Dancer Archive
Thread: Okay folks, feedback time for you all on this list here.
Luckily Player Cities should be live next week, but unfortuneatly it will be a least four weeks after that before we can start to judge if their having a big enough effect to be helpful or not. I will say that with Player Cities around I can't see any reason you should have to dance near AFK people, that alone should be a big plus. I just hope it turns out to be the case.. although I will say even if that is the case it doesnt mean more measures won't be taken to stop AFK tainers.
Sinda wrote:
but maybe the chicken that is Player Cities will actually hatch some day so it can be counted for real.
Excellent points made Ravenmist on the AFK issue... i'm actually in the process of establishing a player city with my entertainer's PA on Lowca, and look forward to what the future may bring with it... although i believe it will take a few months before much of what you've spoken of will stabilize the SWG community.
The problem with the AFK issue is having two sides *passionately* opinionated "for" or "against."
The only real way to solve the issue is to create a very real benefit to not being AFK, without nerfing the positive benefits of macros ( i personally used macros so that i could keep up with the conversations lol, and be well, entertaining! ). Yet i strongly believe that any"fix" will again upset one or the other opposing opinions about the issue.
For me, i'm proud of the fact that on Lowca, i was the second player to reach Master Dancer ( 2 wks, 12-16 hours/day, non-stop dancing ) and i didn't once AFK to achieve that. For that reason alone, i refuse to give up dancer to pursue jedi ( another issue entirely but why should i have to give up what i *love* to do to open up the FS slot?? ).
Within my PA, i certainly don't encourage AFK'ing, but niether would i punish my members from doing it... what i did wasn't easy, considering harrassment on top of it... i'm not even sure i would want to do it again.
i believe the *real* fix for AFK'ing ( the desire to progress effortlessly ) lies in SOE providing real content/purpose to "passive" professions like entertainment and artisan. AFK'ing is more of a symptom than the real issue. If i could go out onto a battlefield and "cheerlead" another player who is fighting the baddies and get LEET dance experience for it... woo, i'm there! ( imagine getting 1000 xp plus for being part of a battlegroup without shooting a single shot ). But would they do it?? Unfortunately, this profession continually gets pushed into its current role ( street corner entertainer begging for quarters ).
What i don't see is a clear cut solution to stop AFK'ing without severely hampering useful macro tools that can enhance our ability to entertain. Other than somehow checking for player keystrokes on their keyboard, there's no way to stop it.
If you want to give entertainers bonus xp for being /watched /listened to... that would actually make sense, especially if it was worthwhile experience ( 25% bonus/hit maybe? ). Then at least those of us who don't AFK have the opportunity to gain something from getting somebody's attention ( ohhh and forces us to beg for quarters harder too! i mean, gives us the opportunity to be entertaining and profit from it ).
As far as the list goes... these things are a heck of a lot more important to me than somebody else AFK'ing to master. i'd rather be all that i can be now that i'm a Master Dancer/Entertainer PA leader... i want to enjoy the fruits of my labor and put on a dance show that actually looks good... i want to be considered as important to a hunting group as a Master Doctor... and i *really* want a decent pair of shoes to wear while i dance 
melody 
For some reason, AFK Macrotainers get most of the bad press, but the unattended macro issue is a much larger issue involving many other professions.
Its ubiquity is one of the reasons that I am pessimistic about the chances that the developers are actually going to meaningfully address the issue.
Player cities might be a bandaid on the problem.
1. Falling down.
Yes please fix this for master dancers only I would think.
2. Mind-buffing self.
If docs can buff themselves we should be able to buff ourselves
3. Fix Entertainer Missions.
Yes i would think so, 100c a mission sucks for those newbies
4. Fix the lyrical/formal base dance.
that would be nice
5. Make changes to mind buffing system to make things easier. Some way to tell when mind buff is fully applied. Perhaps a message to let you know when another dancer has already used /setperform on someone you try to buff. Make it only require /setperform and a new command /setperformdone instead of /watch and /stopwatch, so that we can make sure that it's given properly. Take guesswork out.
I would LOVE this
AFK Entertainers. (out of the top 5 because I think with Player run Cantina's this problem should lessen on its own. What you all think?)
New flourishes, full 8 for every dance. (good ones only please)
I think a few extra dances for exotic and lyrical would be nice, doesn't have to be a full 8 but atleast 2 -3 more but 8 would be nice to.
Group commands for dancers that allow /groupstartdance, /groupchangedance, /groupstopdance and perhaps even /groupdistract 1 etc... also Synchdance?
I really don't know, always made me mad when someone would do the group flourish thing, it seemed to mess up my exp as in i stopped getting any till i relogged which was annoying. Tho does look cool to see 3 dancers doing the same thing. I guess
Fix buff not resetting on death along with all the other buff bugs.
Fix all the small cantinas which don't let people register (Dathomir, Dantooine, etc.
The ability to register at outposts, HQ, adventure planets ,non traditional cantinas. Maybe some visual aid to see someone is inside the cantina without having to look at the map? (could have a light/lamp on front door that turns on or off)
System message - A notice of who is /watching you and perhaps a /listwatch command.
Technique abilities (effects) are just eye candy but should add something (perhaps XP bonus)/ reduced action cost
I don't think it needs exp but reduced action I dunno maybe.
Fix the "playing music getting dance xp" exploit! (does this still exist?)
I heard it does
A "mirror" ability that allows a dancer to chose the mirror opposite of a flourish. (mirror should be a toggle)
Fix the body part bleed through on our clothes.
Captivator is still misspelled as Captivater
Faction points for Dancing while overt and healing other overts? (small amount of faction, definitely make it slower then running missions by a lot but still something.)
This would rock.
Collision detection. Some items you can walk through, others you can't. Make more of them so you can't go through them so dancers don't end up standing in the middle of tables. Also possibly make it so colliding with another player makes them stop dancing?
Yea that would be nice
Make the XP earned based only on the level of the dancers experience, not on the dance itself. If a high level dancer uses basic they should get the same XP as if they used exotic.
No! People should have to do Footloose and that robot dance just like i did if they want the same exp for that level of dance. I hated those dances but i think you should be made to do them if you want the exp for your level. In life you have to do things you don't want to. Footloose should be one of them.
A few reasonable (non bard like) field abilities? Ability to distract mobs? Npcs? (short stun, confusion, draw attention/aggro?) (hey, it makes sense I think) Perhaps a resistance to B.F.?
That would be cool.
I did see this turn into a big AFK flame i didn't even bother reading most of the responses. I never afked longer then it took to get a drink or go use the restroom, I think Afkers are annoying, on other players i have i never watch them nor tip them. Afk is in many professions i have seen marksmen pistoleers (sp) Creature handlers all afk in some newbie area doing their thing, it's retarded, but how can you fix it? Hope the answer falls in your laps one day Devs.
Luciee_Depri wrote:
With the announced cap on the number of cities allowed per server, I'm even less optimistic (make that more pessimistic) that player cities will resolve the AFK issue. With only ten player cities on the starter planets,
It will only be a minimum of 10 until they get their database changed over which shouldn't be that long from now I don't think. Also, 10 player cities per main planet to choose from, I'm willing to bet at least one of those is going to be trying to get good live performers to be there and won't be catering to AFKers.. and like you said.. 25 cities on non main planets for time being.. and of course those numbers will grow once DB issues are solved. With that many player run cities out there it should be no problem to find at least one good place to perform, and could probably find several.
Also to the other poster that doesn't like bandflourishes and wasn't sure about adding the new group commands. You are aware you can turn all that stuff off right? Theres no reason you have to be bothered by it unless you just leave it on.
I understand your point there Sultrina hon, but sounds like most dancers would prefer not to have to deal with worrying about it so much and focus more on their performance. The best dancers can probably do both with ease, but not everyone is that good or has the ability to be that good and we have to look out for them too.
Sultrina wrote:
Eeeeeeeek Ravenmist Drifting isn't an isue its a chalange. If our dancers did everythign for us the fun would be gone! Plseas don't list Drifting as an isue it's easy to stop for those willign to be at their keyboard and practice
Perhapsa reduction is drift but not eliminate it entirely.Thats pretty much what I was thinking.
Ogress1 wrote:
I understand your point there Sultrina hon, but sounds like most dancers would prefer not to have to deal with worrying about it so much and focus more on their performance. The best dancers can probably do both with ease, but not everyone is that good or has the ability to be that good and we have to look out for them too.
Sultrina wrote:
Eeeeeeeek Ravenmist Drifting isn't an isue its a chalange. If our dancers did everythign for us the fun would be gone! Plseas don't list Drifting as an isue it's easy to stop for those willign to be at their keyboard and practice
Nynna wrote:
I like the list. But if the entertainer missions are already looked at and will be fixed by the devs, I don't see a point in having that on the list. Replace it with AFK entertainers.
They (the AFKers) and their situation is being looked at by the devs too as they've already said and are planning to do something about it. So I guess by your logic I should remove them from the list too? Maybe I should take both off and move something else up?
I can no longer hold my tongue on the AFK 'issue'
I have a main character that I play on chilastra, she has NO xp left to master dancing so I created a new character on another server so I could master some other professions (dancing/TKA) and not have to change my main character. (nothing to do with holocron)
Idance afk because if I didn't, there is no way I'd ever get to Master Dancer without it. I also afk dance in Keren overnight and have had tips there from players who needed healing in the small dead cantina.
I think the issue is not so much AFK dancing as it is grouping to gain healingXP. If I could gain the needed healing xp without having to join a large group or afk dance, then I'd do it. But as it stands now, I cannot gain healing xp in any large amounts without afk dancing for litterally HOURS on end.
As it is now, I only have one box in each filled atm and it's going to take forever to get the needed healing xp to reach master. I don't see anything wrong with afk dancing unless the 'leader' of a large group is afk. So again this points to the 'grouping' and healing xp feature that needs fixing not the afk dancers themselves.
/shrug Heal exp was never a problem for me. I'm still not capped (I rarely dance anymore, far too many zombies and I don't feel any particular need to punish myself by sitting in a deserted closet on Dathomir hoping that maybe 1 person will come in every hour). I notice that I get a steady amount of healing exp when I do dance in Coronet, solo. I greet almost every person that comes in by name and chat them up a bit (no, I don't flirt either). Maybe you should try NOT afk'ing for healing exp--the general trend on my server as of late has been that people will choose to watch the entertainers that are, well, somewhat entertaining. Watching an AFK person (I'm not calling them AFK entertainers anymore because that's an oxymoron) is about as engaging as watching paint dry so given the choice, many watch the non-zombie.
Maybe if you stay off of the Acid Fermented Kreetlejuice you'd notice a difference. Also, since decay was added it seems that heal exp has dropped off in general--sounds like people are going to have to put some effort into it instead of using autopilot.