Dancer Archive
Thread: New Inspiration Buffs
FuschiaD
Mon Apr 04, 2005 5:19 pm
#66
I've had some time to calm down a bit, and maybe now I will be able to better express how I feel about this.
Obviously, I feel that once again, the developers have completely ignored the cry of the masses. However, I will say that the concept of this buff is fantastic. It's not something that will help them pwn the n00bz in PvP, but instead is something that will genuinely contribute to a player's playtime. I have three gigantic concerns:
1 - the inability to control who I am buffing. I don't want anyone to be able to just come along and partake of my services without my permission. It is not possible for any other profession to do this (except for the AFK buffbots). I feel it is incredibly unfair for us to be singled out like this. If I want a gun, I have to visit a weaponsmith vendor and exchange my credits for the weapon. If I want a stat migration, I have to visit an ID and exchange my credits for their time and skill. But under this new system, if I want an inspiration buff, all I have to do is visit the nearest cantina and watch/listen to anyone in there.
2 - The fact that a novice entertainer buff is absolutely no different from a master dancer buff. I'm spending those skill points, I would like for it to mean something other than sexy moves and pretty effects. I want to be functional, and an integral part of the game. Being sexy and pretty doesn't cut it.
3 - Musicians and dancers will have absolutely no discernable difference in ability. I know many people are against the combination of the two professions (myself included), but if we are going to be doing the exact same thing as far as game mechanics go, they really might as well.
My suggestions to fix the aforementioned issues:
1 - provide a popup window, similar to the Image Designer setup, asking permission for a buff with a secure payment trade. This allows the entertainer to take control of his or her dispensing of buffs, earn a definite income, and prevents the cheapskates from scoring a free buff. This should NOT BE CIRCUMVENTABLE BY A MACRO.
2 - Lower the time or strength of the buffs - or, like the current setup, only allow novice dancers and up to dispense the buffs. Start novice dancers out at an hour's worth... move it up to 2 hours at techniques IV, and 3 hours at master.
3 - Perhaps separate what exactly each buff can do? For example, maybe dancers can enhance experience and faction, and musicians can enhance crafting ability.
These are just some ideas. I'm trying very hard to be constructive and creative, and do what I can to enhance the profession I adore.
Input is welcome.
CristineA
Mon Apr 04, 2005 5:52 pm
#67
GoGoGirl wrote:
I'm both a Master Dancer and a Master Chef, is the inspiration buff going to also affect my crafting if i dance or do i have to sit down and watch/listen others before i gain any benefits from it as well?It was discussed in the past about entertainers having the ability to mindbuff themselves, perhaps, this time around we can buff ourselves with inspiration.
Afterall, if a Master Doctor can buff themselves, whycan't Master Musicians/Dancers?
The buffing urself was something that was never suppose to be introduced, but was, but then taken away, as far as this new buffing process goes for you, you'll still have to watch/listen to others to get it.
And as far as ur last part goes, I dunno why that is, but it is.
FuschiaD
Mon Apr 04, 2005 6:00 pm
#68
There is one HUGE HUGE flaw in this plan, which someone on the Tarquinas forums brought up.
As the proposal stands now, novice entertainer skills will be exactly the same as master skills, just takes a little longer.
If that happens, why can't novice marksmen kill rancors? It should just take a little longer!
Why can't novice artisans make grand ball gowns, top notch weapons and droids? It should just take a little longer!
Why can't novice medics revive players and make advanced medicine? It should just take a little longer!
We are being unfairly targeted here and given no compensation for our time and effort. That needs to change. Talk about unbalanced.
SianGali
Mon Apr 04, 2005 6:15 pm
#69
FuschiaD wrote:
There is one HUGE HUGE flaw in this plan, which someone on the Tarquinas forums brought up.
As the proposal stands now, novice entertainer skills will be exactly the same as master skills, just takes a little longer.
If that happens, why can't novice marksmen kill rancors? It should just take a little longer!
Why can't novice artisans make grand ball gowns, top notch weapons and droids? It should just take a little longer!
Why can't novice medics revive players and make advanced medicine? It should just take a little longer!
We are being unfairly targeted here and given no compensation for our time and effort. That needs to change. Talk about unbalanced.
Whoa, thats logic devs might listen to and understand! /cheer anonymous Tarquinas poster and Fushia for sharing!
Aynianu
Mon Apr 04, 2005 6:47 pm
#70
Firstly, i think the removal of AFK needs to be done before anything. Anything we are given can be abused by AFK entertainers and continuation of loss of respect for AFK and ATK entertainers alike. Untill this is fixed, any new improvements are like throwing logs of wood on a furnace. They will be fun for a while, till you realise your looking at the same zombies around you.
Secondly the Idea of the Inspiration Buffs in themselves are good, i like them a lot. One of the forms of enhancements i feel a dancer needs. (ive allways pushed for buffs to be expanded, and crafting buff is one of the suggestions i was very keen on)
Thirdly, the implementation deffinatly needs to be in such a way that an AFK entertainer cannot use it (if AFK hasnt been fixed by this time) and the power of thebuff needs to scale up with skills, peaking at master with +25 tape.
If afk is fixed it would be nice to be aPassive systemwithout us needing to do any commands other than dance.
Fourthly, add further improvements to the cantina's themselvesaswell asthe entertainer proffessions specificly, and your well on the way to making live entertainers the fun proffession they should be.
Eaca
Mon Apr 04, 2005 7:40 pm
#71
I'll repeat here what I did in the IC thread... Thirteen pages of comments and concerns and one full work day and not one red name reply to any of them... Typical.
LyteFoot
Tue Apr 05, 2005 12:43 am
#72
The majority of people, the VAST majority will click on the first entertainer they see and let the BF heal and their buff set. Yeah every time they heal BF they will get a buff as well, nice huh? And guess who they click on the most, the entertainer closest to the exit. There are very few people who care if we give a show and only a small number of them that feel they should tip for it.
There is a real design flaw when ONE profession in a game of dozens has to hope someone will be impressed enough to tip them for a service while all the others have definite payment mechanisms. Every other support profession has a mechanism to insure payment, either by not providing the service or by having a payment interface. Only entertainers are totally free, "seamless", and non-viable as a sole profession. Even our only remaining way to stop people from simply taking our services is useless since /denyservice isn't persisted and the person has to be in range to even apply the denial setting.
There is a real design flaw when ONE profession in a game of dozens has to hope someone will be impressed enough to tip them for a service while all the others have definite payment mechanisms. Every other support profession has a mechanism to insure payment, either by not providing the service or by having a payment interface. Only entertainers are totally free, "seamless", and non-viable as a sole profession. Even our only remaining way to stop people from simply taking our services is useless since /denyservice isn't persisted and the person has to be in range to even apply the denial setting.
Ramona_Garcia
Tue Apr 05, 2005 1:20 am
#73
After reading PoetDancer's post on page 12 here
http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=in_concept&message.id=24840&page=12
I changed my view, we don't need a form of control or forced payments (A permanent denial of service list would be nice however). Rest still stands.
Petronela
Tue Apr 05, 2005 4:55 am
#74
FuschiaD wrote:
I've had some time to calm down a bit, and maybe now I will be able to better express how I feel about this.
Obviously, I feel that once again, the developers have completely ignored the cry of the masses. However, I will say that the concept of this buff is fantastic. It's not something that will help them pwn the n00bz in PvP, but instead is something that will genuinely contribute to a player's playtime. I have three gigantic concerns:
1 - the inability to control who I am buffing. I don't want anyone to be able to just come along and partake of my services without my permission. It is not possible for any other profession to do this (except for the AFK buffbots). I feel it is incredibly unfair for us to be singled out like this. If I want a gun, I have to visit a weaponsmith vendor and exchange my credits for the weapon. If I want a stat migration, I have to visit an ID and exchange my credits for their time and skill. But under this new system, if I want an inspiration buff, all I have to do is visit the nearest cantina and watch/listen to anyone in there.
2 - The fact that a novice entertainer buff is absolutely no different from a master dancer buff. I'm spending those skill points, I would like for it to mean something other than sexy moves and pretty effects. I want to be functional, and an integral part of the game. Being sexy and pretty doesn't cut it.
3 - Musicians and dancers will have absolutely no discernable difference in ability. I know many people are against the combination of the two professions (myself included), but if we are going to be doing the exact same thing as far as game mechanics go, they really might as well.
Exactly!!!
They really do need to give us a "real reason" to invest the points needed to be Masters.
And I mean more then just an esthetical reason and few minutes of difference.
As for "enforced payment" I really don't care for that idea much. I always feel uncomfortable deciding how much to charge as it is now and always just say "whatever you think is fair" because frankly I have no clue in what shape the customers finances are and what is reasonable for him/her to pay.
Tip stops being a tip when it's enforced and becomes a payment for services rendered. Well in most countries anyways 
However I DO want them to consider adding either a pop-up requesting a buff with default set on negative answer or need to /setp with option of it being used on multiple targets at once.
Regardless what reason one performs for, I do believe we have a right to know who is getting the benefit of our performance.
Plus the way the human nature works it is more likely we would actually get tipped more oftenif the customer knew we are aware of them getting the benefits. Sure, not every time, some people will still think we pay $15 a month to be there only for their use at will with no thanks required, but it would, in my opinion, give the incentiveto the "undecided" kind to actually tip rather then just "ninja" the buff.
Deli'ah
Ihareo
Tue Apr 05, 2005 5:04 am
#75
DarkY0da wrote:
Is this thread where I say I told you soo...
Anyways so now EVERYONE knows we don't buff mind. And EVERYONE knows that the Inspiraction Buff will be put in "post" CU at some un-named future point.
And from reading some of Panthu's posts I've come to clearly understand what the Devs intentions are for us. And I need to either except that and then try and make suggestions that are easy for them to do and go along with it. Or it's time to quit the entertainer Professions.
And with that understanding I now give feedback on the future Inspiration Buffs...
It's great. It leaves us exactly how they intended to leave us. Maybe we could get it expanded slightly into other areas of the game... 10% Boost to Rangers group effect for gather meat,bones,hides... 10% Boost to some SL abilities that affect a group ect.(notice they all are group centered...)
Downside, Novice Ent same as Master Dancer just takes a little longer, AFK grinding Jedi will be very useful to players in outposts, Bots will drop their SP down some and pick up other useful skills for an alt to have and will still be run 24/7.
Iffy
It leaves us very close to where we are currently. The people that say they NEED Mind buffs and are out grinding away... Will now NEED XP buffs to help speed up their grind. It places us once again as a pre-combat use which was part of the huge resentment among players. And doesn't tend to lend its self well to a social enviroment and gameplay. As a Pre-combat requirement they will want all the same traits they love about their bots. Easy to find. Same place 24/7, get in and out quickly so they can get to "their" gameplay.
BIG HUGE UPSIDE:
Which sort of goes against my Iffy thoughts...
But with the changes in the CU to make grouping wanted/needed and to be the focus of playing... They need someplace where it can be easy to find a group. Some place EVERYONE will go before they head out to play..
Yes that's right THE CANTINA!!!!!
The XP buff means that everyone will come to get buffed. And what better place to hang out for a bit and find a group ?
Crafters will show up now... are you looking for a certain Item hang out until you see a crafter come on through and make the connection with them.
If it does this... This is what I have honestly really been missing from our gameplay. And if it does this... it will be great.
Message Edited by DarkY0da on 04-04-2005 06:00 PM
But we still buff. AND we still heal BF. So I told you so!! 
Besides, if we don't buff mind, it don't buffin' matter!
FuschiaD
Tue Apr 05, 2005 6:19 am
#76
Del'iah, you should check out Coreena's post in Panthu's Inspiration buff thread. She had an idea - once a person starts watching/listening to you, you would then get a radial option on them to 'apply enhancement'. MUCH better than a popup, doesn't demand payment, but still gives you control. I love the idea.
Petronela
Tue Apr 05, 2005 6:32 am
#77
Thank you for pointing it out to me, yes it is the best idea I have seen so far 
Deli'ah
Sutarion
Tue Apr 05, 2005 6:34 am
#78
I wonder how unbalancing it would be to have various levels of buffs. Here might be an interestingproposal.
- Novice Entertainer - 5% Ability and Exp Increase
- MasterEntertainer / Novice Musician / Novice Dancer - 10% Ability and Exp Increase
- MasterDancer / Master Musician - 15% Ability and Exp Increase
Various skills would help increase this up to each box's max. This means:
- Entertainer Healing I - 6%
- Entertainer HealingII- 7%
- Entertainer Healing III - 8%
- Entertainer Healing IV - 9%
Leading up to the Novice elite classes, which yield 10%. Same would be applied to the Dancer and Musician classes with the techniques skill line.
Thoughts?