Carbineer Archive
Thread: Regarding the new CU carbines..
Antehiem
Sun Apr 03, 2005 5:21 pm
#40
Bonestrand wrote:
Ndrene wrote:
here is a simple answer, can you me a sniper in the military and still know how to work a bolt action rifle?
just becaause someone is a master of something doesnt mean they know how to work every weapon of that type. a squadleader might be more effeciant with a weapon then carbineer.
Minor point. Most snipers are trained on a bolt action rifle. After being fully trained on an issue gun. The the sniper/spotter trade roles and weapons with the spotter generally having an issue varient for support.
This example has no bearing.
I think there is a huge trap re: comparing the "Carbineer" professions to anything IRL, the Carbineer as a military specialty went out shortly after Napoleons era to be replaced with the Dragoon or Mounted infantry.
A carbine is a type of weapon. Nothing more. Carbines are routinely issued to all branches. Generally its nothing more than a short varient of the standard issue rifle.
I think we got labeled carbineers simply because, well, what we are, Assault Riflemen using Assault Rifles is pretty politically incorrect.
Cross certing is a good compromise where certain individuals would have access to "Carbines" as a defense weapon yet still allow a "Carbineer" to use it.
Will it happen? Who knows. On one hand I want every carb in game.. on the other, I look at the SL profession and realize they crave something visibly "Unique" to thier prof. You know, you see a Scatter and go, BH huh? Same will go for other profs.
Message Edited by Ndrene on 04-03-2005 04:01 PM
that is not what matters, people who say I am a master carbineer and expect every carbine to be theirs are narrow minded and selfish, what about proffs who have had nothing their own since the game came out and finaly get something, but what does everyone do flame them for haveing it and try to take it away.
[laughs] If this is aimed at me, then please re-read my posts. Inever said take anything away,I just said multi-cert certain weapons. Also, I can't comment on real life weapons, it ain't my thing, but for a game, forgive me for thinking a 'carbine' in game mechanics terms should beusable by a 'carbineer'. I just assumed proffession name had more bearing in the game, but this is just my viewpoint, obviously, and clearly not shared by everyone.
I don't expect anything to change, but I raised the point I wanted to make, and it wasn't done from a selfish or narrowminded standpoint, though you only have my word for that. We'll see what the CU finally brings.
JuggernautRM
Sun Apr 03, 2005 5:25 pm
#41
Theres a problem with multi-certing. The devs at this moment are weighting a weapons power on where it is certed at a profession, for example, a weapon certed at Master Carbineer will be more powerful than a weapon certed at novice carbineer. If you bring in multicerting, than some of the certs have to be rearranged all around just to have a sense of balance.
Antehiem
Sun Apr 03, 2005 5:29 pm
#42
Good thinking. Though I did think they wanted to avoid the case of the 'best' weapon.
JuggernautRM wrote:
Theres a problem with multi-certing. The devs at this moment are weighting a weapons power on where it is certed at a profession, for example, a weapon certed at Master Carbineer will be more powerful than a weapon certed at novice carbineer. If you bring in multicerting, than some of the certs have to be rearranged all around just to have a sense of balance.
TAfirehawk
Sun Apr 03, 2005 7:23 pm
#43
oiller wrote:
Lol ah TA hum... unless i realy goofed my numbers and yours doesn't work. As of last night there are 15 carbines in the cu beta those are all off the frog. But here is the kicker there are only 8 weapon certs in brawler carbine and in Carbiner. so by my math that means there are 7 not 6 not in carbiner. I didn't go looking for them in the other professions didn'tknow they were there. Just wanted to point this fact out to you.
Oh I love this.....did you bother to find the Loot Carbine Certs? Bet not.....
There are 6 new Carbines in the CU......
NivekAsh
Sun Apr 03, 2005 10:23 pm
#44
oiller wrote:
Lol ah TA hum... unless i realy goofed my numbers and yours doesn't work. As of last night there are 15 carbines in the cu beta those are all off the frog. But here is the kicker there are only 8 weapon certs in brawler carbine and in Carbiner. so by my math that means there are 7 not 6 not in carbiner. I didn't go looking for them in the other professions didn'tknow they were there. Just wanted to point this fact out to you.
1)N. Marksman: CDEF. 2)Carbines 2: DH17. 3)Carbines 3: DH17 Snubnose 4) Carbines 4: E11. 5)N. Carbineer: EE3. 6) Assault Tactics 3: DXR6. 7) Marksmanship 4: Slugthrower. 8)Abilities 1: Laser. 9) M. Carbineer: Elite
Plus 1)Alliance Needler. 2) Bothan Bola. 3) Czerka Dart(BH Carbines 4). 4) E5(SL Leadership 5) Geonosian Carbine. 6) Proton
It's easy to sit down and count how many different names there are without paying much attention to what they are, quite another to take a moment and realize that the noob weapon from N. Marksman is included in that list, and included in a carbineers certs. Looks like you really goofed your numbers.
Darknyt13
Mon Apr 04, 2005 3:26 am
#45
I think most carbineer's biggest concern is that of the new weapons, the E5 and the Proton Carbine do significantly higher damage than the highest cert'ed Carbineer weapons (Elite carbine151-301 damage, DXR6 295-590 vs.E5 393-786 damage, Proton Carbine 357-714 damage). Now i understand that these numbers have not been finalized, but the Squad Leader's Carbine does over two and a half times the max damage of the carbine certed at Master Carbineer. That's what has us worried. The DE-10 is better than the scatter pistol and just imagine the uproar if Ranger was given a weapon that did twice the damage of a T21!
weaponmaster88
Mon Apr 04, 2005 3:53 am
#46
Darknyt13 wrote:
I think most carbineer's biggest concern is that of the new weapons, the E5 and the Proton Carbine do significantly higher damage than the highest cert'ed Carbineer weapons (Elite carbine151-301 damage, DXR6 295-590 vs.E5 393-786 damage, Proton Carbine 357-714 damage). Now i understand that these numbers have not been finalized, but the Squad Leader's Carbine does over two and a half times the max damage of the carbine certed at Master Carbineer. That's what has us worried. The DE-10 is better than the scatter pistol and just imagine the uproar if Ranger was given a weapon that did twice the damage of a T21!
well actually as it stands now every pistol from the frog does more damage then all of our carbines and they are all faster.....
Masterfish
Mon Apr 04, 2005 4:05 am
#47
All these skill trees and weapons settingsare creating a huge chaos... They're just provisory, there's nothing definitive. We have to wait until they introduce elite classes befor to judge. Just take a look at SL's skill tree: skill progression requires Pistol Xp, and not Leadership Xp. Is that possible? As SL do I need to be a Pistoleer, just to grind my skills and obtain a CARBINE certification? (pistol xp for a carbine certification!?) It makes no sense...
cleekjc
Mon Apr 04, 2005 6:36 am
#48
I think the point here is that SL get the BEST carbine..................I have no issues with SL's getting a very nice carbine cert as well other very nice weapon certs but the Master lvl professions sould get THE BEST of thier respective weapons...................not SL..
Another can o worms are mele, is it really fair to give a class like SL ranged weapons that other Master Ranged professions do not all the while mele porfessions do not get shafted in the same way? I did not see a kick arse sword cert listed in the SL tree.........................
Quandry
Mon Apr 04, 2005 9:09 am
#49
We just need a couple more carbines to get us closer to the variaty of the pistoleer and the riflemen.
The sl has that carbine but most of the specials he will have to choose from are pistol specials. He wont be able to put the damage modifiers behind his shots we will. i assume its the same for the others.
The problem is when it gets down to the high end carbines for a master carbineer. Taking out the low end newbie weapons we only have a couple to choose from...And they dont seem to stack up to a couple other professions only carbines.
How bout adding another couple to carbineer.
A slower fireing high damage carbine
A high end aoe modded carbine.
A high speed high min but low max damage carbine
Perhaps both the C 12 and C 22 grenade certifications as well...seems to fit our style.
The sl has that carbine but most of the specials he will have to choose from are pistol specials. He wont be able to put the damage modifiers behind his shots we will. i assume its the same for the others.
The problem is when it gets down to the high end carbines for a master carbineer. Taking out the low end newbie weapons we only have a couple to choose from...And they dont seem to stack up to a couple other professions only carbines.
How bout adding another couple to carbineer.
A slower fireing high damage carbine
A high end aoe modded carbine.
A high speed high min but low max damage carbine
Perhaps both the C 12 and C 22 grenade certifications as well...seems to fit our style.
DrowLord
Mon Apr 04, 2005 9:14 am
#50
Sorry, didnt have time to read all of the posts. At what level are SL going to get the E5 carbine? Anyone know?
mfg177
Mon Apr 04, 2005 9:17 am
#51
Well... Though I'm a Carbineer, I can't agree with initial post 
The thing is: in Real Life (RL) same things exist. I used to work with different Special forces and Law enforcment guys - some of them being top specialist in their field, but... but there is always some gear in other profession's field. Like most of elite Special Forces had no chance to wield a gun with silent ammo (not silencer, but the cartriget, with produce no noise while being fired). Why? Because it's top secret in another division of intelligence...
The thing is: in Real Life (RL) same things exist. I used to work with different Special forces and Law enforcment guys - some of them being top specialist in their field, but... but there is always some gear in other profession's field. Like most of elite Special Forces had no chance to wield a gun with silent ammo (not silencer, but the cartriget, with produce no noise while being fired). Why? Because it's top secret in another division of intelligence...So we have in SWG: Bounty hunters have their top-sect\rets, Commandos too... While Masters of certain Arms (Carbineers, Riflemans, Pistoleers, etc) - are Masters, but of common-type weapons. They can not dig in other's secrets, can they?
cleekjc
Mon Apr 04, 2005 10:18 am
#52
Quandry wrote:
We just need a couple more carbines to get us closer to the variaty of the pistoleer and the riflemen.
The sl has that carbine but most of the specials he will have to choose from are pistol specials. He wont be able to put the damage modifiers behind his shots we will. i assume its the same for the others.
The problem is when it gets down to the high end carbines for a master carbineer. Taking out the low end newbie weapons we only have a couple to choose from...And they dont seem to stack up to a couple other professions only carbines.
How bout adding another couple to carbineer.
A slower fireing high damage carbine
A high end aoe modded carbine.
A high speed high min but low max damage carbine
Perhaps both the C 12 and C 22 grenade certifications as well...seems to fit our style.
True, but how much more damage would a Master Carb do if they had the E5 cert?
SL should get carb/rifle/pistol certs out of rifles/pistols/carbs at higher levels than said elite specialtyprofession, not "unique" or even the other way around................
I will check but I bet 2H swords can use every 2H sword in the game same goes for 1H swords and I also bet if the VK differ between commando and TK, TK is better................