Combat Medic Archive

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Tranced wrote:


2) giving combat medics more cures (in effect making them the total medic for combat) is essentially giving one class the absolute best healing abilities along with the ability to have the best dps. also, if everything was given to combat medics instead of docs than the doctor professon would become nothing less than an alt character, simply somebody who buffs. the devs have stated multiple times that they dont want this to happen.

That's pretty much what docs are. People complain about combat medics not healing...well b/c of doctor's buffing abilities, combat medics have nothing TO heal. As far as the "highest dps"...see below.

3) see above -- also note that doctors dont have any offensive skills. all you have to get in order to have the highest dot in the game is ONE tree in marksman. now if doctors got to throw poisons as well than this would be a valid argument, but stating that combat medics dont have as many abilities as doctors is in no way fair.

I'm really interested to know how you calculate a poison as the highest dot in the game. A well-made poison on my server has approximately a 322 effectiveness. A master CM makes that tick at 644 every 10 seconds. That gives an amazing 64.4 dps....

Granted, the commando's dot is not as universally widespread as it was, but against a heat-vulnerable player or mob, it is *slightly* more powerful than 64.4 dps. A Rifleman's bleed can tick for more than 600...I've seen bleeds as high as 2000 points from a simple mindshot2 with a very nice T21. That is a 200 dps (10-second tick if I"m not mistaken). Even a spider-venomed poison can't match up to a 2000 point bleed. The thing that you REALLY are complaining about is that it's universally applied, whereas other professions must actually *gasp*, take resists and armor into consideration, and change their weapons accordingly.

Doctor Abilities-- /healenhance, /revive, /curedisease, /curepoison, /applyfireblanket, /healdamage, /healwound
CM Abilities-- /healdamage, /healwound, /applypoison, /applydisease, /healmind

Granted, CMs have a wider variety of poisons and diseases than doctors have cures...but that's b/c the doctor's Cure Disease packs can cure all of the 54 various disease packs that CMs can throw. And his Cure Poison packs can cure all of the 18 different poisons that CMs can throw. Effectively nullifying 72 of the Combat Medic's supplies with just two....

Just food for thought.

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Tranced wrote:

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Brainplay wrote:

Answer me this:

1) How can you justify the granting of a ranged ability to a non ranged class in order to counter 2 actions (poison/disease) and nothing else.

2) Why cannot a limited ranged cure ability be given to CM's considering they are master field medics and would allow more than 1 class to be able to counter this ability.

3) Why are the devs granting more combat counters to a non-combat medical class that uses fewer player points and has way far more combat medical "support" potential than one specifically named as such. (i.e. cure states, poisons, disease, fire, resucitate)

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1) im not really going to argue with you on this, because unless youre a doctor and pvp in congested (and heavily lagged) areas you dont know how much this is needed.

2) giving combat medics more cures (in effect making them the total medic for combat) is essentially giving one class the absolute best healing abilities along with the ability to have the best dps. also, if everything was given to combat medics instead of docs than the doctor professon would become nothing less than an alt character, simply somebody who buffs. the devs have stated multiple times that they dont want this to happen.

3) see above -- also note that doctors dont have any offensive skills. all you have to get in order to have the highest dot in the game is ONE tree in marksman. now if doctors got to throw poisons as well than this would be a valid argument, but stating that combat medics dont have as many abilities as doctors is in no way fair.

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1) I know exactly how much it is needed. Remember I cant cure poisons thrown on me either and in base attack/defense there is always a CM present. My point was tailored to why CM's shouldn't be given this area cure.

2) Ok so make it a limited ability. Cure A's cant fully cure a 600+ per tick poison but they sure as heck lower the dps. I have absolutely no idea where you got the idea that we do the best dps in the game. Doctors are the ONLY profession who can cure poison, disease, and fire. If CM's just got a limited cure poison doctors could still cure the others PLUS still be able to cure states (something doctors frequently overlook).

3) CM's get no defenses at all either. Nor do we buff, cure anything, revive, or even make the best components for our own stims. Instead being self sufficient we get mediocre ranged and area stims that are frequently not needed thanks to doctor buffs and poisons, of which out of the 6 only 2 are valuable in both PvP. Lets not forget how worthless the diseases can be if not for the triple incap bug.

Lets face it, doctors have waaaaay more abilities on and off the battlefield. Having another class share one of their abilities but at a lower level doesn't seem too harsh does it? Check out how many poison, disease, fire DoT cdef weapons there are for sale on your server. Every combat profession has the same ability as CM's poison or disease but in a limited fashion.

1. make havla not work for poisons and diseases

I Don't think this is so much of an issue as fixing the overal balance of poisons in the game. Particularly mind poisons. I also think the simple solution would be to allow CM's to throw area cures. Who is going to understand the workings of poisons and how to combat them better than those that study them and creat them. If you can't understand this logic then please don't bother to read the rest the post as it would all be above your head.

2. increase the timer between throwing

I Think this has been pretty well established as a very bad idea. It already takes CM's way too long to toss anything. We not only have a delay in healing but we have a frozen animation, during which we can not move. Try adding a frozen animation to the docs every time they try to heal, or a rifleman everytime he tries to attack, or a TKA every time he KD's. We are the only profession that I'm aware of that actually has an animation that locks us until completed.

3. limit the range to 64m MAX, including aoe effects

I think this one has pretty much been universally accepted. Limit the range to 64m but leave the AOE out of it. Just like a rifleman can hit a target at 64m, but clearly hits animals past that range.
4. get rid of stacking on a single pool

I don't think you should be able to stack more than one poison and one disease on any pool. AOE and SINGLE should not stack for the same stat. We should still be able to stack a poison with a disease as those are two seperate attacks.
5. give doctors a range cure (which the devs have already stated they will do)

I think this has clearly been established as a bad idea. A ranged area cure for docs will be just as unbalanced as the stacking of poisons is currently. At that point why not just eleminate the CM class altogether as they would be totally useless. However if you put this same skill under the CM tree then it allows a dual purpose for CM's. And if a CM is having to heal poisons/diseases then he clearly can not be tossing them as well.

I also would like you to keep in mind that CM takes a significant amount of skill points to achieve and has very little usefull skills beyond area stims, and poisons/diseases. If you intend to "NERF" the CM and/or decrease either their power or their speed (not including exploits such as stacking) then I also think that you should remove the no incap by poisons as this is our only true means of defense when attacked. Yet we can poison you all we want and you will not die/incap. This clearly is very hurtfull for a profession that requires as many skill points as CM. If you in any way nerf the poisons as they currently are then we should regain our ability to incap by use of poisons.

These are my opinions and you are welcome to disagree with them if you like, frankly I don't care what you think. I play for me to have fun not you . If your so concerned about your profession then maybe you need to be calling for poison resistance or something instead of saying we are simply too powerful cause you can't beat us when you think you should. there is no other single combat profession in which you can not actually incap a player. Not to mention for the most part CM's are nearly useless in PvE unless it's an elder or krayt dragon or some other NPC that has medium-heavy armor/high resisit/300k HAM's. With my swordsman or my rifleman I was easily outdamaging a CM. Being able to do 9k damage in a single hit on a MOB is pretty insane, especially compared to the measly 1k damage every 10 seconds i can do with a CM providing I'm using very high end poisons with very good spider venoms.

QOUTE

" With my swordsman or my rifleman I was easily outdamaging a CM. Being able to do 9k damage in a single hit on a MOB is pretty insane, especially compared to the measly 1k damage every 10 seconds i can do with a CM providing I'm using very high end poisons with very good spider venoms"

I dont think the general complaint revolves around PvE environments were most creatures get hit for fulldamgage beyond thier inherent resists and dont have mitigation, but rather in PvP were the CM poison/disease you throw are NOT mitigated and tick for FULL value. Your swordsman/rifleman doing 9k damage in one hit is insane save for the fact in PvP that your targets will not be hit that hard with foods, armor and damage mitigation.

/salute

Runtiss Kneebreaker

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Svenskiller wrote:

Ok. First, anyone who does not think combat medics are overpowered is just lying. Plain and simple. I understand that it must be fun to run around as the god of the pvp battlefield, but for the rest of us it sucks. I had to totally remake my template to get doctor 4030 just to be able to pvp. Yes Sony screwed up by making only one class in the game able to cure poisons and diseases. Thats why many of the CM community are asking for any form of area cure or mitigation that WE can apply.

Since when is it logical that a thrown weapon can go farther thena rifle can shoot? Combat medics must work out. A lot. Check them all for steriods. They've already stated that this will be fixed and capped at 64m. I expect it to happen at the combat revamp.

Stacking areas and singles on the same bar is the stupidest thing I have ever heard of. Dont try to defend it. Just shut up and let the nerf take you. Can you say why its so stupid? Any reason at all? They come from two different schematics and both are disposables.

The original poster had some logical suggestions. His guild regularly uses their CM's to wipe out entire groups, and he knows what he is talking about. Yes many CM's here including myself have done this. That doesn't mean the ideas posted by him or anyone else are the best ones. CM MIND poisons and diseases take advantage of an issue that really needs to be redefined and adjusted. That being the excessive vulnerability of the MIND pool. None of our other poisons can match what havoc a mind poison does even the non-advanced ones.

Sorry for the negative sound, but the CM apologists here are boiling my blood. No one is apologizing here. We want our profession to be on par with other professions but at the moment the only two advantages we have are our area MIND and single MIND poisons. Both of which can be used in PvP as effectively as any we use in PvE. We have nothing else that cant be duplicated by a novice medic.

The most misleading statement:

"I do think that we should have our animation removed...a bursting Teras Kasi at 64m can catch you before you stop throwing and take you down in5 seconds flat."

Who the heck are you kidding? I have been a TKA master forever. With decent composite, foods and drugs, you are immune from us. If we take you down in 5 seconds flat, its only to let you get back up and drop a couple of poisons and diseases on us. The knockdown/dizzy is VERY temporary, and we cant do enough damage to you while you are down to be a threat. My job in pvp is to KD/dizzy everyone I can while I am hoping that the rest of the group can actually kill you. That still makes riflemen and CM's the kings of pvp. You're hashing on a major game problem here and that is mentioned above. The vulnerability of the MIND needs to be addressed and nerf crying here isn't going to help. You also forgot to mention swordsmen and TKs in that last statement.

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Svenskiller wrote:

The original poster had some logical suggestions. His guild regularly uses their CM's to wipe out entire groups, and he knows what he is talking about.

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Having CMs in your guild go out and regularly own other players does not make you an expert on CM issues. The original poster left out alot of stuff which regularly feeds the nerf herders like yourself. I'm sure anyone that agrees with your point of view will always know what they are talking about.

Message Edited by Gnuut on 06-19-2004 04:18 AM