CUEmu - Thread Posts

Hawaii

Fri Feb 13, 2004 11:07 am

Nobody is flaming you because you are about the 10,000th troll and after a while people just ignore them. Besides, you obviously don't really care because you clearly haven't bothered to read the forum or research the problem at all, you just wanted to come be a troll. Well *waves* hi troll, welcome to our world. What you are really complaining about is that there aren't enough Entertainers who want to buff *you*.

Hereare the simple facts:

Doctors can easily make 100k in 8 minutes buffing for about the same materials cost asa measly stimB. Buffing is reliable, if the customer is bugged and cannot be buffed you instantly know. I charge 10k but customers often tip 15k, even 25k in thanks. Health and Action are easily healed by 80% of the population using stimB's because everyone almost has novice medic. Doctors get to buff 6 stats a HUGE amount. Doctor buffs can last upto 3 hours or more (mine are slightly over 3 hours right now).

Performers are lucky to get 3k in 8 minutes buffing no cost to performer but time, fine, buffing is NOT reliable, is confusing for both performer and customer and there is no feedback until 8 minutes have passed that it failed wasting both parties time and further causing hatred towards the entertainment community. MANY performers don't even know how to buff because the procedure is basically kept a secret by the developers. Mind is not easily healed, and costly to the mind of the few combat medics out there who use mind heal. Entertainers either buff one (dancers) or two (musicians) stats... we were denied the ability for entertainers to buff all 3 mind stats at once making it far more difficult on the entertainer community and FAR less convenient for the patrons -- and we at most double the users own stat. EVEN if the person is master dancer/master musican now the patron has to wait TWICE as long for both buffs and almost 10% of the first buff would be wasted. Mind buffs last at most 2 hours.

So I ask, When is the last time you tipped a performer25k for 8 minutes of their timefor buffing arguably your most important stats?

I thought so.

Simply put, doctors make tons of money buffing, entertainers get spit on, harassed, assaulted, stalked, puked on, drooled on, insulted, and are offered very littlereturn, by the customers or the Sony developers. You do the math.

Most of the true performs have quit the profession, so you are left with your hologrinding buddies. Enjoy your next trip to the cantina curtesy of Sony Online Entertainment. I don't think I have performed in a public cantina since the holocron craze started, it was bad enough before that, now it's just hopeless.

I personally could care less if someone is AFK as long as they stand out of the way and don't spam constantly but apparently it's impossible for these people to have any consideration for anyone but themselves.

--Hawaii--

Master Doctor/Master Dancer

Hawaii

Fri Feb 13, 2004 11:38 am

#15

Jasynn wrote:

I really posted this in hopes that it may shock the Ent community into taking the game seriously and acting more like the Doc's do. I am disappointed at the lack of flames at me over such a provoking post. Apathy seems the order of the profession.

I'm sorry for my bluntness, but I am frustrated.

LOL -- By your own admission, you posted in hopes to incite flames, that is the definition of a troll post.

And instead of addressing the points I made in my reply, you just call me names.

--Hawaii--

Jasynn

Fri Feb 13, 2004 11:49 am

#16

Hawaii...You were the only one to flame me. However, previous to your post I had decided that entertainers [or dancers at least] were a cut above the other professions in manners and understanding. I still stand by that opinion. I won't hold you against the rest. What started this was this: "CanI buy a buff from you, please" "How about NO" "That was a little rude. All you had to say was 'sorry no'" "How about yo9u go F^&* yourself". This wasn't the first entertainer to respond like that. After your post, I did a double take on your name, wondering if you were that ent. As to your charges...

1. I pay what's asked of me for a buff. Usually that is around 10-12K.

2. I always give good tips to RPers.

3. I never tip AFK's.

4. I think that Ent buff's should be as long acting as Doc buffs.

5. I don't think it should take 10 minutes to get an Ent buff. 2-5 should be enough.

6. Doc buffs are not equivelant to stim-bs. They take very selcected resources and either cost a fortune to buy [20-50K per pack] ordays and days ofcollecting resourses, if the resource is even available at the time. Yesterday I spent 7 hours all together hunting Kaadu and Nuna 4-19 units at a time for their avian meat. In the end I got about 1220 units of meat. Not very much...but since it costs 100-150 cpu to buy good avian meat it was worth the effort. After all that, our results are still contingent on the quality of resources that we accumulate. Now...using only one factory we have to wait like 3 hours for a run to finish and we need four runs to make even one pack. Sure, your see a doc sit down and buff 20 people, but that is only the end of a long process. Don't forget that we have a lag time inbetween buffs. It takes about 2 minutes to buff someone. So that 20 people takes another 40 minutes. Ent's don't have to worry about any of this stuff.

7. Yes Ent buffs are important to me. Asa master Doc and a Rifleman, my mind is extrememly fragile and needs boosting. Muon used to do that, but now that isn't a veryt good option [sitting around an outpost filled with ST's popping illegal drugs can get you hurt].

8. Everyone but Hawaii seems to understand the problen and offer constructive advice. I have a legitimate gripe. It would seem that Hawaii is the actuall troll, serving no purpose inthe discusssion.

Hawaii...be carefull...Anger leads to hate...hate leads to the dark side...once you walk down its path, forever will it consume you!

Jasynn

Fri Feb 13, 2004 12:01 pm

#17

"Well, if you look on the docs forums, you will see a lot of people openly stating they aren't wearing their master doc title anymore because they constantly get asked for buffs. My interest in buffing someone else lies in one of two things: friendship or money. I don't have many friends who would need buffs, crafting or entertaining isn't too tough. So the incentive must be money. " -Voigt

Yes. Doc's turn off the Doc sign, but you have to understand that we just can't buff someone. We have to do other things, like hunt, to make those buffs. Sometimes we're out in the wild reviving [our other main job] dead Noob players. It's hard to hunt or be involved in PvP battles with our /tells going off wild. We loose the messages from our group players and have to do massive scrolling while fighting. Also we end up having to ignore the many tells. Better to turn off the sign than offend people. Doc's loosing their title isn't just because they don't want to do their job...it's a necessity of being able to do it siometimes.

Shidevie

Fri Feb 13, 2004 2:32 pm

#18

Funny, I had a mind buff from a master dancer last night that lasted the 3 hour cap. Sounds like your upset that you got ignored so much asking for buffs.

Shidevie
- Master Combat Medic
- Master Doctor
Shivanto
- Master Fencer
- Master Swordsman

MyT_Chicken

Fri Feb 13, 2004 3:22 pm

#19

Jasynn wrote:

You can see doctors out there all the time selling buffs. However the entertainers don't even deserve their ability to do mind buffs. If your lucky you can find one that's NOT afk. Blah blah blah blah blah

Dude you tried to pull this crap on the Doctor Forum and you got flamed to pieces....don't come to the Dancer forum and start **edit** just because you can't find a person that wants to buff you. With your additude I would tell you to go fly a kite. OMG your just asking for flames aren't you.

h Egri p
§ If you don't know; you'll find out soon enough! §

Hawaii

Fri Feb 13, 2004 3:30 pm

#20

Hawaii...You were the only one to flame me

LOL --- Wheredid Iflame YOU? I didn't saya word about you. I just said nobody was flaming troll posts much these days. You are the one that self-admitted that you were trolling for flames. In fact, your exact words"I am disappointed at the lack of flames at me over such a provoking post"... And just saying that nobody is replying totroll posts is a far cry from a flame.

You were comparing dancers and doctors. Since I happen to be both master dancer and master doctor for many months now I gave you my comparision of the two professions. Let me also add that I was avery dedicated entertainer and made very good money doing so. I've taking a break from the profession because the hologrinders have pretty much destroyed the profession.

BTW: Why was your first reply to me removed from the board? Maybe youshould tell everyone what you posted first. lol... yes I saw it before it was deleted.

Yesterday I spent 7 hours all together hunting Kaadu and Nuna 4-19 units at a time for their avian meat. In the end I got about 1220 units

That will make enough buff packs for you to sell for about 2.2 million credits. Sure you have other costs (covered below). I can get 1220 units of Naboo Avian in about half an hour,or an hour at the most. Not that it really matters.

You can stop reading if you don't care about the intricacies of the doctor profession...

6. Doc buffs are not equivelant to stim-bs. They take very selcected resources and either cost a fortune to buy [20-50K per pack] ordays and days ofcollecting resourses,

It takes those same days and days to collect resources to make quality stims as well. The only difference is you get about twice as many stims but they sell for 5% as much.You have to collect ALL that herbivore meat for quality stims too. Buffs aren't unique in needing meat.

It only takes22 units of avian per buff PACK, that's less than one unit of avian per dose. That's 3.3k worth and you turn around and sell for 40k (in buffs or whatever). Make 6 of those andyou get250k credits worth of buffs instead of 30k worth of stims (giving you 2.5 stims for each buff pack because of the extra acrdm's and abec's and differences in the liquid/sds component).

Here is a detailed comparison of the resources...

(all advanced components, we're talking quality stimpacks in the range of 40/400's that sell for ~100k/crate).

Both use Chemical Release Duration Mechanisms (buffs use 2) -- exactly the same except in quantity

Both use Bio Effect Controllers (buffs mostly 3, two of them use only 2) -- exactly the same except in quantity

Buffs use Reactive Gas (easy to get), stimB/C's use Inorganic (only slightly easier, cost to extract is the same)

Buffs use Avian Meat (covered above), stimB/C's use Organic -- granted more work but read below

Buffs use solid delivery shells (slightly more resources), stims use liquid suspensions

solid delivery shells take domesticated oats (plentiful and available on all planets and very high qualities)

liquid suspensions require special Dantooine Berry (whoops stims are harder on that one)

solid delivery shells take Dolovite Iron (sometimes can be rare, but available on more than one planet)

liquid suspensions require Talusian Water Vapor (another specific resource, but I'll give this one to buffs by a nose)

So where are these special resources that make buffs worth 20 times more than stims? Avian meat? Nope, stims use herbivore meat that's a wash, the only difference is in kind and quantity. Right now I have to collect 10 times the amount of herbivore meat to make enough stims to sell for the same price as one buff pack. That's a LOT of harvesting.Theamount of Avian I use is *trivial* compared to the Herbivore. Reactive Gas isn't rare or special, nor the difference between the solid delivery shells and the liquid suspensions (solid delivery shells take more resources for one but comparing it to 2.5 liquid suspensions,is 1 unit difference).

A buff pack is about 3 times more than a stimpack in resource requirements and most of that difference is in quantity, not difficulty or rareness of the resource.

Jasynn

Fri Feb 13, 2004 4:36 pm

#21

To the first guy, You don't know what your talking about. I didn't try anything. I posted the same thing at the same time on Doc, Dance and Musician. It was relevant to all three. I don't think I got flamed on the doc forum by docs.

To Hawaii. I accept what you just wrote, however your first post seems to try to degrade the topic from the prob to making it personal. If that isn't what you meant to do, then I don't have a prob.

As to stims vs. buffs. Your still wrong. Herbivore is not a good comparrison. I can go just about anywhere and kill Bols, Pickets etc. and get 80-120 untis of meat per kill. Now with avian that number shrinks to 4-20 per kill. It takes 6-40 times as many kills to make up the same volume. Also, there are more Herivores around than Avian creatures, so its harder to get. Add to that the fact that out of what little is there that you need to find good quality, and you have quite a different situation. Even if you buy your meat, good Avian is greatly more expenssive than good Herbivore. As far as the other resources mentioned, you fail to take into account that until this week it has been a very long time since some items have appeared with good stats. Dantooine berries are not that easy to get and neither is Lokian wheat, Talusian water [with good stats] or Tatooine Fiberplast with good stats. The only way this becomes easy is to mine massive quantities when they are available and stash them for the fututre. Thus, now you have to add professional miner to your necessary jobs to make your product. Since quality resources are greaty overpriced , if you want to make quality buffs, stims, rez kits, wound packs and all the other things we need to do our job, you are required to be an effective hunter, miner, doctor, and atrisan [surveying]. each part of the process takes large amounts of time. Only when a doc has been doing their job for a long time does this begin to get easier, just because he is stashing from previous work. Being a doc isn't to unlike being a master weaponsmith.

I may be wrong, but I don't remember you even mentioning the time involved in factory runs to make the product. If I had all the best resources, I would still have to wait 10-14 hours for all the factory runs to be complete. If I were making enough to stock vendors te runs would take days.

Also, most chars have the ability to heal themselves of both damage and wounds, in the field,just by taking out the novice medic skill. Most people have to run back to cantinas to get mind healed. Doc are also at a disadvantage because wound heals are effected by the chars mental state, but I don't believe it works the other way around.

Point is that docs have to do a lot more work for those buffs than ents do. That's why it costs more. I myself choose to buy buff packs and stims because I don't like all the work involved in making them [been tere...done that]. Those packs cost more than making them does, so I pass the cost on to the comsumer [business 101]. The result is that I usually have better packs than I could make without a ton of work and I usually have more of them. I give back by buffing noobies when I run into them.

I don't have a problem getting buffs because of my 'attitude'. I am quite nice in asking. Before I became master doc, I asked to byuy docs buff too. I get a lot different response from the docs IN GENERAL than I get from entertainers. Where was I rude in that example exchange?

Jasynn

Fri Feb 13, 2004 5:04 pm

#22

MyT_Chicken wrote:

"Dude you tried to pull this crap on the Doctor Forum and you got flamed to pieces....don't come to the Dancer forum and start **edit** just because you can't find a person that wants to buff you. With your additude I would tell you to go fly a kite. OMG your just asking for flames aren't you."

You need glasses. Try re-reading the doc forum. Every doc either agreed or sypathized with the frustration. Only one single flame and it was from an Ent, not a doc. Also your assumptions as to the reasons I have trouble getting buffed are nothing more than baseless opinion and whistling in the wind. You have no clue what goes on in my game play.

RatRock

Sat Feb 14, 2004 12:13 am

#23

Jasynn wrote:

I really posted this in hopes that it may shock the Ent community into taking the game seriously and acting more like the Doc's do. I am disappointed at the lack of flames at me over such a provoking post. Apathy seems the order of the profession.

I'm sorry for my bluntness, but I am frustrated.

so it comes out your TRYING to provoke us and your disappointed that we didnt flame you to high heck? if anything this shows that we have some respect and dont just shout "i 0wnz j00 n00bz"

go back to thejedi forums im sure you can provoke someone there

Avadan Lightfly (Ahazi)
"Me a smuggler? nah i may be a clandestine importer and exporter of dangerous, rare, and valueable cargo to less than reputable businessmen but definatly not a smuggler"
A power point slide made by a couple of our dev's
"How To Manage a Large Scale Online Community"
http://www.legendmud.org/raph/gaming/gdc_2002_community_files/frame.htm#slide0001.htm

Breestan

Sat Feb 14, 2004 8:16 pm

#24

Wait wait! I noticed something! I'm serious. It may not apply to this current situation that the original poster is having but it does make some sense....

No less than 6 times last night did I see people yelling and shouting- literally /shout and /yell "WHO CAN BUFF ME" "IS ANYONE ABLE TO BUFF" and such (usually caps, but not always.) Then after about 10 minutes I'd read angry people going on about how "stupid entertainers are useless and always AFK..." (Which annoys me because no one really but entertainers cared until it bothered the combat people.)

I have to admit, I ignored them. But here is why. (Like I said this may not apply to the original poster but it is something I noticed.)

1. When I see someone shouting or yelling they are automatically assumed to be trying to contact people within a larger radius than simple chat commands reach. I do not assume that this person is in a cantina.

Tekoa Dia'koh *** Irys Eo'Nel

Master Dancer and Image Designer

:: The Lunatic Dawn :: Redemption, Lok, Ahazi *** Mos Eisly, Starsider

And proud to be a Galaxy Girl!

Breestan

Sat Feb 14, 2004 8:46 pm

#25

Bloody, it deleted the second post! ::Kills.... everything.::

Wait wait! I noticed something! I'm serious. It may not apply to this current situation that the original poster is having but it does make some sense....

No less than 6 times last night did I see people yelling and shouting- literally /shout and /yell "WHO CAN BUFF ME" "IS ANYONE ABLE TO BUFF" and such (usually caps, but not always.) Then after about 10 minutes I'd read angry people going on about how "stupid entertainers are useless and always AFK..." (Which annoys me because no one really but entertainers cared until it bothered the combat people.)

I have to admit, I ignored them. But here is why. (Like I said this may not apply to the original poster but it is something I noticed.)

When I see someone shouting or yelling they are automatically assumed to be trying to contact people within a larger radius than simple chat commands reach. I do not assume that this person is in a cantina.

Also, seeing only the word "Buff" Not "Mind buff" adds to the implication that "This person is looking for a doctor- not an entertainer, because of course an entertainer looking to buff would be easily found in the cantina, thus negating the need to shout across a larger distance."

Then there is the ever informative "Is anyone able to buff" To which the sadisti side of me thinks. "Duh...." Any entertainer is ABLE to buff, and if they want to find a master we have a nifty search function....

"But! That's too much work!" Well, shouting isn't working, so ask by name. /tell AFKperson Hey, Can I get a mind buff?

::insterts jeopardy music::

Okay, they don't answer... /tell Tekoa Can I get a mind buff?

Tekoa replies "Yeah, I've got about 4 other people here so if you are in a group, disband and join mine so I can get all of you alright?"

That's the biggest reason I ignore spatial requests. ...ignoring isn't the right word.

90% of the time I am juggling roleplaying, Group chat (training, explaining the buff process etc), guild chat, and /tells in an already spammed environment. While I have my name colorized it sometimes STILL gets lost in the spatial spam. At least a /tell has a nice little *ding* attached to it that makes me scroll up. Tack this chaos onto 6 other Buff requesting /tells and the necessity to try and explain that a group buff is as good as an active buff, the 50% chance that this bozo won't /watch (Despite my timer macro telling them to be sure to...) or trying to explain to an irate customer that the buff will not kick in until they stop watching (Then explain that watching is not just being able to SEE ME in the screen, and stoping requires the radial... THEN explain that the radial is the thing that comes up when you click on a player to trade..... I swear I am making an informative Macro for this....)

Sometimes the ignoring is not because we are spiteful. It's that we are overwhelmed. I drop my title if I need a breather to do ANYTHING. I don't have time to translate someone's vague shout.

And if a person is AFK, do not consider them an entertainer. They are more than likely a grinder without any care for the patrons, and they'll be gone eventually. If no one is actually at the keyboard in a busy cantina, it's not the True Entertainers fault. (Either that or we are off getting a sandwich, or chocolate milk... so be patient....)

Entertainers, just keep in mind that others are being affected by the same things we are. (Yes, it's about time) But still... Be courteous, and send us a personal /tell. And adress us by name so we know who you are talking to. ^-^

Tekoa Dia'koh *** Irys Eo'Nel

Master Dancer and Image Designer

:: The Lunatic Dawn :: Redemption, Lok, Ahazi *** Mos Eisly, Starsider

And proud to be a Galaxy Girl!

Kuildeous

Mon Feb 16, 2004 11:30 am

#26

Jasynn wrote:

I really posted this in hopes that it may shock the Ent community into taking the game seriously and acting more like the Doc's do. I am disappointed at the lack of flames at me over such a provoking post. Apathy seems the order of the profession.

I'm sorry for my bluntness, but I am frustrated.

Posting in these forums is the wrong step. The people who read these forums do take the profession seriously. Well, I'd say 80-90% of the forum rats are ATK entertainers who actually buff people's minds. The remaining portion are those who feel justified in being AFK and those who support AFKers and hope to keep them going. Oh, there are some patrons who support ATK entertainers as well, but I group them in the 80-90% category.

The people who are frustrating you likely don't even read these forums. They google "swg dance macro" and go from there. They probably won't even come here to see how much you hate them.

And the ones who do AFK entertain won't be swayed by your words. They already do not play the game and already do not buff people (except for the few group bots). So what does it matter to them that you want the ability they never use to be removed?

In short, I'm afraid you're shouting at a wall. It might feel good, but ultimately, it's pointless.

BTW, you're not the first person to post the "shocking" proclamation that entertainers should lose the buffing ability. There's another thread like that. I'll paste my own response to that thread here, since you didn't see the original. If you still care about the thread, a quick search should help you out.

Emalie wrote:

Sure I could sit there and let someone then heal my mind and such, but didn't dancers want something more for the class, like buffing the mind? And now the dancers have a mind buff but are all AFK so no one gets it.

Big word: ALL

So, all the dancers are AFK? I'm kind of worried about your Big Brother ability to determine that dancers are AFK. Ah, but I have no fear after all. If you had that kind of omniscience, you would know that I am not AFK and that I appreciate the mind buff ability. I was especially glad when they increased the power and duration.

But since there are some dancers who displease you, then I deserve to have my profession ability stripped away from me. Sounds fair. By the same token, a chef once called me a dirty name. I believe all chefs should be stripped of their ability to craft. How dare they!

In the old days, you got buffs just by watching dancers. Now that they're more powerful, they are more selective, so you have to work to get your mind buff. Just going into a cantina and asking won't do it. There's a chance you'll find a dancer to buff you, but don't hold your breath.

You need to network. Just like you probably won't find a random master weaponsmith to craft you a killer scout blaster, you probably won't find a random dancer to buff. Which is too bad, because you should be able to walk into a cantina and get your three Blue buffs. These buffs should be easily available. But we dancers will go where the fun is. Zombie Town is usually not much fun.

So I'm not in the cantinas anymore. Those who know me know how to find me for the buff. You probably won't find me by walking into a crowded cantina and calling my name.

RIP: Tasha Jalul - Radiant
Love Star Wars, but the few role-players I could find on the servers were outnumbered by powergamers who wanted only l337 l00t and mad skillz. I can't justify paying $15 a month to play a game by myself.
Still cares enough to interject an opinion, though.

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Thread: Entertainers should loose their buffing ability!