Development Cycle Archive
Thread: Force Ranking System Feedback...
Caedet
Mon Jun 14, 2004 12:11 pm
#131
I honestly do not think the current ranking system will work. I see it being runned by large groups of friends or guilds, making it impossible for "non guild" players to make the ranks.
I think in it's place, should be a tournament system. One that requires the ones ranked (with the correct XP to move to the next level) to play against each other to move up in ranks. Something similar to Winner of Rank 1 (withxp to qualify for Rank 2)should fight against the 1st person to lose the Rank 2 tournament and so on. If you have to individulize between Light Side and Dark Side, make it so that the Light Side wins by Incap and Dark Side wins by death blow (which also loses xp).
This is just a suggestion, I just don't think the current system will work. It's a good layout, but I think you can get more use out of the enclaves (I've only seen the dark one) by using the Duel Ring for the tournament. Which will only allow the current fighters into the ring to prevent outside help.
As I said, it's just a suggestion, so please don't flame. Just add to the idea or say why you think it will work. I'm open minded, but Ijust see this as not being the way it should be.
NikkiDial
Mon Jun 14, 2004 2:02 pm
#132
Its funny reading through this and hearing people talk about how unbalancing some lopsided builds are at the moment. One the good players arent even masters most of the time. Many I hear about use this template.
Saber 4004(any saber type) Enhance 4004 Powers 4040 Defense4004 Healing4000
this build has room for more skills including less healing and more state defense or force armor in the defense trees. Speed and med and quick bolts for fast XP really make this hard to beat and the loss of the few defense doesnt really matter. Ranged cant hit you anyways so why even have the ranged tree in defense 
Other saber types only eat up your available Points with no real benifit. So in the end the dabbles will be by far the best.
Other saber types only eat up your available Points with no real benifit. So in the end the dabbles will be by far the best.If you really want to challange the system I suggest to go on the knight trials you have to have one Master in one of these skills (Saber/Defense) and one master in these skills (Healing/Powers/Enhance) This way we are force to actually make somewhat unique jedi builds, and stops people from dabbling without getting deep into any skill. Leave the dabbling to the PvEers and make the PvPers fall into a more random set of skills.
Even with this method I still see people going Master Defense Saber 4004 and master one of the other three, but atleast the other three will have masters. That wont happen under the current system And ofcourse it leaves out other templates i would like to see like Power/Enhance or Power/Healing, which the devs said should be viable.
And ofcourse it leaves out other templates i would like to see like Power/Enhance or Power/Healing, which the devs said should be viable.I know this doesnt have anything directly to do with the FRS but you need some foundation to build on.
Ofcourse other things need looked at also. Like how all jedi pools and powers where increased 10x from the old system but we still only gain 1 pool point per second. As it is now there is no reason to pick any jedi skill that relies on anything that takes huge amounts of pool from you. Like with Saber you get damage for no power and defense for no power, with low cost specials. With Power tree you get no defense and you get no free damage sources and all your specials have insane costs on them. The enhance tree has the regen abilities but no natural regen abilities to make the power lines viable. Healing trees are nice except it has no real use in the current system. Some Nice additions would be some DOTs or Bleeds to add a little damage flavor to the line to make it more flavorful. You know all professions need flavor otherwise they never become FOTM.
Heck give us the ability to be truely diverse and it will make the whole system better from the beggining.
Demigoth
Mon Jun 14, 2004 3:36 pm
#133
the only ones who can move up the FRS system are master lightsaber, master defense and some healing, i tried doing some weird stuff with my template and the force powers cant hurt people atm, choke cant kill a jedi atm, so its pretty pointless.
Cubsfan22
Mon Jun 14, 2004 4:27 pm
#134
I did the Knight trails, went and PvP'd the entire day at Theed. I must have killed every BH at least 3 times and every Dark Jedi at least once. Only died once the entire day. At the end, I am a whole 158 points of the 10,000needed for the next rank. I die once, lose 200k of XP? Where is the gain from this? How does this make getting rank feasible? Also, some of us have real lives and jobs and even families to take care of. Why should I go out and have to challenge everyone to meet my quote to prevent getting bumped down in rank? I am also in the US Navy and I have to go to sea every now and then. So I spend so much time to get to a certain rank only to go to sea and come back as low ranking loser again? Meanwhile, the jobless college drop out who lives with thier parents and powergames all day gets to hold the top spot continously???
While this game is fun and I look forward to this revamp in some sense, somethings make me want to hit that Cancel subscription button. Especially for getting penalized for having a life/career outside of SWG.
DarkWraith65
Mon Jun 14, 2004 5:27 pm
#135
Currently, the biggest problem imho is going to be camping of the starports on Yavin. Right now any covert non ranked Jedi can attack any ranked Jedi whenever they feel like it.They do so because they have nothing to lose and know they will most likely win if there are enough of them. Meaning 2 or more or one with the right skills.
With Master Saber/Defender and 0440 Enhancement as a 8th level ranked Jedi I can't beat a non ranked who is Master Saber/Defender and healing 4004. IF I had the same healing skills I could beat one non ranked Jedi because I'll be taking less damage but against multiple we don't stand a chance. More likely then not as others have said this will lead to a template and despite what people think it won't be the Master Saber/Defender 4004 Healing one. Right now with the buffs gone again the most powerful Jedi will be those that have weaken and choke. I've tested Choke against a Master Saber/Defender and healing 4004 and it's great against the unbuffed.....So pick up whatever saber type and techniques with 4/0/0/4 Healing, Master Force powers and spend the rest of your points gettingsome Defense and you rule.......
Right now there are just too many have to have skills. 0/0/4/4 or whatever saber type and 4/0/0/4 Healing are pretty much requirements if you plan on doing PvP.As is some kind of Defense. Some may argue against the healing but remember how prolific CMs are and you'll want/need the ability to cure poison.
NikkiDial
Mon Jun 14, 2004 5:57 pm
#136
Bahhh why do people argue with me
Master saber/defense is not worth it.
The 4040 powers people are adding in are twofold. One for the Area Intimidate that gets rid or 65% MORE damage and the weaken. Two is the Cone lightning you can spam to get multiple claims on multiple targets that helps you get max points for the FRS. It has NOTHING to do with killing someone only adding more depth to your own template that helps you climb the system faster. Which in the end makes you more powerful.
The healing part others mentioned is correct for the most part. 4xxx is a requirement. Wether you want the last line to be in the clear states area or in force protection or some other line is up to you. Basically the template is the best so far since it picks up the most GOOD skills without leaving yourself open for too many REAL scenerios.
So once again the best template I have seen so far is
Saber 4004 or whatever saber type - the added benifits at master arent worth two more trees.
Defense 4004 - ranged isnt worth it with saber blocks
Enhance 4004 - Meditation is only real way to get back pool and Speed line is godly
Powers X040 - Lightning cone and area intimidate along with weaken helps a TON.
Healing 400X - Healing is a neccessity and the extra line in states helps for PvP but isnt always the best if you want some PvE also.
The build is a tight one depending how you want to fight so play around with it but these lines are the most useful.
drashen
Mon Jun 14, 2004 6:24 pm
#137
I have done some battles here and there. To me it seems the xp per pvp battle(death of another player) is extremely low. At rank 1 I have been getting roughly 10-50max per, take into account if you need 20k to gain the next rank that is a whole lot of battles. I am not saying it shoul dbe cake but that seems a little bit too extreme. Just my 2 cents.
Drah'vhin
GuanYing
Mon Jun 14, 2004 7:05 pm
#138
Still hard to advance in FRS. Even for killing an enemy jedi you only get 1 rank pt, this could be because you have to be part of a gank squad to kill another jedi. But if you're not in a gank squad you can't kill another jedi... IF they somehow start to get low they have plenty of time to realize that and run away. So far every dark jedi I helped kill I was chasing them for about 2 kilometers once they started to run before they finally went down, and that was mainly because they didn't have force run to escape with.
The only time I got more than about 1 FRS pt was when I helped kill an enemy jedi that had a high sounding title, like oppressor or enforcer or something. On one of them I actually went from about -35 to about 406. But still, to get enough FRS xp to even get to rank 1 I would need to kill 25 of those master level jedi as part of a huge gank squad... There's no other way it can be done without ambushing someone when they go LD or afk without force armor up...
- Killing 25 master level jedi seems like a bit too much just to get to rank 1.
- When would you ever happen to come across that many and be able to beat them before they could escape?
- Also, how do you kill that many before your FRS pts decay away?? Not possible...
- AND, when it goes live and there's no masters around yet to kill, how do you collect enough 1 pt kills to get the 10k you need for rank 1???
- Finally, how can you kill so many higher ranked jedi without being killed yourself? All they have to do to kill your rank is ambush you with a gank squad of their own and knock you out, then they let a bounty hunter or even a non combat player give you the deathblow... then all your rank pts go down the drain! Of course, if they were smart they wouldn't do that, they'd get the highest ranked person to give the deathblow so you retain as much rank pts as possible, so that you're a more rewarding target to go after later and they can get more rank pts for killing you some other time.
Not trying to complain, just want to report legit functionality problems and observations. Hope that helps.
NikkiDial
Mon Jun 14, 2004 7:06 pm
#139
when you post your XP per fight/hour please include your current template.
GuanYing
Mon Jun 14, 2004 7:13 pm
#140
my skills were master defense, master enhancer, 4004 lightsaber.
One more thing I forgot to mention to the earlier post was that the upper ranks don't give you any new skills... so once you get to knight, thats all you can ever get. Even the council leader can't learn everything, or even any more abilities than a knight... Higher ranks just give you mods to force control, force light (or dark I imagine), and another one I can't remember... The effects of these mods are tough to determine, but one of them obviously reduced the force cost of specials, and another seemed to increase the regen rate I think. Maybe the last one was a damage mod...
Heswindu
Mon Jun 14, 2004 11:29 pm
#141
I'm a Jedi master and member of the light Jedi Council on TC2, and with the new FRS power bonuses going into effect with today's update, I've noticed very little to no change in my ability when combatting opponents. I mean I'm a Jedi Council member here, that's one rank from Jedi Chancellor which is the top of the pyramid, and I can't phase a Jedi Knight Master Defender at all. The rank powers bonuses need to be upscaled majorly, there needs to be a significant difference between ranks and the scale of their power. I just don't see the exponential bonus that was described.
oiraona
Tue Jun 15, 2004 12:06 am
#142
*chuckles*
No clue JustG. Unable to finish the trials. Force ranking and pvp is something I really wanted to test.
Oh well, back to looking.
DarkWraith65
Tue Jun 15, 2004 1:50 am
#143
Only problem with your template Nikki is a CM will jack you up with poison and disease. I'd say drop meditate and pick up the other healing tree. Mediate only really helps you after a fight not during and that's when it matters most.