Commando Archive
Thread: Proposal: New Heavy Weapon Rifle Tree
garvin i respect you a lot and i read all your post but i think that idea isnt too good and i here is my reason
Reason:
As you said if we had a rifle with blast dmg none of us will use any more the rocket launcher or the LP. I see consumables weapons as a Big shoot of us normal weapons( well they need improve the dmg and accurancy but that is another history)
What want i mean? welli want say for example we have rocket launcher its blast damage and it need be used as a "special" of LP the main weapon. We have and light lighting beam cannonand its electricity damageand it will need another main weapon for example electricity carabine or Rifle electricity, where you can choose use main weapon for usual shots and some times for big shoots you will use consumable which need be Area attack. i dont know can i explain me fine...
I only want say that consumable weapons need be as a special shoot with area attack but we need have one main weapon of each type of damage of those consumable weapons too use both weapons and none of them will be forgotten
Solution:
For example
garvin i respect you a lot and i read all your post but i think that idea isnt too good and i here is my reason
Reason:
As you said if we had a rifle with blast dmg none of us will use any more the rocket launcher or the LP. I see consumables weapons as a Big shoot of us normal weapons( well they need improve the dmg and accurancy but that is another history)
On the Contrary...how powerful do you think the new Assult Rifle will be...The Rocket Launcher will still be more powerful...So this will give us better options...use a non-consumable less powerful blast weapon, or a consumable more powerful blast weapon...I think this will infact lead to us using the RL more often then we do now and more strategicly...we'll probably start many battles with the RL then quickly switch to the new Assult Rifle....
Just like people use the LP and the Rocket Launcher...I'm mainly talking about taking the idea of the LP and expanding on it...giving it mods and specials in our own trees instead of relying on other professiosn, but then taking it up a noche and making it a rifle instead of a pistol...It would have it's power slightly above the typical Laser Rifle (above 400) and AP2 or higher preferably...Because of it's power, it's speed would suffer...In the long run, the RL (with some fixing coming hopefully) will be more powerful per shot then the Assult Rifle...but DPS, the Rifle would be more powerful...So we'd end up with some strategic value in these weapons...Do you need to do high upfront damge or are you better off doing higher damage over time? I think this would add a new element of fun to our profession...
lockder wrote:
Guys you are obsessed with AP... a comandonever can be better with a rifle than a rifleman or with a pistol than a pistoleer. I think instead give ap 3 to all weapons as many of us want. I think they need give AP2 but with high damage than a normal weapon for reflect they are "heavy". then they need give only ap 3 to consumable weapons or weapons for those class which use that type of weapon for example rifle for riflemans carabine for carabineers ( pistol need better specials and speed than of us LP)
When it comes to speed and accuracy, it's my personal opinion that Rifleman and Pistoleers should be better then us...it's like any specialty in RL...if you study a broad range of topics you'll never be better at a specific topic as a person who spent their lives learning specializing in that one topic...We should miss more and have less Effect Specials (since we aren't as accurate)...
BUT...when it comes to damage, we should be better then Rifleman and Pistoleer with a Rifle or Pistol...we carry HEAVY versions of their weapons...these Heavy version should out damage them (and this includes Damage Per Second)....AP level makes sure of that in different circumstances...Some of the changes in the Combat Balance is suppose to help support this idea...of course though, we still have no specific details to go on...
In essence, we shouldn't be able to do as much status effects (kd, target specific ham bar, dizzy, etc) with a pistol or rifle, but we should be able to pack a bigger punch...if they can out damage use per second, then that takes the wind out of our Heavy Weapon sails...This is why the CB's new speed, accuracy and damage formulas are going to be so important...
lockder wrote:
i really dont think why a comando would waste their money in a shoot ( counting you need go kneel from animation you waste a lot of time)if you can do the same damage in 2 shoots( or less time because RL is slowly). The only motivation i see is an area effect attack or higher AP
They would if my other proposal for changes to the RL go through...the secret is that I'm trying to get various little changes done that all fit into a much bigger picture...think of the Blast Damage Assult Rifle as a peice of the puzzle...
As for the proposal for the RL...it's basically using the same principle as a trap throwing droid... a weapon container that can be reloaded and used, but instead of calling it out like a droid, we would still click on it to use...We'd only need to get the container sliced for speed (if you don't get a speed slice, the slice basically fails and can't be sliced again...a possible penalty)...then we just buy ammo packs (which would come in various versions, blast, acid, particle, etc)...the Damage level and AP would be determined by the Ammo packs...And the ammo packs would be slicable just like grenades currently are, but they would work like power-ups where you drag and drop them onto the RL housing...Once loaded with an ammo type, that ammo type can not be unloaded...if you unload it it's lost (another penalty)...but you can load other ammo types over the current loaded ammo (so you can switch from blast to acid if the need calls for it)...The RL housing would still decay like normal weapons as well.
Anyway...that's the basic premise of what I proposed a few weeks back...it was gathered together from various posts throughout our Community regarding changes we'd like to see...This new RL would replace all of our current Consumable Heavy Weapons...it would allow WS's to focus more on ammo packs (which would be easier to craft) rather then the weapons themselves (which would also be easier since the WS could do the weapon in seperate crafting runs)...This proposal met with surprisingly good reviews from the devs...TH especially said he liked this idea and was going to take it personally to the Programmers to see what could be done...I think it has a chance because it basically builds off of something the Programmers recently created for another profession (the Trap Droid)...
I think if we got this new and improved RL people would actually use it, even if it meant we had to stop and kneel...it would be our primer weapon...the weapon we start a fight with...it would also be the weapon we use in a group when we need to do higher upfront damage more then lower over time damage...
I realize we are going off the topic here, but I just realized that by being able to slice both ammo packs and the launcher, we would effectively be double slicing our weapons, which I don't think is a good thing for the game. Maybe we could have the tube be slicable for speed or accuracy(if possible), and then allow powerups to be added to the ammopacks. The powerups could be added to the engineering tree (or Master Artisan since thats a bit lacking) to give low level players a possible source of income. Meanwhile, the ammopacks and tube could be crafted by the weaponsmiths.
garvin wrote
As for the proposal for the RL...it's basically using the same principle as a trap throwing droid... a weapon container that can be reloaded and used, but instead of calling it out like a droid, we would still click on it to use...We'd only need to get the container sliced for speed (if you don't get a speed slice, the slice basically fails and can't be sliced again...a possible penalty)...then we just buy ammo packs (which would come in various versions, blast, acid, particle, etc)...the Damage level and AP would be determined by the Ammo packs...And the ammo packs would be slicable just like grenades currently are, but they would work like power-ups where you drag and drop them onto the RL housing...Once loaded with an ammo type, that ammo type can not be unloaded...if you unload it it's lost (another penalty)...but you can load other ammo types over the current loaded ammo (so you can switch from blast to acid if the need calls for it)...The RL housing would still decay like normal weapons as well.
double slicing came up...but then you factor in the "penalties" proposed...the fact that you could get a failed slice...and that the ammo is "consumable"...unlike other slicable weapons out there, ours won't last as long (the ammo packs)...so we'll have to get them sliced more often...which will equal a higher overall cost...
There is also talk of the ammo having a slicing reduction penalty if the intial damage level is high enough...
Will post another...but I gotta say something on this quote:
Lockder wrote:
first say its a nice idea garvin then go for it
and Starnick i am all profesions atm ( holo grind im at 26 prof atm ) But i want be commando again my heart is commando my sout is it too. AP 3 vs AP2 only works when you hit a target with AR3 ( atm there are a few as krayts, Superbattle droids, NS and i think some tusken , i dont know if i forget some)
If you are AP2 and you hit an AR3 target you will get a reduccion of 50% but if you are AP2 and you hit AP1 you only will damage their armorwith 25% morebut you dont do more damage ( http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=fencer&message.id=12599 )
Its because that i said its better get more damage than more AP because when you do pvp ( commando its a pvp class) you max targets are only AP 1 except if you target a turret or an ATST but we have rocket launcher for that.