Business And Economy Archive
Thread: AT-ST unfairness
canova wrote:
Well, for two reasons.
First I concede that it is cool that the imps have this huge pet that is starwarsy and that rebels have nothing which would be logical to have as such. So, I don't think it is a good idea to give rebels a rebel ATST, which does not really exist. We could discuss giving them another faction thingy, like calling for raid of those flying things that take down ATAT in Empire strikes back or mines you could place on the terrain..; but that is another topic, I was not calling for a nerf of the ATST in the GCW, you see, but mainly for this use of calling money. I just thought it would be fair to nerf that to make imps suffer the anti solo group patch as others do, and that does not necessitate a rebel pet.
Cause after all that anti solo group patch is good in the sense that it encourages grouping like the incoming CU and I am happy with it. I did not like hunting alone on Dant for hours long.
I'd prefer not to have to do this again and go raid POIs or roleplay with my friends. Thing is, I still need this money to buy food and armors and stuff, and prices are unlikely to get lower if imps can still use ATST and run solo missions.
Here is the rationale of my request and why I am not calling for a rebel pet. Let the imp have the ATST, but not be able to use to pull high paying missions at no cost.
MikeMonger1 wrote:
canova wrote:
Ok I will beleive you on the 12k mission on yavin, haven't tried it. So that means that reduces the advantage of 33k/12k, without the xp I got by slaining the 5 to 6 jantas in a few area shots.
You get more xp running lower paying critter missions that you do running higher paying NPC missions. That's well known, established fact.
When people solo group for xp, not money, they don't run 30k mokk/janta missions, which generate 20-25k xp. They run 14k huurton stalker missions, which generate AT LEAST 75k xp each.Even an 8k picket mission gives you more xp than a mokk/janta mission.
I know that when it comes to makexponlythose medium level creatures are better. The advantage of the Jantas one is that I could make the best money and in the same time get a decent amount of xp. I seem to understand now that I have to choosebetween the two. Either I make about as much money but no more xp, or I make xp but less money. I never said something different.
I mean, do imps ALWAYS win at PvP? Does every imp colonel fly a firespray, or have all +10 attachments, or legendary weapons, or whatever? There is absolutely NO indication that imps in general are richer than rebs.NONE. If what you were saying was true, this would not be the case. Every combat imp would be far better equipped than every reb combat person.
You can't seem to get past the whole "he can get 30k missions and I can only get 12k missions" thing. Solo grouping for money isn't about how much you get per mission. It's about VOLUME. Tear through as many missions as you can, as fast as you can. That's the key.
I simply see one thing : I am struggling to mainting my way of life, I know for a fact imps I know keep making easy money, and I don't think it is a justified advantage.
Now and again how would you feel if imps missions terminal would give 6k max mission and rebels 30k max missions? cause it is basically the same than having an ATST helping to pull 30k missions alone. Would swear wiht good faith that you would not feel screwed and would ask for something even for the two factions? wouldn't you be pissed?
I would understand if it were so, and I see no reason why as a rebel, i would not acknowledge this feeling on the forums where so many imps would complain about it.
I've made 500k in one buff session running FACTION missions, and they pay squat. But I could do almost 1 a minute, including travel time, because the npc's would basically fall over dead as soon as I showed up, and the lair only took 5,6 whacks.
I never found a way given my current template and the time I can reasonably to solo missions in my given play time to make as much than when I could run jantas.
So ultimately, even IF (note it's a big if) at-st's give some kind of remotely significant advantage to money making, it's still PLENTY easy to make significant money running terminal missions. Which means that it's not an "unfair advantage" in the least. It MIGHT be an "advantage", but it's counter balaced by the "advantage" rebs get in loot.
Because the last decent piece of loot I got off of a reb NPC was a HOLOCRON. How long ago is that? Even in space, I get far better loot off of tier 4 Deathwatch ships than I get off of tier 5 reb ships in Kessel.
I keep deleting the reward posters I got from stormies, at the same rate than those stupid 12 strenght 7 potency DH17 carbines I loot from them at the same rate than the schems for droid body I loot from meat lumps. COme on, I looted twice a nice painting on a stormie, and that was when killing stormies a LOT to get colonel... that is the only thing ever I looted from a stormie that is valuable.
Heck, I haven't actually faction farmed in months, because there's no point in it. As a human colonel smuggler, those rare times I need faction points, I just buy them. Killing reb NPC's is a waste of time. At least you rebs get stuff that you have some hope in selling on the bazaar.
If you manage to sell a Luke, leia or Solo painting for 1k on bazaar you are a lucky one.
Message Edited by canova on 03-30-2005 06:46 PM
canova wrote:
If you manage to sell a Luke, leia or Solo painting for 1k on bazaar you are a lucky one.
Message Edited by canova on 03-30-2005 06:46 PM
And yes, all those reward posters do sell for 1k on my server. But you get one almost every two stormies down or so, so...
canova wrote:
gosh there is still something strange, I never was able to pull more than 6k mission on a rebel terminal, never ever, with any of my charachters... seemed to me the cap is 6-7k... don't tell me imps have 12k missions? lol... that would make me give up and loose any hope...
And yes, all those reward posters do sell for 1k on my server. But you get one almost every two stormies down or so, so...
Now now don't go going all off argument. You don't get 30k missions off of imp terms, either....
canova wrote:
gosh there is still something strange, I never was able to pull more than 6k mission on a rebel terminal, never ever, with any of my charachters... seemed to me the cap is 6-7k... don't tell me imps have 12k missions? lol... that would make me give up and loose any hope...
Greywulf0 wrote:
canova wrote:
gosh there is still something strange, I never was able to pull more than 6k mission on a rebel terminal, never ever, with any of my charachters... seemed to me the cap is 6-7k... don't tell me imps have 12k missions? lol... that would make me give up and loose any hope...Never been a Reb, so I don't know what they pay out. But I am able to get Imp missions on Lok for about 9k. I don't think I've seen them go any higher than that, though.
Me neither, and I've done a bunch of Imp missions on various planets to get to Lt. 9K seems to be the cap, at least in my limited experience.
Lord_Eoin wrote:
yeah, credit wise imperials can get an advantage from this, but rebels seem to get at least some decent loot from imperial NPCs(Wanted posters and such). Rebel NPCs most commonly drop CDEFs or broken datapads.
gosh again we just get one time out 1000000 a vader poster that some seem to sell, but the rest of the time we get rewards poster we don't even care to try to sell on bazaar for 1k and cdef rifles...
Sincerely would never even think about going killing stormies for loot. When I kill them I feel like kiling meatlumps, it takes me longer to clean my inventory than actually kill them.
canova wrote:
Milgram wrote:
Perhaps i am missing something here. Are you being prevented from going imp? If so, that really sucks man. I think everyone should be able to go imp and get an atst. If you want to solo grind missions for $$$
- Figure out who is forcing you to stay rebel, and beathim or herup (most likely liar liar or fight club style)
- Go imp and kill rebels.You will be amazed at how good it feels.
- Get an atst.
If you have problems doing any of these, this might help you.
Gosh can't you post something meaningful, that is just irrelevant. You choose pick you your faction according to your taste, your roleplay plans, what is fun according to you, whether you want to wear a stormtrooper armor and pilote a tie fighter, whether you want to make missions for vader or Leai.
You should not have to pick your faction according to whether you want to be able to make money to buy non faction things sorry.
For me, being imp and going imp disgusts me. I understand some find it fun but it does not work for me. I am fighting irl for the recognition of past crimes of war and such things and also fighting to avoid them in the present time, so I really have these things in my mind all the time and roleplaying a robot-mindless-killer stormtrooper or a pervert officer who enjoys mass destruction, is racist and anti democrat does not sound fun to me... Soi respect the capacity of some to roleplay such things but it is not for me.
I don't want to have to do it or to suffer major disadvantage especially in non GCW aspects of the game cause I went rebel, by being unable to buy for example as much food/armors as the imps and compete with them in non GCW POIs, or to be unable to buy as much skill tapes or ressources than imp crafters cause I am more poor.
All joking aside, i appreciate and understand your position. That is great that you gain fulfillment through roleplaying a rebel in SWG. However, you are projecting your tastes and beliefs onto me. You assume that I choose to be imp because i want to roleplay some horrable A$$hole b@st@rd who likes to torture children. "I understand some find it fun but it does not work for me."You have a certian vision for Imperials, based on a roleplaying ideal, and project that onto me. Now that is a little rediculous.
I roleplay a pragmatist. As for rebel vs imp? Heh, I don't care. Most of the time I don't even mess with that stuff. When i first started the game, i looked at it as a) go rebel and get basically nothing or b) go imp and get cool armor, and an ATST (or 3 
). I chose the material benefits over the inherant self rightiousness of being a rebel (which is very nice, I must say--I'm not joking around, that really isthe appealing benefit of being a reb). I actually went rebel for a little while so I could farm Dark Troopers. /shrug I roleplay a guy with no scruples I (IRL i am very uptight about loyalty and doing the right thing, so I guess iget some release from being a causeless mercenary).
What I don't understand is how you think you can have it both ways. You want to be a good guy, but you want to be able to make money by having an ATST. You could make the same arguement for the lame rebel symbol. "I want to be a rebel for"good guy"reasons, but the rebel symbol looks really lame (lets be honest here folks, the imp symbol is much, much cooler looking). Devs, please give us rebels a descent looking symbol. In fact, please give us the Imp symbol, only in different colors." I could make a similar plea: "Devs, please change the imperial personathat is portrayedby theImp NPCs in the game. I want to stay imp, but not have my faction portrayed as a bunch of sadistic incompetantand ungrateful (imp theme park, the Warren, Geo Cave, The Yavin Deathstar Part Mission)."
If i want to be the "good guys" it makes very little sense for me to lobby to get the imperial image changed. The obvious answer is for me to sacrifice all the benefits I enjoy being an Imp and go rebel. If you want to have an ATST, it makes very little sense for you to lobby to get an ATST for rebels. The obvious answer is for you to sacrifice all the benefits you enjoy being a rebel and go Imp. It is the same agruement as the pistoleers who want ap3 weapons. Uhhh, if you really want to be a rifle man, go be a rifleman. No one forces them to be pistoleers, and no one forces you to be a rebel.
Quit being a victim and choose a path that doesn't victimize you. Alternately, quit trying to deny that choices have consequences, and accept the consequences you have chosen.
Lokivoid wrote:
Dont like it thin go Imperial that simple
the Empire has the money and the toys Rebels allways had crappy second hand equipment only thing decent they hadStarfightersmovie and book wise
yeah in the movies, in the books, now you can't implement this in a game. That would just not work. Can you think as a dev one second before posting? If the imps really had the power they are supposed to have, there would be no point palying a game at all. No one would enjoy playing one of the 50000 rebels troopers shot down by ATATs on the Hot nor (I guess) an imp shooting from ATATs on troopers at no risks.
The only way you could have made the Empire really as superior as it is supposed to be would have been to make it unavailable as a faction. But of course, since everyone buying a SW game wants to be either a rebel or an imp, you end up with a need of balancing.
This is why the rebels and the imps receive non identical but balanced equipement, for the most part. JTL is respecting this rule, and so does the faction armor system.
We have the same problem with jedis.
So this point is according to me totally irrelevant. One does not play chess with 2 white queens against one black queen. One does not play tennis 2 to 1. Every single game ever concieved is balanced, and let the best win.