answer types. Problem solving, investigation, thought based quests should be very high on the list. Aiding the helpless, righting the wrongs, all things Jedi. Of course, dark Jedi could wrong the rights and hurt the helpless.
Combat based quests should be a small, small part. The game is already all combat based. For more fighting, go do a mission. I want something that will occupy my time, give Jedi xp, and not require a 5 pearl sabre, full 80+ composite, and a set of buffs, while being bot followed by a master CM.
Give Jedi the ability to go up in skills without the wholesale slaughter that is currently required. If you want to do nothing but quests to raise your Jedi, you should be able to. Keepers of the peace...remember? Not killers of the durni. Aid in the GCW, without killing all the brain dead stormtroopers wandering about the cities. "We're keepers of the peace...not soldiers...we can't win a war for you."
Quest could also enable other features. Loot drops to aid in kd/dizzy etc. Jedi 'armor', clothing, weapons. Shouldn't raise the wrath of the crafters, as they dont make these things anyway.
biwan: MohrI believe that quests should be somewhat unique to each individual. The quests should also not force people to become dependent upon combat to accomplish it. Here are some thoughts on the FSCS slot:
1. Light side-Dark side: Each player should have a hidden faction bar which would lean to either the light side or the dark side. Becomming a Jedi is something that requires people to make well thought out choices.Dark Jedi let themselves give in to their darker emotions. Becomming a true Jedi should be about following the Jedi code to the best of a players ability and making choices that avoid unneccessary conflict.The dark side is a more seductive path but it should have consequences.(Ie loss of physical attributes when powers are used. An example Jedi would take fatigue damage while a Dark Jedi would take wounds from using their powers)
When dealing with NPC's starting a fight without provocation should earn dark faction. You have created a number of quests that can be used to accumuate light side faction. I would also consider having darkside tainted creatures spawn on occasion. There could also be some consdieration taken into affect with mission quests. Certain missions could be considered good/evil and be scored for faction (Ie killing creatures for entertainment is an evil act while saving a farmer from having his crops destroyed from some kind of vermin may be consdiered a good act.) Even Rebel factional missions should provide the opportunity to loose Light side faction. There are a number of Rebel revenge missions that would not be considered appropriate for Jedi. I would also suggest that you place some light side missons on the Imperial side. Let the deed determine the price to be paid.
2. The Progression: Once a FSCS slot is opened the character should not automaticly become a Jedi. The player should be consdiered a Force Adept. These players should have limited but useful powers. They should have inflated skill tree costs but still be allowed to become other professions. Their knowldege of the force can help them attain their goals but they'll never be as powerful as the Jedi until they follow the path to become one.
Once Force Adept is mastered then the next step should be Apprentice, Padawan and from that point make a distiction between Jedi guardian, Jedi sentinal and Jedi Counselor. Yes these titles come right out of KOTR but they make sense. Not all Jedi handle problems the same way and providing optional pathways would provide an opportunity for advancement throuh their play style. I do believe that you shold allow players to have other professions but once again the Jedi skill tree should cost more skill points to advance than the standard template. To become a true Jedi Master however all skill points would need to be dedicated to the profession.
3. General Thoughts on the Quests themselves: There must be a certain element of randomness or else we get people camping static spawns. The quest should take a number of steps but each step is one of perhaps 20 options which will create a diverse set of opportunities. Holocrons could still be used to provide a player with guidance. Some of the NPC's approached should also take into consideration play style, Artisan/Jedi Trainersprovide missions which involves crafting. Entertainer/Jedi Trainersprovide opportunities for queststo work these steps out socially. Medic/Jedi direct have quests that require medical orientated characters to use their skills. Combat centered Jedi would provide quest opportunities to work the quest out using their strengths.
The Jedi quest would require people to take on certain skills to be successful but still allow them to retain their core character. For example a crafting orinetated Jedi might have to advance in weaponsmith a bit to make a special component item. A medical character may have to take a few levels in doctor to be able to craft a cure for a disease. These tasks should be something which the persepective Jedi needs to accomplishby their selfto advance and not be something they can buy their way through by purchasing the item in question.
4. NPC's to Interact with: You have a number of underutilized static characters in game. They offer some missions but other appear to be there just for show. The quests should be galaxy spanning and involve interaction with these static NPC's. Having a trainer or holocron direct you to the next one of a number of NPC's throughout the galaxy to key the next step or task in the quest would provide some diversity. Yes at some point there should be interaction with some of the core SWG NPC's but they should be part of your final step towards becomming Jedi.
5. At some point a Jedi needs to face the Trial which Luke Skywalker went through. They need to face the dark reflection of themselves and overcome it. Dark side characters would face a different kind of challenge such as defeating their master and or other Dark Jedi Apprentices. Only after the trial is complete should the player have the opportunity to advance in the Jedi skill tree.
It can be both, but seperate the ideas so its easy to read (thanks
nolan007 wrote:
Thunderheart,
Is this In-Concept about what Jedi should do after they've unlocked their slot?
Or, is this thread about whatplayers shoulddo to open up their Jedi slot?
I'm confused.
)Quests should involve doing certain things that DO require a profession. This should not be the whole of it, but part of it. Quests should, and undoubtedly will, include aspects that nobody likes. The path to Jedi is long, difficult, and requires sacrifice on the part of the player. Any system that requires a player to NOT sacrifice his time orcharacters template is going to be too easy.
No, Luke didn't have to dance for anyone, but Luke was already force-sensitive. We're talking about a game mechanic to unlock the "secret character".
Quests should be single player - the Jedi's life is solo, so the path to it should be solo.
In-keeping with the movies, the character created using the FSCS should not have any force powers. Luke was 18 and had never used the force, or was aware of it. It wasn't until Obi-Wan made him use the training device on the Millenium Falcon that he first experienced his latent powers. The first task of the newly created FSC shouldbe to awaken his abilities.
Luke's path to Jedi Knighthood involved rigourous training, difficult decisions and above all, understanding. The journey to the Dark Side seems to largely be about desire for power, often focused around unlocking their own. Impatience and a willingness to trample on others to get what they want marks initiates of the Dark Side.
The quests should reflect the above aspects. The path to Jedi should focus around ideology, as much as, if not more thancombat.
I don't believe you should be abletocraft your way to Jedi Master.
Sal
my bad.
my only sugguestion to devs is please think about an reedit of the skill points system maybe there are many wich thought about 300 skill points to aplay as instead of 250 ... couse many professions are needed to feel free as an individual in SWG but with these 250 points right now every one is bound to focus on only 2 Master and if proffesions need like medic aswell an scout couse slow walking , everyone has these prof. aswell but for these 15 points for an novice is realy to much for learning it ...
please think about it
greets Liuy
However, the posts prompt me to metion a few itmes that I feel should really be strongly considered. They are as follows:
1. Don't make players do things that are just annoying, and stupid wasted of time, like:
A. Waiting for x npc that only spawns once each day/week/whatever.
B. Doing anything in x seconds, no timed events please. Don't make this a twitchy game of keyboard and macro creation skill.
c. Have to pay XXXXX credits to continue, the reasons are ovious on this.
Jedi are methodical, deliberate, and proceed with caution and sure feet. they take no action without reason, and never take a life if there is any alternative. Good things to keep in mind
2. Use existing game contnet, like badges, and theme parks to tie into this.
3. Include many differnet professions, like:
A. Find a sample of bla bla bla steel of XXX stats
B. Track down the elusive XXXX and hail it
C. Go forth and heal the wounded and sick
D. Rid the farming community known as XXX on XXXx of xxxx threat
F. Go th Singing Mountian Clan With XXX and convince her to surender XXX artifact to you (no drop, acquired by a series of quests)
G. Serve the movement to end the sway of the dark side, attaning an officers rank
H. Travel to XXX sites of power (PoI's) and bring back proof of the pilgramiage (badges)
I. Prepare/acquire XXX drink that aids in meditation (quest series involving chef quested food that you need not make, but must quest the componets of)
J. Follow XXX and find out where he goes, you must survive to report this information.
You get the idea.
OdiousEncounter wrote:
Whatever it is, it should NOT be one step kill, escort, fetch, or deliver missions, ala themeparks. Act III was a good example of mission varity, and although i still don't think they're up to snuff for the jedi system,it's a good starting place. Conversing with jabba's NPC was interesting and relatively well done. Having to think your way through the conversations knowing that you won't get a second chance (outside of shuttling off planet to grab the mission again) was very good. Even the defend the base mission was much more interesting than destroying the base, even if the mechanics really aren't much different.) Variance is important. I don't want to fetch 10 datadisks in a row. I don't even want you to invent a brilliant mission and us play through minor variations of it 20 times. The only way the quest system will work is if you get many DIFFERENT forms of missions, all providing an interesting and well-madedeviation from the norm. Having different sort of missions (requiring acheiver, explorer, and socializer skills all) is also a necessity. Require all of those skills, but not to such a radical extent that we will have to stop doing what we enjoy for long periods of time. That is why the profession mastery system failed.
I couldn't agree with this post more!
maybe some random missions you get while waiting helps figure out if your heading in the right direction? When i come up with some ideas about the other quests i'll post them here
hopefully some people like my ideasThanks for your time in reading this