Dancer Archive
Thread: City Professions: Entertainer, Pol, Merchant
Warryyr
Fri Feb 18, 2005 6:07 pm
#14
Hmm...the Social tree idea is interesting.
So long as performance abilities were combined effectively, I like the idea of having one profession to entertain. ID, however, still needs to be it's own animal - in real life, I generally don't associate personal trainers/hairstylists/tattoo artists in the same group as Musicians and Dancers.
Image Design is a really great and unique function in SWG, it deserves it's own dedication of skillpoints.
I would be very interested to see a Performer profession, and THEN a seperate healing/buffing Mind profession. Let those who wish to solely dedicate their time to healing and buffing to do so. Let the Performers perform in SWG - give us the skills and abilities we need to put on one HELL of a show. Performers should have no need to fear a /tell in the middle of a big performance saying "can u buff me plz." If we're in the middle of a routine, we shouldn't have to worry about the potential of losing a customer, nor lose the respect of Combat people because we're not available the moment they request a buff.
If healing and buffing were some other branch of Performer, it should have limited abilities to put on any kind of significant show, and should be pretty much not desired to put on any of performance in general.
If healing and buffing remained in the Performer skill, AFK play should not be possible. AFK play of Musician and Dancer needs to be taken out anyways, since it basically amounts to making a mockery of SWG as a game that people play, and it demeans Musicians and Dancers.
Vorpaks
Fri Feb 18, 2005 7:07 pm
#15
Esharra wrote:I'm all for combining musician and dancer, and if they want they can take the rest of my skillpoints because if I had it my way I'd never do anything else. As for the healing/buffing bs, make a buffbot profession. Give them a special little place they can call their on so I no longer have to log into my cantina and find them crowding each other out for that coveted spot in the front center of the stage. I no longer care..just as long as I can dance & play..that's what I came here for and it is why I've stuck around all this time. As long as I can dance & play, I'll be here..the rest of it no longer matters.
There are a lot of players who do play entertainers professions because they like the healing and buffing aspect though. And I am talking about legitamite players, not bots and exploiters.
Warryyr
Fri Feb 18, 2005 8:10 pm
#16
Vorpaks wrote:
Esharra wrote:
I'm all for combining musician and dancer, and if they want they can take the rest of my skillpoints because if I had it my way I'd never do anything else. As for the healing/buffing bs, make a buffbot profession. Give them a special little place they can call their on so I no longer have to log into my cantina and find them crowding each other out for that coveted spot in the front center of the stage. I no longer care..just as long as I can dance & play..that's what I came here for and it is why I've stuck around all this time. As long as I can dance & play, I'll be here..the rest of it no longer matters.
There are a lot of players who do play entertainers professions because they like the healing and buffing aspect though. And I am talking about legitamite players, not bots and exploiters.
I agree, but with the combination of Dancer and Musician, it would open up a lot of skill points. These could be dedicated to a seperate healing/buffing line of our profession, which combined would basically allow you to be a Musician and Dancer, AND retain all healing/buffing benefits, while costing less skillpoints than having both abilities.
For strictly Dancers or Musicians who have no interest in dancing/music AND want to retain healing/buffing benefits, it might suck. Otherwise, you could basically gain a new way to entertain, and retain your healing/buffing - while saving a lot of skillpoints compared to Dancer and Musician as they are. You'd only have to spend a few more skill points to buff all Mind stats.
Or, they could combine Musician/Dancer and still retain healing/buffing benefits - basically giving you the option of playing music or dancing but not either one.
Kyorlana
Fri Feb 18, 2005 8:21 pm
#17
I personally feel like this would be a huge step back rather than a step forward.
I LIKE the fact that we have separate trees for dancers/musicians/ids and I would like them to add content to further enhance and differentiate these. I do think that revamping the tree so that once you get past Entertainer you can select Novice Performer, Novice ID, or Novice Relaxation Specialist would be a good thing though.
I do not want enterainers to be lumped in with merchants. They do not belong in the same tree as far as I am concerned and merchant should stay under artisan (yes, I have a master merchant char who is also a politician).
Likewise, I don't think politician should be part of the entertaining tree either.
If there is no option here and we are facing a major tree amalgamation then I can just about understand a political line focusing on social skill development within the tree with option to specialise as politician once those 4 boxes have been completed.
To be honest though, it sounds like and FEELS like a cop out. Almost as if they are saying 'Well Politician wasn't worth the points, now merchants are complaining about the points, entertainers are dying so why not lump them all into one to add value to the skill points?'
My answer... because we deserve better!
I LIKE the fact that we have separate trees for dancers/musicians/ids and I would like them to add content to further enhance and differentiate these. I do think that revamping the tree so that once you get past Entertainer you can select Novice Performer, Novice ID, or Novice Relaxation Specialist would be a good thing though.
I do not want enterainers to be lumped in with merchants. They do not belong in the same tree as far as I am concerned and merchant should stay under artisan (yes, I have a master merchant char who is also a politician).
Likewise, I don't think politician should be part of the entertaining tree either.
If there is no option here and we are facing a major tree amalgamation then I can just about understand a political line focusing on social skill development within the tree with option to specialise as politician once those 4 boxes have been completed.
To be honest though, it sounds like and FEELS like a cop out. Almost as if they are saying 'Well Politician wasn't worth the points, now merchants are complaining about the points, entertainers are dying so why not lump them all into one to add value to the skill points?'
My answer... because we deserve better!
Esharra
Fri Feb 18, 2005 9:59 pm
#18
Vorpaks wrote:
Esharra wrote:
I'm all for combining musician and dancer, and if they want they can take the rest of my skillpoints because if I had it my way I'd never do anything else. As for the healing/buffing bs, make a buffbot profession. Give them a special little place they can call their on so I no longer have to log into my cantina and find them crowding each other out for that coveted spot in the front center of the stage. I no longer care..just as long as I can dance & play..that's what I came here for and it is why I've stuck around all this time. As long as I can dance & play, I'll be here..the rest of it no longer matters.
There are a lot of players who do play entertainers professions because they like the healing and buffing aspect though. And I am talking about legitamite players, not bots and exploiters.
Then there should be a separate situation for those who Want to buff and couldn't give a fig about performing. But it is not what I play for.
Tralmek
Fri Feb 18, 2005 10:10 pm
#19
Well, one thing we all seem to agree on is that as it stands, we're being gipped in the bigger picture because of the huge skillpoint cost for such a small bit of content.
I'm going to throw out a couple of "what ifs" here...see if anyone likes the suggestions.
1. What if they rejuggle the skilltrees to work in the ability to have only Performance skills, not requiring the healing lines for Dancer or Musician. This could move Performance healing and buffs to an entirely new tree off the Entertainer healing. Stat migrations could be thrown into this skilltree as well. Perhaps it could have only healing xp, and require little or no skillpoints.
The spare line left in Dance and Music could be used for further enhancements--special effects, pet/droid commands, billboard placement, ect. I'm sure many of these could be made into Dance/Music-specific things to make one profession or the other more desirable to certain people instead of virtually duplicating the skills like we have now.
2. What if the skillpoint requirements for our current professions were rebalanced to more accurately reflect the "worthfulness" of our skills. A Master Dancer can't hope to compete with a Master Pistoleer so far as credits or pretty much anything else goes, but our SP cost is the same. A TKM requires fewer skillpoints and they are superior (in my experience, credit-wise) to Pistoleers.
3. What if we kept the Entertainer tree the same. Elite professions from the Entertainer tree would be: Performance (Dance/Music combined), Image Designer, and Performance Healing (where healing, buffing, and stat migrations would end up). Perhaps Master Entertainer would be required to start up the Healing Elite, making that path less desirable to buffbots, etc.
Thanks for your attention! 
Shaizann
Sat Feb 19, 2005 12:14 am
#20
I don't know, I think I agree with Drygo. This seems like giving up to me. Rather than try to get cool, diverse content with each profession, we'll just lump ourselves together. That way it give an illusion that we have twice as much content for one profession vice two sets of half baked and some half broken abilites.
Furthur, if we have this idea (and the devs also, if they still even care) of making us a 'new and unique' experience then I think lumping us with merchant is counterproductive as well. We're not combaters and we're not crafters.
As for the performance only v. buffer support person thing, I personally want both. Why do I want both? Because I want the largest possible set of Musician activity options avialable to me when I log in. If I want to sell buffs, cool..I'll do that. However, if I want to form up a band and put on a show, I want to do that too if the moood strikes me.
I would rather have to think about cool, fun stuff for us to do during our revamp. Lumping us together seems like shoveing us to the side so we don't have to be thought about too much.
Yes, I know, I sound down, but the glass seems more and more empty to me all the time these days. I'm getting tired of the fight.
Furthur, if we have this idea (and the devs also, if they still even care) of making us a 'new and unique' experience then I think lumping us with merchant is counterproductive as well. We're not combaters and we're not crafters.
As for the performance only v. buffer support person thing, I personally want both. Why do I want both? Because I want the largest possible set of Musician activity options avialable to me when I log in. If I want to sell buffs, cool..I'll do that. However, if I want to form up a band and put on a show, I want to do that too if the moood strikes me.
I would rather have to think about cool, fun stuff for us to do during our revamp. Lumping us together seems like shoveing us to the side so we don't have to be thought about too much.
Yes, I know, I sound down, but the glass seems more and more empty to me all the time these days. I'm getting tired of the fight.
Panthu
Sat Feb 19, 2005 3:11 am
#21
Shaizann wrote:
Yes, I know, I sound down, but the glass seems more and more empty to me all the time these days. I'm getting tired of the fight.
/snog Shailas
No, actually, we Ents seem to be doing pretty well in the Devs' minds right now. I think we have a pretty good chance at seeing some truly original new content for us fairly soon... I just hate it that the other "social-ish" profs seem to be losing ground and I really do feel like we could perhaps become stronger in the long run if we let them come on over now.
I think we have a pretty good chance at seeing some truly original new content for us fairly soon... I just hate it that the other "social-ish" profs seem to be losing ground and I really do feel like we could perhaps become stronger in the long run if we let them come on over now. Any way, just curious to see what others thought! Thanks for humoring me! /grouphug
Maisland
Sat Feb 19, 2005 3:47 am
#22
I don't like the idea of combining Merchant or Politician with the current Entertainer Professions. However, I can see a way of combining Dancer and Musician so that we could keep the seperate masteries, but allow those who want both to save skill point wise...
How about if the healing lines from Dancer and Musician were shared? After all, they share the healing line in Entertainer... and this way, a Master Dancer or Musician who wanted a double Mastery would only need to pick up the tech and knowledge lines from the other profession. Personally, I have no problem having Dancer and Musician as seperate Masteries and the only skill point issue comes up when I have a character that wants both. This would make the Entertainer professions unique to be sure, but I think that is a good thing. (It would also free up enough skill points that I would be able tomake my Ultimate Entertainer. 
)
)As for Merchant and Politician, either leave them alone, or maybe make Merchant a seperate lone profession like Politician is now... and I can see making Merchant and Politician being related. I see no relationship to any of the Entertainer lines though. I don't know what they would do to replace the Business line in Artisan though.
Message Edited by Maisland on 02-19-2005 01:50 AM
Drygo
Sat Feb 19, 2005 5:25 am
#23
Esharra wrote:
Vorpaks wrote:
Esharra wrote:
I'm all for combining musician and dancer, and if they want they can take the rest of my skillpoints because if I had it my way I'd never do anything else. As for the healing/buffing bs, make a buffbot profession. Give them a special little place they can call their on so I no longer have to log into my cantina and find them crowding each other out for that coveted spot in the front center of the stage. I no longer care..just as long as I can dance & play..that's what I came here for and it is why I've stuck around all this time. As long as I can dance & play, I'll be here..the rest of it no longer matters.
There are a lot of players who do play entertainers professions because they like the healing and buffing aspect though. And I am talking about legitamite players, not bots and exploiters.
Then there should be a separate situation for those who Want to buff and couldn't give a fig about performing. But it is not what I play for.
I disagree. Drygo is a Dancer. Sure, he can do some music because of the entertainer skills. But, he's not a musician. As a Master Dancer he can also buff and heal. Under your scenario, if I still wanted to have every single dance skill and be able to buff, I would no doubt have to master this Performer profession and then master what you call this Buffbot profession. So, I am *seriously* losing out in the skill point area. This is completely unfair to those of us who would like to see a well rounded, performance and support role within the entertainer professions. It's great that you personally only want to perform and you're satisfied with that. But, let's not push away the concerns and put at a disadvantage those of us who enjoy the interdependence part of our professions.
Else-Whira
Sat Feb 19, 2005 8:44 am
#24
Drygo wrote:
There are a lot of players who do play entertainers professions because they like the healing and buffing aspect though. And I am talking about legitamite players, not bots and exploiters.I disagree. Drygo is a Dancer. Sure, he can do some music because of the entertainer skills. But, he's not a musician. As a Master Dancer he can also buff and heal. Under your scenario, if I still wanted to have every single dance skill and be able to buff, I would no doubt have to master this Performer profession and then master what you call this Buffbot profession. So, I am *seriously* losing out in the skill point area. This is completely unfair to those of us who would like to see a well rounded, performance and support role within the entertainer professions. It's great that you personally only want to perform and you're satisfied with that. But, let's not push away the concerns and put at a disadvantage those of us who enjoy the interdependence part of our professions.
Yeah I feel the same way. Seriously, if they want to give us a break on skill point cost the best way is to remove novice-master entertainer, move those skill mods and xp requirements into the elite branches and eliminate a HUGE portion of our skill cost and NONE of our content.
SpaceCrazy
Sat Feb 19, 2005 10:00 am
#25
I don't like it at all. I would consider it a complete cop-out and that the "grand experminent" of trying to have social classes in a game centered around combat would be a failure. The point would be to what, free up skillpoints? For what purpose? To get more combat skills. Bah. I can already have master an entertainer profession and master a combat profession. Or master an entertainer prof and a crafting prof, etc.
I'm for keeping the professions separate as they are now and actually getting content added...for ALL professions, not just combat.
I'm for keeping the professions separate as they are now and actually getting content added...for ALL professions, not just combat.
Aynianu
Sat Feb 19, 2005 10:43 am
#26
Id prefer more expanding on existing proffessions, possibly requiring less skill points for the dancer/musician/ID tree's (but not removal of skill points alltogether) keeping the basic entertainer proffession the same skill points, and have a few new elite proffessions that could add some element to the cantina's...
We have Musicians, Dancers, Image Designers...
Why not Singer/Songwriter?
Why not Masseur? (or perhaps add this to Image Design)
Why not Actor/Actress? Holodrama's/features are a big part of SWG (equivilent of soap opera's, and movies)
Im sure some of my idea's would be too hard to implement but i can dream cant i