Development Cycle Archive

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rYsyn wrote:

Actually, Jol69 has a good point, let's not be to quick to jump on him for it. While I do not agree with a Bounty Hunter losing 9/10 times in one on one combat, I think his point that Bounty Hunters are mostly tracking and killing the dregs of society.

I like his suggestion about a "surprise shot" and his point about fighting a Warrior Profession is also valid, while I think it is more representative to say 50/50 win /loss (verse losing 9/10 times) he does bring up a good point that should be factored into the process.

Bounty Hunters should get an "advantage" when tracking a bounty (or in any combat situation) in that they should havea "surprise" attack factor.

• Maybe in the first 20 secs of combat (10 secs for PvP), they have an automatic "Intimidation factor" that negates the marks defense mods.


• After that 20 secs, it goes to normal.

Lenwe, don't forget that Bounty Hunters didn't track down and kill jedi in the moives. The only Bounty Hunter that killed Jedi (that I am aware of) use to be a Jedi (and technically still is one), so that is not a fair comparison to say that ALL Bounty Hunters can kill Jedi and Tracked. Vador took out most of the Jedi. As for the Clone Army, you are correct but also keep in mind that the cloneswere geneticly altered to be superiorto Jango.

All are good points, some are more extreme IMO (losing 9 / 10 times), but valid points none the less.

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Yes, some bounty hunters should be aimed at hunting the lowlifes of societies. What about the Master Bounty Hunter? What about the Bounty Hunter that has killed so many smugglers, thieves, hobos, and desperate guys with guns that he knows every trick in the book? Thebounty hunter should be able to anazlyze a singletarget and be ableutilizethe most effective means of disposing ofthat singletarget. THe lower level bounty hunters at lower level targets but the higher level bounty hunters at higher level targets.

Here's a new thought: Take a commando for instance. He has big guns for taking out big things. You don't use rocket launchers on single targets. You fire rockets at large, armor protected targets. The same thing can go for any profession. They have their specializations. The Bounty Hunter's specialization should be adapting. He should be able to pick up a pistol and go head to head with a pistoleer with a great chance winning. He should be able to pick up a carbine and go head to head with a carbineer with a great chance of winning. He should be able to pick up the LLC and go head to head with a commando with a great chance of winning. The only exception would be if that pistoleer or carbineer or commando or whatever had a friends of other classes with him. The Master Bounty hunter should be able to do what it's description says: "Able to effectively track down and eliminate almost any opponent.

What defines theBounty Hunterrole in combat?

In this game, they should be able to take out any other profession with some careful planning and strategy. They are defined by their ability to gain advantages in combat in order to complete their contract. This comes from a thorough knowledge of all aspects of armed and unarmedcombat. A bh gets paid to aquire or kill a mark, and that mark could likely be someone pretty tough. A bh must have the ability to gain the upperhand even with a stronger foe, with plenty of effective options for whatever may conditions may arise.

What basic combat elements should they possess?

Specials that attack specific pools.Specials that eliminate defenses. Powerful dot specials. the ability to determine a targets weaknesses and strengths. subcategories of specialization dependent on their bh guild(see unique abilities)

What offensive abilities?

see above, and see unique abilities.

What defensive abilities?

Evasions. Retreat/escape specials.see unique abilities

What unique abilities?

player bounties. jedi tracking that works. target weakness & strength determining ability. traps for capture of pc's and npc's. access to retrieval missions and other types of non-combat "bounties"

also should have access to special bh guilds that will provide 1) specialized gear and certification for it's use(might vary from guild to guild, or be specialized for certain jobs, 2)high paying bounty missions, 3)other quests, 4)specialized training

bh guilds should vary greatly. some are imperial. some are military units for hire. some only accept certain types of missions for their members. each guild should have an area of specialization, and a bh could only belong to one at a time. there are even rival guilds, and faction points could play a part in a type of tef for rival hunters that would go into effect when in proximity to a rival. the guilds should be in secret locations that only a bh can find. like maybe a non-static recruiter might approach a master bh in a town somewhere, and give the location of the guild, along with an invite to join. these guilds also require dues, and one must accept the missions given by the guild ceo or else lose guild fp or even be removed from that guild.

Should add what advantage or asset in group combat?

other than their scouting skills, maybe just the ability to determine weakness and strengths of opponents.

How could/should they interact with other professions?

should be killing other professions for a living if necessary. bh is a solo profession.

What interaction / dependencies should exist with other combatants?

Bh is solo, should not depend on any other profession other than the artisans who craft their gear.

What should be their unique role in the Galactic Civil War?

There should be different types of bh's. some imp, some rebel, some neutral. See unique abilities.

I disagree with Odysseusa very strongly as most of the bountyhunters in starwars source material are tougher than most of the other people only overpowered by some very unique individuals and Jedi's in a fair fight but able to take even jedi's down by cunning use of their gear and abilities and some bountyhunters and even whole guilds are dedicated to hunting jedi if I remember correctly

What BH should get is a total revamp of the bh weapons system pistol part of it is ok but LLC needs to be changed to rifle and carbine needs to use carbines but called medium assault weapons and make bh "carbine" medium repeaterit makes sense and is widely used by bh's in EU andif someone wants to create a dabbler bh they should have 3 sensible choises of a weapon rather than just pistol and a master bh should be a versatile instrument of death at any range but all of that should take in account player skill I dont want any profession to haveCM like luck based autokill button...

Now BH lacks some very essential aspects of the profession ROOTS givethem tangle attacks / weapons (non spammable ofcourse and theroot could stop the target for 10 - 20 secs (10 at early skill level and 20 near master or master) and tanglewould be a delay attack 10- 20 sec with high delay on the next attack from the bh to be used mostly as a getaway attack for gameplay reasons not to make it viable free bashing of the target thats why high delay but useable inconjunction with bleedswould make it good tactically anyways wich is acceptable ... game needs to have tactics in combat

Visuals andanimations for specials (character pose/movement and projectile change due to special like torso shot looking a bit different cos it sets the target on fire)

Aspect of terrain tactics in combat allow us to jump and climb!!! I want ambushes!!! and perching mobs make it more efficient to fight mobs sportively giving bonus exp for damage suffered but an intelligent lifeform needs to be able to outsmart an animal! npc'swould just climb / jump there after you...its not like you will level fast if you keep running to a house and climb/jump on top of it to kill a mob or 3 at a time =D and take away not entering buildings at all while teffed make it only private buildings or make entrances breakable or sliceable (no looting but entry gained)

BountyHunter 1.9/4/4/4 too tired to work on investigation since august

To throw in my two bits yet again... and re-itterate a little of what's already been said. No, the Bounty Hunter class is *not* suppose to be an all powerful PvP class. Yes, the Master Bounty Hunters do use it in this way however. Not all of them, some... maybe a litte more than some. And, trust me, they are feared opponents.

They do need some different weapons though. And these do need to be geared more towards incap capturing. Think *alive or dead* missions. You successfully incap *don't have to db them* a mark... you get a bounty for an *alive* capture and for whomever you did the mission for... you get some faction points *like Jabba* and your target loses some in that area.

I'm almost inclined to say that the Bounty Hunter template is doing what it's suppose to though... starting BHs are just as easy to kill as poor Greedo was... and Masters are tricker to take care of... like Boba Fett. Just gotta catch them with their pants down is all.

Sincerely,

The Lunatic Fringer

"A lunatic thinks out of a box and lives in one..." -- The Boss

Thank you, lunatic. All the crying that goes on about the Master Bounty Hunter being SO weak in PvP makes me utterly sick. As a Master Bounty Hunter I certainly do not lose 9/10 encounters while out PvPing. In fact, the only professions that routinely beat me are master rifleman combos, and that's more due to their high amount of damage than their defenses (I choose not to wear armor so as not to look like a cookie cutter factory BH).

As I pointed out in my post back on the first or second page, I think our combat abilities are just about where they need to be. BHs are a couple cool toys and a few content items away from being as close to perfect as possible. A cert for BH special customizable armor, traps, humanoid tracking from the Ranger line (and throw the hard working Rangers a bone to replace humanoid tracking, maybe longer range on beast tracking -- I loved playing a Ranger), a nice BH carbine with heavy AP, and a BH faction with no covert status and attackable by overt Rebs and Imps, with PC bounties and I'm a happy camper.

I have found that as a BH I am mainly reliant on my state/posture change attacks early in the fight to be successful. It's been stated that stacked defenses are being taken out of the game. How many so-called "master" Bounty Hunters lose a fight and come to the forums to cry that their FKD didn't stick and it's so unfair? There are at least 5 ways to knock someone down dizzy within 5 seconds with a decent MBH template. FKD is just one tool, learn to use them all. My current attack pattern is Sprayshot/FKD/Burst Shot 2/Action shot 2/ Suppression fire. Just need one of the dizzies to stick (and the Sprayshot dizzy effect will stick even if the shot is blocked by a rifleman and causes no damage), and any of the KD/posture change shots that follow will put them on their ass (I throw the Burst Shot in for the high amount of damage it does). I don't even switch to my pistol anymore except in rare instances, like the burst shot hits the mind pool and takes 50% of it off the top.

The rest of what I have to say about the prof is in my post. Everyone has some cool ideas. Giving a BH an "I-Win" button in PvP is totally wrong and unncessary. Once defense stacking is out the window we're going to be as close to overpowered as you can get (and yet I avoid entanglements with multiple enemies, which is the way it should be). Give the MASTER Bounty Hunter (and remember Greedo was a N00B at best) a + advantage to their player mark or against a single target that they choose, make us vulnerable when there is a fracas going on around us. Remember, Jango and Boba may have been feared and fearsome opponents but they were BOTH killed rather handily when fighting in the middle ofa general melee.

LunaticFringer you only see Greedo and Bobafett as the examples of bountyhunter ??? you need to dig deeper into starwars knowledge and to find that most often bountyhunters are infact (the best ones ofcourse) the most lethal profession in the galaxy they are sent after the meanest and toughest fugitives out there while I admit many fail there are bountyhunters out there that are legendary and practically unbeatable you can beat anyone with their pants down even a jedi aside from ROTJ Boba Fett is described to be lethal at any range from far with rifle to upclose and he's not by far the only bountyhunter in the starwars world that is widely feared / respected

As for bountyhunter changes I just remembered that confiscation shouldnt apply to bountyhunters as (well on imperial planets anyways) as their bh licence lets them carry weapons anywhere even places that normally dont allow weapons at all

And to bountyhunter variety they should have melee trees in bh aswell as bountyhunters are as varied as they are many I personally would make my bountyhunter ranged / melee hybrid as I want to be as versatile as the successful bountyhunters of starwars are so change bh skill tree to have 3 ranged and 3 melee branches and you need to master any 3 of those to reach master bh with investigation (wich definately still needs to be made fun/useful)

I do see pecking order of pvp as follows 1/2. BH TKA Commando Heavy Swordsman +well tought templates(pure prof powerwise and bh having the edge unless requirements are dropped for more versatility)3 the rest combat profs4 combat / crafter hybrids .... now what I would really like to see is hybrids like entertainer/dancer/swordsman wich would give you access to blade dancer profession (super elite profs) and in case of bh's you could be specialist bountyhunter specializing in a choise of one from few different fields and ideas like this spread thru all the professions that would keep people playing and the super elite profs should be slow to level kind of like veteran thing but once you reach the top you would be a recognized / feared / respected member of the population that even jedi would have to be careful with by no means should they allow this game turn into JediWars Galaxies

but for the real topic issue in combat bountyhunter should be equipped with medium powerful attacks with tons of status effects scary enough to cause enemies single out bh's for elimination among the first ones in mass combat roots preventing enemies from fleeing aswell as trickery wich really is the trademark of the profession... and while someone might say that bh's have no place in the gcw I dont agree I play my BH more as an freelancer imperial marshall hunting enemies of the empire anywhere and ocassionally doing missions pointed out to me and there were plenty of factionally aligned bountyhunters also... thats why there should be separate bh terms for imp and reb and for hutt and other criminal organizations so we could work for a faction we want to or a few if they compatible and easily browse missions that faction hands out

yes alot of this should be in the bh thread so gonna post a copy there too

and while I rant alot about bh I actually wish all the professions were fun and interesting to play but as I play bh and a tka thats where most of my toughts are only other profession I have complained about was combat medic as that profession had autokill button =P area poison/disease while not sticking everytime decided outcome of combat manytimes damage per tick should be capped at some reasonable amount

there's plenty of bounty hunters in the eu who aren't even combat related. there's no reason to assume that all bh's are feared in combat.in most cases, asuccesful bh isvery cunning and sly, but there's even references to some who just have a 'bam-bam' method; ugh, enemy, ugh, kill.

anyway, the idea of having bh as a non-combat class is good i think. make bh specials all gear, capture and tracking related. give access to bh guilds/factions, and all the other stuff i mentioned in my first post.the main requirement being you would have to master at least on other combat profession.then the bh would be dependent on whatever combat skills they mastered before bh. they could also do away with the scout requirement and add the scouting skills a bh uses to the bh tree.

i also agree that the profession is pretty good already, just needs a few more things to make it satisfying.

mandragore

master bh,kauri

"The Master Bounty Hunter can effectively track down and eliminate almost any opponent"

That is what i would like to see. I would prefer to see more offensive power then defensive power. A BH should be very deadly on the first strike. The disadvanage in this case should be, that we are not very effectiv when the enemy is prepared and when we fight against a group.

And i would realy like to be able to track down any opponent. BH should be able to track down everyone when they give the name to the droids, so we can get missions from oder player to track some player without a mission from the mission terminal we cant kill them, so it would not be a real player bounty system. but as imp BH you could hunt down overt Rebels and vice versa.