Combat Medic Archive
Thread: If you want 75% reduction, you should look at these numbers (long post)
SonVegeta wrote:
Most of the medics I go against tick mind at 500+ a tick. Seeing how I have 1000 mind points without a buff it takes 2 ticks to take me to 1 point. This is not fair in my opinion. Currently PVP is nothing but CM spam. Rarely do you actually fight it out with someone. There is always a CM that lobs poisons and hits everyone in the group or just you alone. You have a short time to last unless your a doc. They need to give players a defense against such attacks. Armor is our defense vs every other attack in the game. Currently there is no way to defend against poisons or disease unless you are a doc. And then you have to take the disease/poison and then heal it. Poison food does not work and neither does clothing. Currently CM's have the ability to attack without a chance to resist at all. Composite armor can protect against everything else. All other combat classes have to deal with that protection. Heck they even made fire blankets to nerf commandos even more. Yet combat medics still have the ability to tick out 500 points on you every tick. Not to mention some nasty stuff made with looted items. PVP is in a very poor state. One of the reasons is the combat medic. I just finished a massive battle on our server last night. It was nothing but a CM's battle and docs healing fest. There was little if any real combat. All it was is one side poison the other then back again.. Very boring and not much fun.
Most CMs agree that some other defenses and or more counters to poison/disease need to be worked in. However no one has come up with a good solution that makes everyone happy. We all know what the problem is and we all know a few ways to fix it. But the problem is not the fix but what we will invariably break when we apply the fix.
- If AE cures are implemented then poison/disease will be negated too easily by a class that spends much less in points than we do.
- If AE cures are implemented then CMs feel this would rob us of one of our core abilities.
- If damage is reduced then our attacks will be easily regenerated.
- If cures are lowered in skill to be used by medics this would lower the value of a doctor.
- If range is reduced then that would leave us even more vulnerable to the 4 second immobility.
- If AEs are limited to X number of players then there is no incentive to increase this stat. It degrades the value of CM meds.
- If poison and disease in combination don't incap then we as a combat class are left with little options to incap a player.
- If more ways to resist poison/disease are put into the game it will become easier to shrug off our most devastating (and expensive) attacks. A dependance on a CM (components, application etc) is needed to balance this out.
I was in a major battle just 2 days ago that ran for almost 4 hours outside AH. There were CMs tossing left and right on both sides and we still kept going for a long time. Why? Both sides came prepared.
A lack of preparation on your part does not merit a nerf on our part.
Our battle lasted along time too. But there was no fun in it. Each side poisoned the other and each side doctors cured the poisons when they could. It went back and forth forever and was really boring. Also to the poster... When I am in combat I am not sitting regening mind when I am being attacked. Also, armor has encum that lowers regen. Your test to me seem very bias and not a real combat test. Throw in someone shooting at you and you trying to use specials and fight back while the poison ticks and then you will have a true test of poisons. Personally I dont think a Combat Medic should be as powerful as they are. After all they are medics. I can understand all the ranged healing ability. However, I do not understand why SWG gave them the ability to poison and disease. A doctor invest the same points but they are not offensive. Thus I feel a combat medic should not be such an offensive powerhouse. Sure its going to be hard to fix but having PVP'ed for awhile its nothing more than a Combat Medic fest. And add any profession that targets mind in the mix and thats PVP.
If I am fighting 1 on 1 with a cm I can take him out before I tick out by taking a muon or something. However, put 1 other guy in the mix and I have no chance. Even if that other guy is not even strong. All he has to be is buffed. I will not be able to bring him down using my specials before the poison ticks me out.
I can take a CM out 1 on 1 but if there is just one Tef'r or group overt I am history. I cannot take down two buffed people before the poison/disease ticks me down to 1. And my specials depend on mind. I can prob count on my hand how many times I faught 1 CM without a Tef Imp or Grouped Overt.
Message Edited by SonVegeta on 03-28-2004 08:21 PM
I'm a Rifleman with a nice damage sliced, powered up 400 max damage Jawa and I score a good hit on you for 300 points of damage. Now this is first mitigated by your effectiveness sliced 50% stun PSG(not too costly, even considering the rate they wear out at)taking it down to 150 damage, next comes 39% stun armor(You can get this for 2-3 million on Chilastra easily, well within most serious PvPers means) bringing it down to 91 damage. Then comes BE enhanced synthsteak at 40% damage reduction taking it down to a whoping 54 damage/shot. You have 1100 base mind with two BE brandies for a total of +900 and moun for another +500 totaling 2500 mind. With 2,500 mind it takes a total of 46 shots to incap you assuming you regenerate no mind at all with your greatly enhanced substats. Assume you got a dancer buff for another 1100 mind and you're up to 3,600 mind or 66 shots to incap. Also keep in mind the rifleman must be in range to attack and maintain LOS to incap you. Even with some BE snow cake at +40-45 accuracy it is very unlikely I'll hit you with 100% accuracy.
MasterLogan wrote:
"Well guess what...during those 5 seconds, your target can easily close from 80mto 55m. If he is a rifleman, you're history, because he'll turn your head into goo in 5 seconds. If he is a carbineer, you're history, because he'll KD you, and proceed to grind you into a bloody pulp with crippling shots or burst shots. If he is a doctor, he'll just heal himself and laugh at you. CM? Well, then you'll get a taste of your own medicine."
I think you will find in high level PvP it takes a hell of a lot longer than 5 seconds for a rifleman to take you down. Lets do a little math shall we?
I'm a Rifleman with a nice damage sliced, powered up 400 max damage Jawa and I score a good hit on you for 300 points of damage. Now this is first mitigated by your effectiveness sliced 50% stun PSG(not too costly, even considering the rate they wear out at)taking it down to 150 damage, next comes 39% stun armor(You can get this for 2-3 million on Chilastra easily, well within most serious PvPers means) bringing it down to 91 damage. Then comes BE enhanced synthsteak at 40% damage reduction taking it down to a whoping 54 damage/shot. You have 1100 base mind with two BE brandies for a total of +900 and moun for another +500 totaling 2500 mind. With 2,500 mind it takes a total of 46 shots to incap you assuming you regenerate no mind at all with your greatly enhanced substats. Assume you got a dancer buff for another 1100 mind and you're up to 3,600 mind or 66 shots to incap. Also keep in mind the rifleman must be in range to attack and maintain LOS to incap you. Even with some BE snow cake at +40-45 accuracy it is very unlikely I'll hit you with 100% accuracy.
Obviously there is a serious balance issue with food, armor and PSGs in PvP.
I think their overall effektiveness should be reduced by say... 75%?
Would that make you happy?
*deeply bows* I deeply admire your will to fight a good fight. Atleast you can hope that the people who really decide what goes into the game and what not will read and understand your post (unlike the growing popultation of nerfherders).
@Topic
One thing I cannot understand is: How the DEV's were able to pitch the player base against each other! Here on the bords we are more fighting against eachother than trying to fight the real problems! Right now I argee: The simplest move would be a 75% reduktion. Simple but devastating. It would destroy the CM profession. But that doesn't solve the problem! It only pushes it back untill someone finds a new way to have an advantage, whlie leaving the CM' profession back in ashes (no pun intended towards commandos.. though it does fit
).As long as the Combat revamp has not been established there is no hope something will work right! The devs left so many lose ends you would need an entire staff just to count them. And if we as a player base don't start working together on this matter the DEV's will never listen to us.
MasterLogan wrote:
Lets see,a really nice crippling shot for 700 damage against a 50% PSG becomes 350, 90% composite reduces it to 35, then synthsteak at 40% reduction reduces it to 21 points of damage.
Hell yea they're out of whack!
If the situation is really that bad, I wonder why anyone would bother to PvP? To me it seems obvious that the devs were not thinking when they put the 75% reduction in place and then left armor and food to soak up all the damage. Besides, you forgot to take flameout.
MasterLogan wrote:
And keep in mind, CMs aren't all about damage. You seem to be forgetting the entire healing aspect of the Combat Medic.
CMs arent all about damage that's true. But the primary focus of a CM is to do damage, the secondary focus is to heal. This is evidenced by the 8:1 ratio of Offensive Medicine schematics to Defensive Medicine schematics in our crafting tree.
Add in the fact that we can actually only heal 5 out of 13 types of combat damage and you can understand healing is our secondary focus.