CUEmu - Thread Posts

jfang

Thu Jun 17, 2004 2:36 pm

Rorenikibi wrote:

Oh, don't get me wrong, ticking 700 points of damage every 8 seconds is in no way mitigated by a Novice Medic using a stim B for 250-600 points of healing.

Even a Master Medic ona Stim D is going to have a few bad rolls and keep in mind, mitigating the poison means anything else that hits you is going to stack up fast.

Like I said, still a big threat, but not an unmanageable threat.

Poisons tick every 10 seconds (as noted in the combat medic FAQ).

As a master medic (combat medic doesn't help stims), I frequently use 600 strength stims usually heal from 1000 to 2000 health and action. I know that that is in theory not possible, but I swear I have...

However, if nothing else, a novice medic using a store bought stim B can heal for 400+ easily (as that is the written strength of the medicine). Coupled with a 2000+ constitution/stamina (possibly more), it should be relatively easy for a novice medic to keep up with a health poison using only basic medicines.

And even if you do need 4040 medic to combat a poison, the argument of "should a novice be able to keep up with an elite profession" still exists...

Rorenikibi

Thu Jun 17, 2004 2:38 pm

#54

Given that the current scheme of things allows Poison packs A, B, C, and D to stack on top of each other, I think a Medic is going to be hard pressed to keep up.

And I do know they stack, Kettemoor's CMs use that scheme quite often.

Captain Janu Hull CFA-7
In the event of an emergency, this pilot's ego may be used as a floatation device.

jfang

Thu Jun 17, 2004 2:51 pm

#55

Edit: *deleted*

This post has gone on long enough about combat medics, and is starting to resemble many of the arguments posted on the combat medic forum before the troll lockdown. I can continue if you all want me to, but I expect the conversation is starting to wear as thin for everybody else as for me. Sorry to bother everybody.

I did like the conversation about carbines as compared to pistols and rifles though, if there is anything more discussible about that.

Edit:

Just FYI Rorenikibi, and anybody else still reading this, poison D's do not exist (although I personally think they would make wonderful limited use schematics). There is no real way for a non-combat medic to know this though. Also, you forgot to include "Area A, B, and C" poisons in the stacking. It is unclear if this is a bug or as designed, and the devs have given no official statement about that. (That was my favored question for the 19 answers post).

Message Edited by jfang on 06-17-2004 06:16 PM

Rorenikibi

Fri Jun 18, 2004 12:01 am

#56

Given the way you state it, i don't think the paradigm is wrong, and if you disagree that a defensive combat set up is or isn't workable, that's fine. We'll follow your lead and assume it is.

What's threatening to get out of alignment are the professions. A lot of the requests being made of the Devs by these three professions stems from one profession having it good in one aspect, then wanting to be good in all of them.

Now, I'll defend Carbineers in saying we're not really being rabid about it, but we do want some serious improvements to our defenses, which are pretty pitiable, and some diversity of damage, if not an outright improvement to the ones we have. We're pretty happy withour DPS, we'd just like to find some high end content we can actually hurt.

From what I gather from Nova is that Pistoleers are looking for higher DPS and more state effects, which is an outright attack on the basic paradigm that one profession gets one part of the triad to be the best at, then some capability elsewhere. I don't really blame Pistoleers, as I said, great defenses to not an enemy defeat, impressive in battle though they may be.

From what I gather from the Riflemen I know, including a friend of mine named Klawlegna, the Rifleman Correspondant, is that Rifleman want more defenses and a working KD attack. That along with fighting tooth and nail to keep their speed. Really, Riflemen are sitting pretty right now with the exception of HAM costs, which are a common enemy to any combat profession, so the rumblings I've heard from them are less "I want this" and more "For the love of God, don't take this away!".

The paradigm is fine, its keeping the three ranged professions from trying to claim it all for themselves that's the trick.

Captain Janu Hull CFA-7
In the event of an emergency, this pilot's ego may be used as a floatation device.

Rorenikibi

Fri Jun 18, 2004 12:08 am

#57

novamarine wrote:

Rorenikibi wrote:

Maybe Nova could coordinate some effort between the Rifleman and Pistoleer Correspondants so we as the three mainline combat professions can sort out amongst ourselves who we think we should be and present a similar Vision thread to the Devs For each.

I'd love if this could take place but in reality, as you have mentioned,all 3 classes are now after a vision somewhat similar to what I posted recently.I find this ironicbecause our class is currently the closest to it and carbineers have long been considered one of the worst professions. When you see the 19 questions and the answers this week, you will see what I mean. We just don't see eye-to-eye on these issues and when I have tried to open dialog (yes I have tried) it gets ugly. I am not even going to say what I would really like to on this subject for fear of starting massive flame wars across multiple forums.

At this point itreally isfor the Devs, as ideally, an impartial party, to sort out based on the input from the various classes.

I wasn't aware of that, and I agree its not worth another three way war (the one with Combat Medics, Docs and Medics is more than enough) to try and duke it out.

Captain Janu Hull CFA-7
In the event of an emergency, this pilot's ego may be used as a floatation device.

novamarine

Fri Jun 18, 2004 12:08 am

#58

Rorenikibi, you have extremely good observations of what is currently going on.

Rorenikibi

Fri Jun 18, 2004 12:11 am

#59

novamarine wrote:

Rorenikibi, you have extremely good observations of what is currently going on.

I doubt I'll ever be a number cruncher, but I do well with organizing concepts and breaking out specific points of conflict.

My problem is that I'm typically a hot head, myself. I'm probably calmer posting on this board than anywhere else, of course, this also has to do with the fact that Carbineers are less brute force and fury and more thought and analysis.

Captain Janu Hull CFA-7
In the event of an emergency, this pilot's ego may be used as a floatation device.

jfang

Fri Jun 18, 2004 12:11 am

#60

novamarine wrote:

I'd love if this could take place but in reality, as you have mentioned,all 3 classes are now after a vision somewhat similar to what I posted recently.I find this ironicbecause our class is currently the closest to it and carbineers have long been considered one of the worst professions. When you see the 19 questions and the answers this week, you will see what I mean. We just don't see eye-to-eye on these issues and when I have tried to open dialog (yes I have tried) it gets ugly. I am not even going to say what I would really like to on this subject for fear of starting massive flame wars across multiple forums.

At this point itreally isfor the Devs, as ideally, an impartial party, to sort out based on the input from the various classes.

Maybe we should to a Carbineer-like thing, and flank them (read: out think them)...

"Sure, riflemen, you can have state effects. We'll take offense. I'd like a 1500-2500 AP2 damage blast gun, and a 2000-4000 AP3 cold damage gun."

Rorenikibi

Fri Jun 18, 2004 12:13 am

#61

jfang wrote:

novamarine wrote:

I'd love if this could take place but in reality, as you have mentioned,all 3 classes are now after a vision somewhat similar to what I posted recently.I find this ironicbecause our class is currently the closest to it and carbineers have long been considered one of the worst professions. When you see the 19 questions and the answers this week, you will see what I mean. We just don't see eye-to-eye on these issues and when I have tried to open dialog (yes I have tried) it gets ugly. I am not even going to say what I would really like to on this subject for fear of starting massive flame wars across multiple forums.

At this point itreally isfor the Devs, as ideally, an impartial party, to sort out based on the input from the various classes.

Maybe we should to a Carbineer-like thing, and flank them (read: out think them)...

"Sure, riflemen, you can have state effects. We'll take offense. I'd like a 1500-2500 AP2 damage blast gun, and a 2000-4000 AP3 cold damage gun."

Like hell, you'll give away our hard earned Dizzy!! LOL

Now, about that Intimidate special

Captain Janu Hull CFA-7
In the event of an emergency, this pilot's ego may be used as a floatation device.

jfang

Fri Jun 18, 2004 12:23 am

#62

I agree with what you have said, Rorenikibi. Like I mentioned earlier, "80% composite armor is ruining the game, take it all away... except for my suit of course". Everybody wants everything, and tries their best to nullify all vulnerabilities. (I'm *so* tempted to plug something for combat medics here.)

As I read your first comment on attack-defense-state, you are saying the paradigm of attack-defense-state itself is flawed, and it is more attack-state. I personally think that defense is a fine position to take in combat, although it appears that you disagree. Beyond that though, I think (which seems to agree with what you are stating) that the real cause of the problem is that everybody wants to be able to do everything, which causes the three professions to try to meld into each other rather than keeping their defining strengths (and more importantly, their weaknesses).

Incidentally, I didn't really see the arguments of carbineers being out of line with the crossing of boundaries. Carbineers are asking to be able to apply states to high end mobs, not to be able to do a lot of damage to them (although that would be nice). And I haven't really heard much about low defenses, except that counterattack isn't firing as much as it could (and even that isn't a major issue). The only real argument I have heard which would have carbineers cross boundaries would be adding new damage types, which would probably beretracted somewhat if high end mobs could be blind-stunned-dizzied-knockdowned.

TAfirehawk

Fri Jun 18, 2004 12:37 am

#63

HEHEHEHE

I love to keep the pot stirred.....

And it is funny how all the ranged profs are asking for a lot of what we have already......

BTW, we don't need any more defenses, just a working Counterattack

Message Edited by TAfirehawk on 06-17-2004 03:42 PM

Iebas Feania
Former Correspondent of the Former Profession, CARBINEER

novamarine

Fri Jun 18, 2004 12:41 am

#64

jfang wrote:

Incidentally, I didn't really see the arguments of carbineers being out of line with the crossing of boundaries. Carbineers are asking to be able to apply states to high end mobs, not to be able to do a lot of damage to them (although that would be nice). And I haven't really heard much about low defenses, except that counterattack isn't firing as much as it could (and even that isn't a major issue). The only real argument I have heard which would have carbineers cross boundaries would be adding new damage types, which would probably beretracted somewhat if high end mobs could be blind-stunned-dizzied-knockdowned.

I'll plug to carbineer community here...

It is important to remember this profession does not attract the uber, kill'em all, I want my "I win" button- types and that is readily reflected in the desires of this community. This community really wants balance. They want a balanced and playable Carbineer but they equally want a balanced Rifleman and Pistoleer. Unfortunately, because of the powertrip some professions have been riding for the past months, I am not sure those communities can say the same about themselves.

Rorenikibi

Fri Jun 18, 2004 12:48 am

#65

TAfirehawk wrote:

HEHEHEHE

I love to keep the pot stirred.....

And it is funny how all the ranged profs are asking for a lot of what we have already......

BTW, we don't need any more defenses, just a working Counterattack

Message Edited by TAfirehawk on 06-17-2004 03:42 PM

Wouldn't a working version of a currently broken defense qualify as more defenses?

/flee

And my own opinion would include a little more Ranged defense and a spot of Melee defense. We are close assault troopers.

Captain Janu Hull CFA-7
In the event of an emergency, this pilot's ego may be used as a floatation device.

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