Chef Archive

Thread: Combat Professions: Express Your Opinions Here.

Jerecki
Thu Jan 29, 2004 6:54 am
#53






Nikii_Nightstrider wrote:

When I start getting random tells from people..."what did you pick up chef to make a quick buck?" Im rather disgustedto realize that a very large part (outnumbering people who chef because they like it) of the current chef population picked up chef as a way to get rich quick either on the current menu or because they think the new menu is going to take off so well. If your only reason to be a chef is get rich quick then just sit back and enjoy ride and let the folks that actually *care* about this profession not credits deal with it.





This sounds like a little bit of hypocracy. You keep mentioning that you don't like this patch because you can't sell any of the new stuff because it sucks. If you are concerned about the fun factor and creativity of the profession, this revamp would be WONDERFUL!



--------------------------------------------------------------
Letting non-PvPers kill factioned NPC's without consequences will prove disasterous! Report immediately to the JTLS forums and express your opinion! Six or Seven people are deciding the future of the expansion, let your opinion be heard!
DashZero
Thu Jan 29, 2004 6:59 am
#54

Ha! to make it more confusing...my ingame name is Nikkii. It used to be spelled theway it shows on the board but back when emails were breaking due to overflowing mine got fubarred and I had to recreate my character to fix it. The CSRs didnt want me to reuse my name as they were worried the mailbox would still be broken...so now I have 2 Nikkii names *laugh*



Nikkii Nightstrider - Eat, Drink and Be Merry!
Eat at Nikkii's - Fine Foods and Fashions
Nabubu (-1400, -4030)
Coronet (524,-5244)
DashZero
Thu Jan 29, 2004 7:11 am
#55






Jerecki wrote:


This sounds like a little bit of hypocracy. You keep mentioning that you don't like this patch because you can't sell any of the new stuff because it sucks. If you are concerned about the fun factor and creativity of the profession, this revamp would be WONDERFUL!






Actually 3 weeks ago I was excited about this patch. I was here telling people not to complain until they saw it. Well, Ive seen it now and Im not impressed. I think most of the numbers are lower than they should be. If the numbers are right, the fillings or the usesseem wrong. Once again the just because you think this patch is WONDERFUL! doesnt make it so for everyone. All 5 of you chefs cheering this patch over and over dont seem to get that. It is not *factual* that this patch is wonderful. That is your opinion and the last I checked Im still entitled to my own opinion and Im pretty sure that it doesnt have to meet your approval to be a valid opinion.


I am concerned about chef from the fun factor as well as it being a viable profession.Personally,the idea of being useful than I am now doesnt really sound WONDERFUL! to me. The only hypocrisy around here is you saying that people shouldnt use buffs to kill stuff they shouldnt be able to kill like can now with our buffs because we are "overpowered" and the devs are right in nerfing usand inother threadssaying this patch isnt a nerf and the combat folks should be happy about the revamp. You speak out of both sides of your mouth depending on what purpose you want to serve at that point in time.



Nikkii Nightstrider - Eat, Drink and Be Merry!
Eat at Nikkii's - Fine Foods and Fashions
Nabubu (-1400, -4030)
Coronet (524,-5244)
DashZero
Thu Jan 29, 2004 7:13 am
#56






Nikii_Nightstrider wrote:


Personally,the idea of being useful than I am now doesnt really sound WONDERFUL! to me.




That was supposed to read, the idea of being LESS useful....



Nikkii Nightstrider - Eat, Drink and Be Merry!
Eat at Nikkii's - Fine Foods and Fashions
Nabubu (-1400, -4030)
Coronet (524,-5244)
DashZero
Thu Jan 29, 2004 7:45 am
#57

Most of those were experimented...no the best ingredients werent used. But honestly coming from someone who is a chef. Unless those ingredients were all like 1,1,1,1 better ingredients are not gonna double the outcome. Yea BE components do make a big difference. But thats a whole nother ball of wax thats been hashed out about 10 times and I really dont feel like doing it again, you can feel free to read about it in lots of threads here.


Coming from someone who has never used food, I cantcomprehend why you would think the new foods are better than the old. Thats like saying apple pie is better than cherry pie when youve never had either but ate acherryfrom a treeonce. Thank you for accepting that I am allowed to have an opinion different than your own and respecting that.



Nikkii Nightstrider - Eat, Drink and Be Merry!
Eat at Nikkii's - Fine Foods and Fashions
Nabubu (-1400, -4030)
Coronet (524,-5244)
Envoy3113
Thu Jan 29, 2004 8:10 am
#58

Hehe, caught this one.



Nikii, me naught talk from both sides of me mouth. I am a gimped profession, which after 'nerfing' the current availible buff system will find myself on a more even feild with other characters. So therefor I accept the changes that are happening and embrace them, this way I won't find myself apt to leave a profession that I ultimately enjoy, simply because what I see in my combat spam is horrendous when compared to other professions which have spent half the time attempting to develop that character. Thus, as a combat oriented player I see these benifiting not only full time soldiers, but those that pull out a blaster to let off steam and to defend themselves. The applications cover a broad spectrum, with the BE enchancements issues such as filling, and buff potency can be modified and this has only seen a fraction of the testing that would be required for the end results.


I do see the new menu as a daunting task givin the availiblity of resources needed, thus I do belive there will be a need to corner a particular market. It will be a tough transistion. For everyone, I do feel bad for the combat professions that are 'not so broken' in that they have come to accept this, jumped on said bandwagon and rode it till the wheels fell off. Which is whats happening, the wheels are coming off.


Is it tough to find a musician buff? You bet, is it tough to acctually retain a musician title with all the holo-grinders out there? Hell yes, I wouldn't want to try and play a proff out with the mess that most cantina's have evolved into. Hence the change in the FSCS requirements!


It will fall into place eventually, it won't be the same market, not even anything that potentially resembles your old market. But this is where the innovative will shine.


Good luck Chefs on getting your share of the market place.





There comes a time in every mans life when 86 years is just too damn long...
FoxWanderer
Thu Jan 29, 2004 8:44 am
#59






My alt is a Trandoshan Commando/CH and I can't wait to get some of these new buffs!
For starters, hitting the target with your first shot makes combat short and sweet, missing more than 3 times usually results in a trip to the cloning center, so accuracy is your friend.
With that in mind, I'll buy and use the following (just the way they are, but even more if good resources enhance the buffs):

Useful GeneralCombat Items:

Citros Snow Cake: Increase attack accuracy +19 for 20m Filling 26
Crispic: Attack Accuracy +13 for 11m 24s Filling 16
Felbar: Mind +819 for 36m (Pets only) Filling 22
Karkan Ribenes: Enhances Trandoshan Regeneration 72% Filling 21
Synthsteak: Reduce damage taken from attacks 23% for 30 attacks Filling 26
Aitha: Mind Healing 135 Filling 16
Blue Milk: Mind Healing 356 Filling 32
Caf: Willpower +46 for 40m48s Filling 15
Gralinyn Juice: Creature To-Hit Bonus +10 for 14m48s Filling 27
Exo-Protein Wafers: Reduces damage taken from attacks 12% for 15 attacks Filling 5
Vasarian Brandy: Mind, focus, willpower +136 for 33m30s Filling 41


Those are just general combat goodies that I'd always want on me and would use regularly, just as they are.
I especially like that foods (Felbar) heal my pet's mind, and drinks (Blue Milk, Aitha) heal mine. It'll be easier to leave room in each for emergencies, and I don't have to choose between us in the middle of combat.


Useful Special Situation Items:
Food/Hide/Bone Harvesting
Veghash: Creature Harvesting +14.55 for 11m 25s Filling 16
This would be a godsend. I hate that I can't be a ranger and a commando/ch, but this helps bridge that gap a little.

Taming:
Almond-Kweevu: +8.7 Taming for 16m Filling 22


PvP:
Flameout: Reduces Damage taken from 4 attacks 74% Filling 93
Chor-nor-hoola: Increase Disease and poison resistance 12% for 26m 20s Filling 17
Blood Chowder: Increased resistance to Bleed 14% for 22m20s Filling 16
Corellian Brandy: Defense Vs. Knockdown +9.1 for 13m24s Filling 15

Note: The other special situation defenses are probably going to find their niche usefulness as well, I just don't know which will be particularly important at the moment.


Krayt Hunts:
Cavaellin Creams: Reduces incap Recovery time 53% Filling 39
On Krayt hunts, there are usually so many people there that the krayts have time to incap, but not DB. I'd definitely like to be back in the fight in half the time.


NiceIdeas that don't pack enough punch:

Garrmorl: Health, Strength, Constitution +127 for 37m Filling 42
Vagnerian Canape: Focus and Willpower +470 for 3m42s Filling 81
Kiwik Clusjo Swirl: Quickness and Stamina +465 for 3m36s Filling 81
Ormachek: Increases XP 4% for 15 grants Filling 81
Wonderful idea, but when I can use other buffs in that stomach space to kill things much more than 4% faster, it's not enough. My crafter will use this for grinding, though, because every little bit helps.
Thakitillo: Defense Vs Knockdown +36 for 10m48s Filling 77
Vercupti of Agazza Boleruuee: Health, Action, Mind +1440 for 13m3s (Pet only) Filling 93
Won Won: Strength and Con +505 for 3m 45s Filling 83
Breath of Heaven: Strength, Quickness, focus +246 for 11m15s Filling 25 (This maystill viable for others, but as a commando/ch, it just isn't worth it to me)


There are a lot more items that would be useful, but I don't know how useful at this point.



Aurin Huntsbridge
Chef/Artisan/Surveyor
(Still a Ranger at heart)
Killonious
Thu Jan 29, 2004 9:03 am
#60

I think that the chef revamp should be held off until combat changes have been made and finalized. Then gear the chef profession around the new comat system.




Pabst Blue
Master Tailor - Master Merchant - Master Chef

Legacy Store (Location -3928,4043) 900m East of Theed's Spaceport
Clothing, Armor, Spices, Furniture, Deeds and More

DashZero
Thu Jan 29, 2004 9:14 am
#61






Envoy3113 wrote:

Hehe, caught this one.









I wasnt talking to you but Jerecki. Thank you for your elaborating on your point of view. I can see your position now, tho it still rings of nerf it does point out possible advantages...Altho honestly if Im not sure that will really make a big difference since everyone will still have the same buffs available to each other...just like everyone has the same buffs available now. It sounds more like if you are a gimped class, your class needs to be fixed. Whyis nerfing everyone else to your level better than just fixing your class?



Nikkii Nightstrider - Eat, Drink and Be Merry!
Eat at Nikkii's - Fine Foods and Fashions
Nabubu (-1400, -4030)
Coronet (524,-5244)
Envoy3113
Thu Jan 29, 2004 10:00 am
#62

Well that goes back to the difficulty levels of the high end content. Compared to other classes in group PvE or PvP, I am gimped. If I were to take the engagement rules from just about anyother game out there and apply them here, I would be, in a solo situation, on par. Where as, white con is a fairly even fight, yellow would mean death save for some incredible luck and or tactics, red is my arse sent back home in a bag.


Not to say there are not individual problems that need fixing for each class out there, but this will help balance the game from profession to environment. And I really don't think it will be as much as a negative step as some forsee. It will be a technical step back for combat proffessions, it will be more dangerous to engage in combat with dangerous MOBs. However I think we'll overcome it quickly and we will find that the right chefs will be making the right products with the right BE's and we will have a high class of food stuff rotating out in the market place which will be on par with what we got now, if not readily accessable or easily useable.


The individual classes are getting attention, slowly but surely. Pikemen for instance are acctually getting better accuracy on their weapons, which has only been called for seince launch just about.


I'll try to cover my veiw in a more legible manner again.


I'll use just meele in my example. Theory would have it that each class is supposed to be able to stand out in one form or another. Based off initial design, and discription you could assume the following.


TK: Fast attack rate, low damage, high state change, low AP, low HAM


Fencer: Fast attack rate, med damage, bleed, low AP, med HAM


Swordsman: Med attack rate, high damage, mind specific attacks and bleeds, high AP, High HAM


Pikeman: Slow attack rate, poor acc, high damage, bleeds, state change, high AP, high HAM



Problems: On all classes with the exeption of TK (still a lil, but not as much) Damage mitigation destroys the practicality of most normal attacks. ie high min-max dmg.


Swordsmen and Pikemen are the most affected by the removal of Fishack. Fencers and TK have high enough def mods imo to out last the two latter. With a buffed TK or Fencer what you have is a high speed attacker who now has no worrys about spamming their moderately (HAM'd) specials, thus they can attack all day long with their most powerfull moves at a good rate.

We now introduce the latter two, buffed the same. Swordsmen have a high survivability, however it hurts alot more to use their specials. The HAM costs are extensive, not to mention their defense isn't quite as good so on goes the armor and now HAM costs are more apparent. The swordsman knows to keep up with the TK who is spamming spinning rawl, he needs to get some major hits it. So he starts spamming his specials, but he won't last nearly as long. He still see's he is nowhere near the DPS range and now even with the buffs his mind is completely shot. Pop the muon, now the swordsman's longevity is increased to the point he has to compensate for his downer later. Take a pikeman into the scenario and toss in the same problems as the swordman, only lower def mods, lower accuracy and the inability to hit that ohh so lovely mind pool.


Now if the situation were played out with out buffs, the TK would be more cautious in expending his special moves, he would still be a top contender due to meditation, but the output would eventually slow down.

The swordsman and pike would know the speed of the fight has been considerably stepped back and can rely on a paced, auto-attack vs. special usage which would be more in pace with the TK who can no longer rely on spamming their most powerfull attack over the course of the fight.


This would lead to a better timing out of buffs, and more equality of damage and tanking responsibility between individual meele classes. Thus when the TK has expended their buffs, and they dare not eat another thing in the event of emergency consumption, another meele can fill that role.


As it stands, the capability of the quicker meele's is increased substantially by the ability to buff, and maintain a high buff over a time set only by the amount of materials they have. Granted everyone else has this ability, but when a class can spam off a special just about at their speed cap, and not worrynearly as much aboutHAM costs you have an imbalance. Because the slower attackersHAVE to worry about their HAM costs even when buffed.


Now this is how I see based off my observations. Based off the fights I've been in and what I see during those fights. I have never played any other advanced meele template other than Pike, but I have payed attention to the other meeles when I was planning to develop a cross-template. So this is not to say any class is perfect, nor that specials, weapons and survivability don't need any kind of adjustments. This is how I see the issue of mind buffs affecting a portion of what is our combat balance problems.



There comes a time in every mans life when 86 years is just too damn long...
DashZero
Thu Jan 29, 2004 10:14 am
#63

Im by no means a fighting expert. My combat character is smuggler/ch. My husband is bh/ranger. I dont pvp as I found it to be nothing other than hey look someone afk *pow* theyre dead so I have never had pvp experience. The knowledge I have of it purely comes from my customers friends etc etc. From a not very "in the know" person regarding that, what you are saying seems to make sense and be a legitimate concern.


But I think that is why the combat system is being changed isnt it? Once that change takes effect, hey maybe these new buffs will be "all that". I dont know. What I do know tho is that our current buffs are being replaced with lesser buffs (stats) and while we have gained diversity, it is very questionable as to how big of a difference these mods will make. Especially when you consider they are designed for a whole different set of game rules. From the time that the chef revamp goes live until the time the combat revamp goes live, chefs will be doing the only thing chefs do..make buffs. But those buffs will not be "at home" because they will not be working with the system they were designed to work for.


After that being explained to me and assuming it is correct, that almost frustrates me even more as it appears that chef is being nerfed as a way to provide a quick fix to buy more time for the combat revamp. I firmly believe that the chef revamp needs to be tested in the system it was designed for not tossed out like a fish out of water (sorry mon cals ) to provide a bandaid to a different problem. Chefs deserve more care than being used for bandaids for other classes dont they?



Nikkii Nightstrider - Eat, Drink and Be Merry!
Eat at Nikkii's - Fine Foods and Fashions
Nabubu (-1400, -4030)
Coronet (524,-5244)
atimes
Thu Jan 29, 2004 10:59 am
#64

As a BH I don't need a buff for a long period of time. I need a intense buff to secondaries for a short period of time (a few minutes tops)


Looks to me like 4 BOH's and a muon gold is my new pre game meal.


Basically for my needs it looks like the new BOH fits the deal.


It's kinda early to tell. We'll have to see how the foods will look in theory. I'm sure that when this stuff hits live and chefs are able to get high quality components it won't be a stretch to get these current foods to double in their effectiveness. Then they'll be great.


atimes
Thu Jan 29, 2004 11:07 am
#65


Now, would you use these as they are now?


Average. Without BE enhancements and bad resources hard to tell.


How about if there was a 100-200% increase in one stat?


Would be a awesome improvement.


Which food stats are most important to you? (Buff Amount, Filling, Time of Buff,or Quantity)?

All of them except perhaps quantity.


Would you buy this food as it is now w/ no BE components or better resources if there was nothing else to be found?


both


What are the Top Ten of these foods for you?


BOH and anything else that buffs as many secondaries as possible.


Please List your Name, Server, In Game Professions, and when you started playing the game. General comments also welcome, but please try to stay on topic as much as you can.


Krylax Ogos (Kettemoor) Started playing one week after release in game profession is Bounty Hunter.
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