Dancer Archive
Thread: Is this it?
SFXGenesis
Fri Mar 11, 2005 4:34 pm
#53
I have every intention of enjoying what is finally some much needed attention to our professions. Considering I do buff a lot, the drop of timers between switching performance types will mean a lot to me and my clientele. The fixes to the existing dances and the addition of others makes me very happy as well, and I will enjoy those also. However...you'll have to forgive me if someone mentioning "reasons to be worried" and "NDA" in the same sentence make me a bit upset...either partially or entirely negating any hope I myself have for our future in this game.
Danny
FuschiaD
Fri Mar 11, 2005 4:40 pm
#54
*tackles Pappi and plants one on her*
I had to, because I so totally agree with your posts. Guys, listen... this is NOT 'the big entertainer revamp'. This is some new stuff for us to play with, and also some MUCH needed fixes. Do we need more? ABSOLUTELY. Are any of us going to be satisfied with just this? NO! Do the devs expect us to be? NO! THIS. IS. A. PATCH. They've put SO much effort in the last few weeks into their updates... they've fixed a LOT of things that haveneeded to be fixed for a long time. This was just our slice of the bug-fixin' pie.
I'm one of these subjected to the NDA (much to most people's shock, since I don't generally make my presence known as a CURB alpha tester) and this patch does NOT fill me with terror. It makes me happy... why? Simple: if they were planning to completely ignore our profession, they wouldn't even have bothered with THIS much.
Now, play nice everyone, or I'll make Deila get out her nerf bat. 
*licks everyone and vanishes back into the game*
TheSillyOne
Fri Mar 11, 2005 5:04 pm
#55
I dunno guys I think this is pretty friggin major. Fixing the base dances on lyrical, formal and theatrical basically opens up 3 old dances for actual performance then we get 2 new dances that they are just gonna give us (no questing for it). We won't fall down anymore (super duper yay). These are things we've been asking for since forever.The new dances may even have 8 full flourishes each. I would imagine that a significant amount of effort went into fixing this stuff. I mean it's been broken for a year and a half. I have to imagine it wasn't an easy fix. Lets also not forget we've recently had the ability to buff music and dance at the same time restored , buff times reduced to 1 minute making us a much more useful tool in a group.
These were our top issues. Back when they asked us what we wanted this is exactly what we told them. We got exactly what we wanted. Whomever made th analagy about children who don't get enough presents at christmas was dead on.
Message Edited by TheSillyOne on 03-11-2005 05:08 PM
Warryyr
Fri Mar 11, 2005 5:18 pm
#56
Pappi wrote:
you know we're all not happy about the buffbot stuff... but you also know that you shouldn't let it prevent you from enjoying new stuff, and that this isn't the thread for buffbots. don't give them that power over you...
You're absolutely right.
/snog Pappi
Warryyr
Fri Mar 11, 2005 5:27 pm
#57
FuschiaD wrote:
*tackles Pappi and plants one on her*
I had to, because I so totally agree with your posts. Guys, listen... this is NOT 'the big entertainer revamp'. This is some new stuff for us to play with, and also some MUCH needed fixes. Do we need more? ABSOLUTELY. Are any of us going to be satisfied with just this? NO! Do the devs expect us to be? NO! THIS. IS. A. PATCH. They've put SO much effort in the last few weeks into their updates... they've fixed a LOT of things that haveneeded to be fixed for a long time. This was just our slice of the bug-fixin' pie.
I'm one of these subjected to the NDA (much to most people's shock, since I don't generally make my presence known as a CURB alpha tester) and this patch does NOT fill me with terror. It makes me happy... why? Simple: if they were planning to completely ignore our profession, they wouldn't even have bothered with THIS much.
Now, play nice everyone, or I'll make Deila get out her nerf bat.
*licks everyone and vanishes back into the game*
It would be great to have everything better in one handy publish, and TOMORROW.
I think this is just some stuff that we should've gotten awhile ago, and we're finally getting some issues resolved. I, for one, will be glad to see some dances looking normal again.
And I think there should be a push for a /fall emote for Dancers - to do when they please 
Someone said a /flo 9...kind of handy.
Warryyr
Fri Mar 11, 2005 5:32 pm
#58
And, yeah - this isn't the Revamp.
I'm pretty much positive that when that comes around, this game is going to be AWESOME for us.
It's just not coming as fast as I'd like, but what else is new.
But it's on the way, I mean...as a coder, I don't tend to get into code to change/fix up a few things without needing to become familiar enough with it to have a bigger effort directed towards it. I think this is just the beginning of what some folks have been working on for awhile. This is just what finally got ready to put on TC and then on Live.
We have a lot more coming our way...
PoetDancer
Fri Mar 11, 2005 5:42 pm
#59
I can understand where we might be annoyed at the falls. However, it is my opinion that the falls actually helped ATK entertainers.
As silly as it may sound, an unattendee cannot react to a fall. We can, even if it was just saying "ouch," "oops," or Kirah's favorite, "drat."
Falls may look horrible to us, but I have found that falls also can be seen as cute, or conversation starters in the cantina.
I'll miss the falls more than most, perhaps because the cantina will have lost some spontinaety. However, I'd imagine we'd see a lot less dancers wielding heavy armarment in the cantinas.
Kealles
Fri Mar 11, 2005 6:02 pm
#60
Wow, attention. Definitely some great steps in the right direction, but I don't think it's worthy of being called the EU. It's mostly just fixing things.
Can't wait to see and hear the new dances and songs!
SpaceCrazy
Fri Mar 11, 2005 6:23 pm
#61
Reposted from the musician thread about the changes:
I posted my feed back in the In Dev thread. Some nice fixes/changes coming. And now for a rant...
I am rather disgusted by certain members of our community right now. We get some nice changes, some GREAT bug fixes, a couple new songs/dances (which had BETTER not have an XP cost), and instead of acknowledging it, people are saying "Is that it? That's nothing". All because the big issue was not addressed.
Did you really expect the removal of AFK was going to be our announcement? I had no such delusions. Why? Because it's not JUST an Entertainer issue. AFK problems extend to a whole lot more professions. It will not be easy for the devs to remove AFK for all profs without breaking something else or rendering macros useless. They made a small step recently to fight AFK by stopping combat players from attacking with the AFK tag up. That's just step one, one easily countered, but a step in the right direction nonetheless.
Were you expecting the announcement to be that the Enterainer Revamp is ready for discussion, or coding or going to TC? Again, if so, you were deluding yourselves. It's been the position of the Devs for a long time that it would be the Combat Upgrade, then non-combat revamps. As down on the general way things have gone (or not gone) in recent months, I'm still holding the Devs to it.
Just as I'm holding them to removing AFK, especially the buff bots we all know and loathe. Of course we want them gone yesterday, but the primary focus of the devs is the Combat Upgrade and the new expansion. But to rip the devs for giving us some attention, on long overdue fixes, just because it wasn't what you wanted really ticks me off, quite frankly. We get some dev time and it's met by complaining because it wasn't all you wanted it to be. It's not the Revamp...it's not SUPPOSED to be *poof* Enterainer all fixed.
A BETTER way to have gone about it would be to so them a bit of appreciation for the fixes and changes. THEN go back to riding the devs behind's to get rid of the damned AFK problem we have. What I saw in the In Dev thread brought to mind ungrateful children because they didn't get everything they wanted for children.
I for one will enjoy the new dances (I hope they look good), the new music (I hope they sound good), becoming a master of every entertainer profession and not having to deal with that *!@# 15 second delay. And while I'm enjoying those, I'll be back to pester the devs to get rid of AFK.
I posted my feed back in the In Dev thread. Some nice fixes/changes coming. And now for a rant...
I am rather disgusted by certain members of our community right now. We get some nice changes, some GREAT bug fixes, a couple new songs/dances (which had BETTER not have an XP cost), and instead of acknowledging it, people are saying "Is that it? That's nothing". All because the big issue was not addressed.
Did you really expect the removal of AFK was going to be our announcement? I had no such delusions. Why? Because it's not JUST an Entertainer issue. AFK problems extend to a whole lot more professions. It will not be easy for the devs to remove AFK for all profs without breaking something else or rendering macros useless. They made a small step recently to fight AFK by stopping combat players from attacking with the AFK tag up. That's just step one, one easily countered, but a step in the right direction nonetheless.
Were you expecting the announcement to be that the Enterainer Revamp is ready for discussion, or coding or going to TC? Again, if so, you were deluding yourselves. It's been the position of the Devs for a long time that it would be the Combat Upgrade, then non-combat revamps. As down on the general way things have gone (or not gone) in recent months, I'm still holding the Devs to it.
Just as I'm holding them to removing AFK, especially the buff bots we all know and loathe. Of course we want them gone yesterday, but the primary focus of the devs is the Combat Upgrade and the new expansion. But to rip the devs for giving us some attention, on long overdue fixes, just because it wasn't what you wanted really ticks me off, quite frankly. We get some dev time and it's met by complaining because it wasn't all you wanted it to be. It's not the Revamp...it's not SUPPOSED to be *poof* Enterainer all fixed.
A BETTER way to have gone about it would be to so them a bit of appreciation for the fixes and changes. THEN go back to riding the devs behind's to get rid of the damned AFK problem we have. What I saw in the In Dev thread brought to mind ungrateful children because they didn't get everything they wanted for children.
I for one will enjoy the new dances (I hope they look good), the new music (I hope they sound good), becoming a master of every entertainer profession and not having to deal with that *!@# 15 second delay. And while I'm enjoying those, I'll be back to pester the devs to get rid of AFK.
PoetDancer
Fri Mar 11, 2005 6:29 pm
#62
Now, what do these changes mean?
To me, it means that the developers are doing something for us, and not the buffbot owners.
Buffbot owners don't care about the development of this class, or the fixing of animations. To them, the class is working satisfactorally, and they'd much rather have the developers work on "important things" like PvP balance or looting.
Because you have to understand, buffbot owners don't want developer time wasted on fixing broken dances, because to them, they aren't broken. As long as they heal BF, buff the mind, and heal the mind, they are operating "correctly."
And you also have to understand that motion capture and track recording are time and resource intensive measures. Buffbot owners don't care about new dances. As long as the old dances can still heal the mind, buff the mind, and heal BF, they feel the class doesn't need it.
So you see, this is a very, very big move. They didn't have to do these things, and ironically, by doing these things for us, they actually are going against the wishes of the majority of dancer account holders. But if you consider that the majority of dancer account holders are career unattendees, and want developer time devoted to anything but dancer animation bug fixes, then you'd have to say the developers went out on a limb.
All in all, a sign that the developers are willing to do what is in our interest, rather than brush our concerns aside for the sake of the majority.
Drygo
Fri Mar 11, 2005 6:50 pm
#63
GAH! I hate when posting screws up...here we go again.
First, trust me when I say, I will never be complacent about buffbots, and I will never be happy with dancing until buffbots wink out of existence. I will never stop complaining about that.
Having said that, WOW! I love this patch, everything about it. So many great things. And, yah, when the devs deserve a lashing, I'm not afraid to give it to them. But, when they do something as awesome as this, they deserve nothing but my praise and thanks! We've really gotten a decent amount of stuff over the past few months, more than we've ever had before, and I can't help but have renewed hope that they're listening to us and really want these professions to survive. These are many of our top issues, people! This is not a first small step, this is a HUGE step. Bravo! <3 devs.
And just to reiterate, my ranting about buffbots is far from over. 
Schardour
Fri Mar 11, 2005 6:54 pm
#64
PoetDancer wrote:
And you also have to understand that motion capture and track recording are time and resource intensive measures.
Actually, I was under the impression that they've had several dances in their files for quite some time that simply have not been fully developed/coded/pushed to live. I was also under the impression that these may have been a part of the Hutt Casino concept, which, of course, isn't going to be finished anytime in the coming years. Other than the fixing of the base dances (which I think probably took a bit of recoding), I'm a little curious as to how much time they actually invested in the rest of those 'changes.' All but one seems like it would have been fairly simple to change. (Leave the fall coding in, but change a variable to make it null. Make thepre-existing"new"dance code available. Simple change in SP calculations...)
All but one seems like it would have been fairly simple to change. (Leave the fall coding in, but change a variable to make it null. Make thepre-existing"new"dance code available. Simple change in SP calculations...)Deila, what's being discussed that's not being announced? Have most of those discussions and proposals fallen through? I wouldn't have expected those small changes to have taken so long....and you certainly couldn't have discussed the 'bug fix,' unless you were helping their programmers fix it.
Upia
Fri Mar 11, 2005 7:22 pm
#65
My disappointement worn off.. I started seeing it as a patch, not a big annoucement..
and yay!!
We are getting our fixes
I might even master entertainer to get formal2 now