Combat Medic Archive
Thread: Suggestions to get doctor if you want to fight cm's are rediculous
I hear ya'll saying different things are good against diff things, But there isnt any profs which have such an advantage over a prof without a SPECIFIC prof (cm vs. doc).
Excluding carbineer, that **edit**s broke
Proposal:
Bounty Hunters get (over the course of their skill tree):
+35 poison resist
+40 resist to force powers (as one big fat bonus at master)
+40 ranged defense
+25 melee defense
+50 dodge
+20 counter attack
To compensate for this they will loose carbine speed and probably some other of their main perks for their weapons, maybe one of their more powerfull attacks.
Now, BHs probably won't be the most powerfull template, but they will be nicely rounded and at master they will recieve a profession related perk that no other profession has.
If this is fixed, can we get the BHs to quit whining? Damn it, it isn't my place to come up with fixes for your enormous waste of skill points. Petition your correspondent to get you unbroken. Just stay the hell out of my chosen profession.
Rchuno wrote:
Back to the whole point of the thread. A TKM/HSM/Scout4XXX would be my prefered way to take down a CM. Maybe even fencer instead of HSM. Burst run in after the sucker and nail him in the head. If you are a smart PvPer (and I know I will offend some people here, sorry) you will be wathing the system messages. You will recieve the message that you have been poisoned at the same time the CM has been stuck. so you will have 4 seconds to close in. They will then throw a second poison or a disease at you causeing them to be stuck another 4 seconds which should give you enough time to get to them and lay them on their arses with TK and then beat them in the head with your power hammer or baton. More than likely they do not have scout 4XXX which makes your burst run last alot longer. After they are dead (which takes about 8 seconds or so once they are on their backs you will be down to almost no mind, they are dead and you meditate it off. This all took about 28-30 seconds meaning 3 full ticks of poison and 10 seconds till disease sets in and at TKM you should be able to avoid most of the disease.
Message Edited by Rchuno on 04-26-2004 09:53 PM
Well on my server if you are ANY good at pvp you dont do ANYTHING!!! without a few things...
1. 90% Comp (with a 48% stun helm)
2. 44% Synthsteak
3. Imp PSGs with 48% to all
Suppose you do 2000 damage just those 3 will reduce the damage to14 damage with the 75% pvp damage redcution and i am not an expert on damages but thats not taking into accound damage due to stuff like unarmed tuffness and melee midigation! Posions bypass ALL of that!!! The whole time my mind (by the way i am a mon cal with 1300 base mind and i always pvp with mind buffs which brings it to 2600 add 2 +408 brandy, power boost for another 650, and if fighing a CM use muon for a total of4566 mind pool) is draining faster than hell. The only way i ever kill a CM is if the guy reeks of noob.
So on my server the notion of a TKM killing a CM is a joke
Iporz wrote:
If you want to be effective against TKMs and their kd/dizzy, you get fencer.
Or you buy 80% kinetic armor (most common kind) which everyone can wear except for wookiees
If you want to be effective against Ranged profs, you master a ranged prof so as to get mitigation 3.
Or you learn how to effectively play your profession. Kiting isn't hard to cope with these days (this is coming from someone who has played melee since launch).
If you want to be effective against cm's you get some doctor skills.
Bull**edit**
It's all a tradeoff. Thats what makes it a GAME.
There is nothing accessible to everyone to help against combat medics besides spending at the least 97 skillpoints on doctor. No other profession requires this.
It takes strategy. It takes balls(no offense ladies).
It takes balls to throw something from 20m out of range of any other profession? And god help the melee players.
Can you get them before they get you? Thats what it comes down to.
Depends on how far away they start. If I burst at them and they burst at the same time, then no. Luckily most FOTM combat medics are just that and have no idea of tactics.
The reason people dont like CM's is because the effects linger after dispatching the CM who threw them. That is why they are called DOT's.
Bleeds and flames are dots. Maybe if they hadn't been nerfed a couple of publishes ago things would be different, at this point its a moot statement
CM will lose a fight against multiple opponents. Straight up. They will lose.
[insert name of profession] will lost a fight against multiple opponents. However they won't be griefing the people they lost to for the next 10 minutes.
No defense.
Neither does pikeman, commando, carbineer or bounty hunter
Their friends will then whip ur ass because you have 500 mind wounds and 1(10000000) mind left. Thats what pisses people off. They dont take the time to think that maybe a doc and a dancer is a worthwhile addition to ur pvp group.
I'll remember to make sure I have a dancer doing her thing in the middle of a battle next time I pvp. I'll also make sure that I bend the laws of physics and find a way that a doctor (healing poison every 3 seconds per single person) can keep up with a combat medic poisoning a group of people every 4 seconds. The bigger the group, the higher percentage of docs you need. Its exponential.
Those who do realize dont come here and cry for a nerf.
Those who do "realize" are combat medics.
Rchuno wrote:
Whatnot wrote:
Tataomm wrote:Iporz wrote:
If you want to be effective against TKMs and their kd/dizzy, you get fencer.
Or you simply kite them with a ranged class. Perhaps even look into eating some of the widely available anti-KD food.If you want to be effective against Ranged profs, you master a ranged prof so as to get mitigation 3.
I think some nice 80% composite armor goes a long way to protecting against ranged profs.If you want to be effective against cm's you get some doctor skills.
Or... oh wait. There is no effective defense against CM's other than doctor skills. All classes, except for CM, in this game can be countered without the need to change your template.It's all a tradeoff. Thats what makes it a GAME. It takes strategy (Unless you happen to be a CM). It takes balls(Unless you happen to be a CM). Can you get them before they get you (Not unless you happen to be a doctor as well as a combat profession)? Thats what it comes down to (Being the FoTM). The reason people dont like CM's is because the effects linger after dispatching the CM who threw them (Not to mention the fact that they can destroy a group of 20 prepared fighters with one flick of the wrist). That is why they are called DOT's. CM will lose a fight against multiple opponents. Straight up. They will lose. No defense. Their friends will then whip ur ass because you have 500 mind wounds and 1(10000000) mind left. Thats what pisses people off (Exactly!). They dont take the time to think that maybe a doc and a dancer is a worthwhile addition to ur pvp group (Do people PvP without docs anymore? A lot of good it does them). Those who do realize dont come here and cry for a nerf.
Allow me to add some facts to your post.
1. CM's can wear armor, yet their attack bypasses all armor.
CMs don't have an attack
2. CM's are the only profession whose attack is not affected by the 75% PvP damage reduction.
CMs don't have an attack
3. CM's are the only class whose DOT's haven't been nerfed.
CMs don't have an attack. All they have is a DOT
4. CM's AOE is the largest area of effect in the game.
That is because it is from their only DOT
5. CM's range in the largest in the game.
A bug that is being worked on already
6. (In the interest of completeness) CM's have to stand still for 4 seconds after throwing their poison.
Yeup.
But I for one don't see any balance problem.
OK I for one see this as people thinking that either poisons are an attack and a DOT. This is not the case they either have to be an attack or a DOT but not both. So if you complain about both it just looks silly because some say that the damage should be reduced like everyone elses attacks and that it should be reduced like other peoples' bleeds.Back to the whole point of the thread. A TKM/HSM/Scout4XXX would be my prefered way to take down a CM. Maybe even fencer instead of HSM. Burst run in after the sucker and nail him in the head. If you are a smart PvPer (and I know I will offend some people here, sorry) you will be wathing the system messages. You will recieve the message that you have been poisoned at the same time the CM has been stuck. so you will have 4 seconds to close in. They will then throw a second poison or a disease at you causeing them to be stuck another 4 seconds which should give you enough time to get to them and lay them on their arses with TK and then beat them in the head with your power hammer or baton. More than likely they do not have scout 4XXX which makes your burst run last alot longer. After they are dead (which takes about 8 seconds or so once they are on their backs you will be down to almost no mind, they are dead and you meditate it off. This all took about 28-30 seconds meaning 3 full ticks of poison and 10 seconds till disease sets in and at TKM you should be able to avoid most of the disease.Message Edited by Rchuno on 04-26-2004 09:53 PM
Do you have any idea how much damage a tkm or mhs do to an armored head?
Most likely the combat medic will lay there laughing, I know I do. As for fencer, we don't get a head hit. We get a hit where 20% of the damage is to the head. Using a gaffi its worse than those two profs and if they have a stun helmet on then a stun baton is pretty worthless anyway (ap0 verse ar1 sucks).
On my server the only way to fight combat medics is with combat medics of your own. If thats not possible then we make sure to keep them incapped for as long as necessary (meaning if a raid last 2 hours, we'll attempt to keep those CMs on the ground for 2 hours).
Instead of an eye for an eye, its a grief for a grief.
Seriously, you need to stop whining and go get a doctor to PvP with. A CM can't touch a group of 5 or 6 with a doctor in it. I agree there should be other ways to prevent/cure poisons/diseases, but right now there isn't so get over it and find a doctor.
Tataomm wrote:
Iporz wrote:
If you want to be effective against TKMs and their kd/dizzy, you get fencer.
Or you simply kite them with a ranged class. Perhaps even look into eating some of the widely available anti-KD food. -Not all people have the money to stay buffed on thatkillo(sp).
If you want to be effective against Ranged profs, you master a ranged prof so as to get mitigation 3.
I think some nice 80% composite armor goes a long way to protecting against ranged profs. Meet my jawa rifleand geo pistol sometime.
If you want to be effective against cm's you get some doctor skills.
Or... oh wait. There is no effective defense against CM's other than doctor skills. All classes, except for CM,in this game can be countered without the need to change your template. It's called adapting. If you want to be effective adapt.
It's all a tradeoff. Thats what makes it a GAME. It takes strategy (Unless you happen to be a CM) Tell you what, take my MCM and go poison a group of 20 "prepared" fighters. See how long you last. You will be incapped before you finish throwing 1 poison. CM's have to use strategy too, like when to throw the poison. When you throw that heal, and when to sacrifice mind. . It takes balls(Unless you happen to be a CM). Can you get them before they get you (Not unless you happen to be a doctor as well as a combat profession)(Doctors are vulnerable to mind just like everyone else is. No one can heal their own mind. No one. Stop spaaming UA3 and spam scatterhit2 once in a while, or mindhit. Thats what it comes down to (Being the FoTM)(I have been a cm long before venoms). The reason people dont like CM's is because the effects linger after dispatching the CM who threw them (Not to mention the fact that they can destroy a group of 20 prepared fighters with one flick of the wrist)(Now you're just making yourself sound like an ass. A "prepared group would have a doc or two, as well as an ent/dancer to heal mind woundage). That is why they are called DOT's. CM will lose a fight against multiple opponents. Straight up. They will lose. No defense. Their friends will then whip ur ass because you have 500 mind wounds and 1(10000000) mind left. Thats what pisses people off (Exactly!)(Losing isn't fun but it happens get over it). They dont take the time to think that maybe a doc and a dancer is a worthwhile addition to ur pvp group (Do people PvP without docs anymore? A lot of good it does them)(How can it not do you any good? One doc can cure a group of 5 before even one tick.)
Message Edited by Iporz on 04-27-2004 01:00 PM
saladin123 wrote:wow didnt know so many people would reply. Well, the correspondant was right in saying that doctor IS an option but it seriously shouldnt be the only one. In response to iporz, you talk about being prepared yet you say not everyone can afford 80% comp and food.... If you cant afford that then you go do missions till you can then come pvp. Saying you just have to "adapt" is stupid. DOC SHOULD NOT BE THE ONLY WAY TO COMBAT A CM! Sure, you can come with docs the problem there has to be more docs than cm's. Cm's will disease/poison faster than docs can heal. Docs get area cures than everything shoudld be fine. I should NOT have to get doctor to combat ONE proffesion. And iporz, I do not have to get fencer to fight a tkm..either you dont pvp much, or you dont know that tkm's only damage type is kinetic. Tka cannot touch 80% comp. And thaktilo is easy to get everyone can use it. If you come to pvp without the right foods around than you deserve to lose. If you can afford good armor than you can afford thaktilo. The problem with cm's is that there is no defense other than doctors at the moment. All I want is some reasonable defenses to be implimented to give the prepared player a chance.CM should not be nerfed, nerfing is th stupidest thing the develpers ever did, it ruined ch and it ruined commando. You can do so much more buy fixing and adding than buy taking away.
All you need is one doc per cm, because as soon as the first poison is thrown, the cm has a huge target on his back.
Message Edited by kb4all on 04-28-2004 11:18 AM
Iporz wrote:Seriously, you need to stop whining and go get a doctor to PvP with. A CM can't touch a group of 5 or 6 with a doctor in it.I know, a group of 6 really shouldn't be able to beat a CM, I agree I agree there should be other ways to prevent/cure poisons/diseases, but right now there isn't so get over it and find a doctor.
Tataomm wrote:Iporz wrote:
If you want to be effective against TKMs and their kd/dizzy, you get fencer.
Or you simply kite them with a ranged class. Perhaps even look into eating some of the widely available anti-KD food. -Not all people have the money to stay buffed on thatkillo(sp).If you dont have money you don't PvP.. kinda given there, then again I suppose most CMs aren't used to having to try in PvPIf you want to be effective against Ranged profs, you master a ranged prof so as to get mitigation 3.
I think some nice 80% composite armor goes a long way to protecting against ranged profs. Meet my jawa rifle and geo pistol sometime.You can get imperial PSGs, 40% stun helms, and sythasteak which goes along way in preventing it, especially since geo pisotls are AP0 and also you can get defenses against ranged attacks.If you want to be effective against cm's you get some doctor skills.
Or... oh wait. There is no effective defense against CM's other than doctor skills. All classes, except for CM, in this game can be countered without the need to change your template. It's called adapting. If you want to be effective adapt.Why? Why should I have to rework my template because you CMs are so self centered.It's all a tradeoff. Thats what makes it a GAME. It takes strategy (Unless you happen to be a CM) Tell you what, take my MCM and go poison a group of 20 "prepared" fighters. See how long you last. You will be incapped before you finish throwing 1 poison. CM's have to use strategy too, like when to throw the poison. When you throw that heal, and when to sacrifice mind.What? 20 PvPers can kill you??? See, proof that CMs are underpowered! . It takes balls(Unless you happen to be a CM). Can you get them before they get you (Not unless you happen to be a doctor as well as a combat profession)(Doctors are vulnerable to mind just like everyone else is. No one can heal their own mind. No one. Stop spaaming UA3 and spam scatterhit2 once in a while, or mindhit. Thats what it comes down to (Being the FoTM)(I have been a cm long before venoms). The reason people dont like CM's is because the effects linger after dispatching the CM who threw them (Not to mention the fact that they can destroy a group of 20 prepared fighters with one flick of the wrist)(Now you're just making yourself sound like an ass. A "prepared group would have a doc or two, as well as an ent/dancer to heal mind woundage).The Dancer can't heal wounds in the middle of a fight, and even 2 doctors can't keep up with continous lobbing of AoE poisons. You also said it yourself, doctors are vulnerable to dying That is why they are called DOT's. CM will lose a fight against multiple opponents. Straight up. They will lose. No defense. Their friends will then whip ur ass because you have 500 mind wounds and 1(10000000) mind left. Thats what pisses people off (Exactly!)(Losing isn't fun but it happens get over it).Your right, except when you lose like that. If I lose against a TKA it'll be a good fight. I had a chance, maybe I messed soemthing up. Oh well. CMs though, your poisoned and there is nothing you can do about it. Now that is what I call fun! They dont take the time to think that maybe a doc and a dancer is a worthwhile addition to ur pvp group (Do people PvP without docs anymore? A lot of good it does them)(How can it not do you any good? One doc can cure a group of 5 before even one tick.) Pretty big assumption there, your assuming everyone is standing next to each other in a lag free enviroment.
Message Edited by Iporz on 04-27-2004 01:00 PM
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It boils down to the fun factor. Can any non-CMs agree that CM is a fun class to fight against? I think every non-CM can tell you how much they appreciate how CMs add to the GCW. Oh wait, there are not that many non-CMs left because they're all sick of how overpowered CM is.
And at the same time, you realize that the CM(s) on your side did the same thing to the enemy, so that all is fair, and everybody has to take some time out from running around madly ganking each other to actually think up some strategies.
Icecream47 wrote:
yeah, too bad it doesnt really happen that way. let me illustrate reality...
1) you're running around, and something out of your draw distance throws a shining ball at you. after a second another one comes and you get the poison and disease message
2) both of them tick, cutting your mind down drastically. you take muon and a canape to help stem the loss, and begin to run towards where you think the attack came from
3) as the CM is running away from you, if you're lucky, youll see where he is and ensue in battle with him. at this point your mind has ticked poison twice more, and the disease has tickced once. you are now maxed out in mind wounds and only have a small ammount of mind left after shooting the CM.
4) if they dont run away, you can probably incapacitate them if they arnt wearing stun armor (or low % stun armor) and use sniping shot. at this point you can no longer use specials as your mind is 10 or under
5) a stray riflemen (i say "stray" like they are uncommon) spots you and takes you out in one hit
6) at this point, you realize the same person you were attacking did the same thing to the rest of your team, which is easily crushed since they have little mind left. the 2 doctors managed to cure a few diseases before getting targeted by the whole enemy team, which were prompty re-applied.
7) your team is dead, but its ok! winning with CM is like beating a single player game with cheats, yes its easy, and i suppose its fun for a little while, but no matter how you twist it you'll never be anything but an opportunist
Whatnot wrote:
The bottom line is yes, it is ridiculous that anyone who want's to PvP has to "pick up" 90+ skill points worth of doctor or have their own personal doctor at their side since one doctor can't heal fast enough to cover even a small group of 2 or 3.