Dancer Archive
Thread: Is this it?
ChaoKuang
Fri Mar 11, 2005 2:04 pm
#27
We have enough negativity already. Give it a bloody rest. You post negativity in the announcement, you post it everywhere you can. We get it, enough, you're bitter. Fine. Let people enjoy it, because unlike you, there are people who are happy and ecstatic about this. It's a bit step in the right direction. It may not be a leap and a bound, but it's a step. Dances are being fixed and added.
Lighten up already. If everytime we get something new we turn around and spit in their faces, push it to the floor and kick dirt on it, and just greet it with with the negativity you seem to like so much to eminate, it's more likely for them to just stop, give up, and either ignore this completely, give it even more, worse, half-assed updates, or take it along the line of Politician...no skillpoint cost whatsoever.
Be gracious, quit the bitterness deal already. This isn't how an entertainer or socialist is supposed to act. Christ. It's sickening, really.
Eaca
Fri Mar 11, 2005 2:08 pm
#28
Yes, lets all be happy and smileyfaced 
Yeah, that way the devs say "Oh look, the entertainers are happy, these changes are good, we won't have to worry about them for a long long long time, because look how happy they are" Yay, we get new dances Yay, we get a few bugs fixed from beta Yay, they admit ID isn't worth the SP cost so they're lowering it What you fail to realize is all this candy does NOTHING to fix the problems that are KILLING our profession.
Yeah, that way the devs say "Oh look, the entertainers are happy, these changes are good, we won't have to worry about them for a long long long time, because look how happy they are" Yay, we get new dances Yay, we get a few bugs fixed from beta Yay, they admit ID isn't worth the SP cost so they're lowering it What you fail to realize is all this candy does NOTHING to fix the problems that are KILLING our profession.
Lynnaea
Fri Mar 11, 2005 2:21 pm
#29
ChaoKuang wrote:
Those problems are in the works. They're already working on recursive macros, and those just don't deal with the entertainers, the macros deal with every profession in the game. Granted,you can't AFK-macro crafting without an illegal program, but as of now you can AFK macro dance and combat and music. They're working on it. It won't be overnight.
We have enough negativity already. If you hate it so damn much, why the hell are you even still here then? Why don't you just leave? The entertainers, the boards, everything, are already filled with leaving and quitting posts and a great deal of negativity, the boards really don't need more of it, especially when we're getting a good deal of what we've been asking for--new dances, fixes to the broken dances, new songs, and the lack of falls.
As for the ID profession, not every profession should have the same number of skillpoints. An entertainer SHOULD be able to master all the Entertainer-related professions. Why not? It's not unbalanced in the least. We have no combat ability whatsoever. Our crafting ability isn't anywhere near huge for musicians. And IDs change appearence and migrate stats, why shouldn't they be able to be Master Dancer and Master Musician as well?
We are NEVER, NEVER going to get every fix we want at once. That's unrealistic and naive to even believe we will. The fixes and addititives have to come over time, they HAVE to. And if we meet EVERY SINGLE ONE with negativity, asking for the other ones that aren't there, instead of thanking them for what we're getting, what's the point? People need to grow up and take this like adults. It needs to be appreciated instead of mouthed down at. Yes, it might take ages. But at least we know it's coming. It took almost two years, but we got new dances and fixes to old ones, and falls were removed. How do we know they haven't needed the time to get it right when they did it? You're not in their heads or on their drawing board. They have a new team just for the non-combat, so fixes might even come faster now. But we got to stop with the whining already. We see the fixes and attention are coming. We just have to have more patience and wait.
/stand
/applaud
rayill
Fri Mar 11, 2005 2:23 pm
#30
I honestly have to ask.. if we aren't supposed to be excited over this little bit of news.. are we all supposed to be outraged that this is all?
I'm really at a loss here. I understand that certain people are privvy to more information and are under NDA for discussing anything. Well, if things are as bad as you are hinting at, then I ask you, what should we do? Should we just sink back into apathy as all is lost? Should we be outraged over being given anything?
I believe that AFK is killing this profession, but I also believe the fact that they did not eliminate it BEFORE JTL launched, that taking it out now will not help our profession much. JTL was supposed to breathe life into this game before they fixed combat. Well, they didn't do anything to repair the gaping wound in our professions before JTL. Removing AFK/Bots may eliminate that problem, but there is alot that will still take a long time to repair, some of which is beyond the control of the Developers. We may blame them for allowing the problem to persist for so long, but we're going to be the ones that have to repair it. It's not fair, but rarely will things ever truly be fair.
I'm not trying to flame anyone. You can one star me if you want. I just want you to answer the questions. How should we feel about this? What should we be doing?
Schardour
Fri Mar 11, 2005 2:25 pm
#31
ChaoKuang wrote:
They're already working on recursive macros, and those just don't deal with the entertainers, the macros deal with every profession in the game.
They don't want to piss off the plethora of unattended buffbots popping up on every server, so I can guarantee those changes won't go into effect until they find a way to nicely discourage people from botting. Hmm, when will they no longer need their buffbots? /ponder.....
Eaca
Fri Mar 11, 2005 2:27 pm
#32
These changes are good. They shoud NOT be applauded as "fixing" us in any way however. We should thank them for the few pieces of candy they threw us, but not stop demanding they fix our real issue. More than enough people are applauding these changes. I won't be one of them however. We should not take this and sit back and not press on what the real issue is because they gave us this fluff. We spend just as many skill points, actually moreso, than any other profession out there. Our points should count for just as much as thiers, not only be valuable if we're running an AFK spam macro.
ChaoKuang
Fri Mar 11, 2005 2:32 pm
#33
Buffbots are a problem, yes. And as they drive entertainers out of both cantinas and the game, they become, unfortunately, more necessary because there aren't Masters readily available to apply a buff, or willing to do so. I believe SOETyrant when he says they're working to get rid of the recursive macros and AFK botting. I don't think, however, it'll come overnight. They took babystep 1 with the removal of the ability to initiate combat while AFK. Unfortunately, that just drives people to disable the Auto-AFK, but they're working on it. We need patience and perseverance. Not negativity and a call to tears and hate.
I'm waiting on the combat upgrade, where buffs are supposedly getting downgraded. Once food becomes better, the buffbots might vanish. Or if the buffs get worse, they might vanish. Personally, I dance to dance and heal, not buff. I'm currently not high enough to buff, but when I did, I gave them, and people still asked me for them, even if a buffbot was around. On my combat character, I personally use brandy and canape, among others to get my mind on par with buffs.
Pappi
Fri Mar 11, 2005 2:36 pm
#34
guys... be happy! it's new content and bug fixes... politicians would give an arm and a leg for those 
I'm as concerned about entertainers as anyone else in here, but I also know I can't expect them to fix entertainers in one patch (Rome wasn't build in a day, etc..) for one I'm glad we're getting something, since that's a WHOLE LOT better than getting nothing 
being negative won't get us anywhere... it'll just make us look like whiners. your correspondents are hard at work to fight for you guys, do you want to negate their effort with your attitudes?
I'm as concerned about entertainers as anyone else in here, but I also know I can't expect them to fix entertainers in one patch (Rome wasn't build in a day, etc..) for one I'm glad we're getting something, since that's a WHOLE LOT better than getting nothing being negative won't get us anywhere... it'll just make us look like whiners. your correspondents are hard at work to fight for you guys, do you want to negate their effort with your attitudes?
Akaara
Fri Mar 11, 2005 2:36 pm
#35
Eaca wrote:
These changes are good. They shoud NOT be applauded as "fixing" us in any way however. We should thank them for the few pieces of candy they threw us, but not stop demanding they fix our real issue. More than enough people are applauding these changes. I won't be one of them however. We should not take this and sit back and not press on what the real issue is because they gave us this fluff. We spend just as many skill points, actually moreso, than any other profession out there. Our points should count for just as much as thiers, not only be valuable if we're running an AFK spam macro.
They never claimed this to be a 'fix'
It is added FUN.
ChaoKuang
Fri Mar 11, 2005 2:39 pm
#36
Pappi wrote:
guys... be happy! it's new content and bug fixes... politicians would give an arm and a leg for those
being negative won't get us anywhere... it'll just make us look like whiners. your correspondents are hard at work to fight for you guys, do you want to negate their effort with your attitudes?
THANK YOU, Pappi! Exactly what I've been trying to say.
Ikewe
Fri Mar 11, 2005 2:39 pm
#37
ChaoKuang wrote:
Those problems are in the works. They're already working on recursive macros,
The problem is that I don't know that they are still in the works. I've not heard one word to indicate that is still the case. Believe me I want to be happy about this profession. I have stayed with it through all the pain because I could see the potential for it. But given the numbers on my server it's getting harder and harder to do that. I'll accept that these things take time. I'll accept that we won't get all of our issues addressed in one sweeping fix. But I need Tiggs to say "we are still working to remove AFKtainers." Just that. No promise of a date. No details on how it will be done. I just need that little phrase so I can have the hope for the future that you have. I don't think that's asking too much. It has been the top issue for as long as I can remember and it becomes more and more urgent every day. Would it really be so hard for them to tell us the problem is still being addressed? One simple post would make such a huge difference for so many. I know you are tired of the "negativity". Believe me those of us who are unhappy are probably even more tired of it than you can ever be. But telling fellow entertainers to "just leave" accomplishes what exactly? Let's at least try to support each other rather than work to make our numbers dwindle even further.
cheers,
Ikewe
ChiiTWINS
Fri Mar 11, 2005 2:40 pm
#38
Lets see. These appear to be the options...
1. The devs give us nothing while (hopefully) they work on big, magical, wonderous changes. This results in endless moaning and complaining, because we get nothing.
2. The devs give us little things that we ASK FOR while (hopefully) they work on big, magical, wonderous changes. This results in endless moaning and complaining, because we're supposedly not getting what we deserve.
3. The devs give us little things, over and over, while they work on nothing big, magical, and wonderous. This results in endless moaning and complaining, because we're only getting little driblets, not the big, magical, wonderous change we deserve.
Is anyone else seeing a pattern?
Frankly, I'd rather have SOMETHING. No falling? Sweet! Fixing my broken dances? Sweet! Triple mastery? Sweet! ID timer changes? Well, I'm not an ID, but Sweet for them, too! New dances? SWEET!!
Keep up the good moaning and complaining, my pessimistic friends. That'll encourage the devs, all right.
(By the way, at this point, your line is "If we don't complain, we don't get anywhere." See, I said it for you, so you don't have to -- that's how used to hearing it we are by now. Cheers!)
Cheers!)
Sunjammer
Fri Mar 11, 2005 2:48 pm
#39
Eaca wrote:
Yes, lets all be happy and smileyfaced
We don't want them to think that, but neither do we want them to think, "nothing we do makes these people happy, so why bother doing anything at all?" These things may not be a fix by themselves, but they are good additions and changes. At least two of them have been Top Five issues of ours since the Ice Age. If they're greeted with nothing but B&M, that's hardly going to encourage the devs to keep working on our #1.
J.
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