Bounty Hunter Archive
Thread: Jedi XP Loss
Thorkahn wrote:
All that you say is true, and I play both profs.
The only issue I have is that we live in a combat lvl system where a Master BH / Master Doc is more powerful than a lvl 80 Jedi.
Also, the fact that SOE made changes to the BH system, to make it a 1 vs 1, recognizes that a lvl system means 80 vs 80 is just that.
ATM the reward for being a jedi just does not exist. With a lvl combat system, the delta becomes armor and weapons when lvls are equal. Since Jedi cannot wear armor and PostCU glow sticks are no where near the common place 1200 damage weapons, Jedi have become just another toon.
Until SOE can implement a system that actually works fairly and correctly, then paying a subscription for a mostly broken product is penalty enough.
I understand what your saying. There should be no reward for Jedi..they save themselves, end of story. I understand that the BH may be better suited to kill the Jedi, but..Jedi have cloak and force run. Jedi NEVER have to lose a BH fight, ever.
JeetBadwarrior wrote:I hate to be the bearer of bad news but if the jedi are placing there hope on a cu saber...i think you might want to refer to tiggs post about pearl drops...I also dont see jedi gaining to much in power then what they are now...refer to JL post above about that...the days of alone jedi wiping out 6 to 7 combat toons at the same time are over...the days of you rolling in lapd size squads have begun..
This is a very wise man.
Not saying it doesn't suck, but what I said, and what he is saying is the truth, gotta accept it.
alpinestreams wrote:
An experienced full template Jedi under normal circumstances should not be dying to a BH ... period ... sometimes you win ... sometimes you learn.
Under normal circumstances means what? 1 vs 1, Jedi has a PreCU glowstick with Premium Pearls
I just don't see how being a full template Jedi has any advantage over any other full template toon.
Lvl 80 vs 80.
Provided both players know how to play their template.
Thorkahn wrote:
alpinestreams wrote:
An experienced full template Jedi under normal circumstances should not be dying to a BH ... period ... sometimes you win ... sometimes you learn.
Under normal circumstances means what? 1 vs 1, Jedi has a PreCU glowstick with Premium PearlsI just don't see how being a full template Jedi has any advantage over any other full template toon.
Lvl 80 vs 80.
Provided both players know how to play their template.
Combat level is for pve, no bearing in PvP
This is what im pointing out...running may be what you have to do to not "lose" now, if you want that..become a Jedi..if it's not your idea of fun..don't become a Jedi. It's as simple as that.
Thorkahn wrote:
Alicce wrote:
Thorkahn wrote:
All that you say is true, and I play both profs.
The only issue I have is that we live in a combat lvl system where a Master BH / Master Doc is more powerful than a lvl 80 Jedi.
Also, the fact that SOE made changes to the BH system, to make it a 1 vs 1, recognizes that a lvl system means 80 vs 80 is just that.
ATM the reward for being a jedi just does not exist. With a lvl combat system, the delta becomes armor and weapons when lvls are equal. Since Jedi cannot wear armor and PostCU glow sticks are no where near the common place 1200 damage weapons, Jedi have become just another toon.
Until SOE can implement a system that actually works fairly and correctly, then paying a subscription for a mostly broken product is penalty enough.
I understand what your saying. There should be no reward for Jedi..they save themselves, end of story. I understand that the BH may be better suited to kill the Jedi, but..Jedi have cloak and force run. Jedi NEVER have to lose a BH fight, ever.
Running is not my idea of fun.
I thought the idea is to create a game play experience that is condusive to fun combat.
Thorkahn wrote:
Alicce wrote:
Thorkahn wrote:
All that you say is true, and I play both profs.
The only issue I have is that we live in a combat lvl system where a Master BH / Master Doc is more powerful than a lvl 80 Jedi.
Also, the fact that SOE made changes to the BH system, to make it a 1 vs 1, recognizes that a lvl system means 80 vs 80 is just that.
ATM the reward for being a jedi just does not exist. With a lvl combat system, the delta becomes armor and weapons when lvls are equal. Since Jedi cannot wear armor and PostCU glow sticks are no where near the common place 1200 damage weapons, Jedi have become just another toon.
Until SOE can implement a system that actually works fairly and correctly, then paying a subscription for a mostly broken product is penalty enough.
I understand what your saying. There should be no reward for Jedi..they save themselves, end of story. I understand that the BH may be better suited to kill the Jedi, but..Jedi have cloak and force run. Jedi NEVER have to lose a BH fight, ever.
Running is not my idea of fun.I thought the idea is to create a game play experience that is condusive to fun combat.
then stay and fight, whats the problem? and if you learn to pvp, you might actually win
If you know how to pvp, and you are losing, then you need to re-learn how to pvp.
abbink wrote:
Lets be done with it already lets make a peace treaty between bounty hunters and jedi. Lets eliminate the strife and make the game enjoyable for both sides.
Hm. That's one approach: since there's no risk for bounty hunters, take the risk away from Jedi. Lessen the chance of anyone becoming upset over having lost something.
That's reasonable. It's level and fair.
However, I support evening things out not by taking away risk away from one side (Jedi) but rather by adding risk to the other (BH). Making MBH the required skill level for taking PC missions was the right thing to do -- it adds restriction on who can participate in the most dangerous game and sent several respec BH back to the mission terminal to grind. But as it stands, the MBH still has nothing to lose by hunting a Jedi. A full template Jedi has nothing to lose by dying to a BH. That's my definition of "nerf" -- the supposed consequences aren't very consequential.
Let's up the ante for both sides.
I envision a system in which a BH that dies to a Jedi loses something significant. Money doesn't cut it because let's face it -- being a millionare in this game is super super common. No, we have to take something away from the BH if he loses, and the things BHs value most are their skills, their equipment, and their ability to take Jedi missions. I don't support confiscating player property, but smacking a MBH back down to 2444 if he loses to a Jedi seems acceptable. If nothing else, I've seen others propose that the MBH lose the privilege of hunting Jedi for a period of time, 1 week being the most common. During that time, the difficulty of his NPC marks ought also be reduced, such that losing to a Jedi punishes the BH just as losing to a BH punishes Jedi. In effect, it sends him "back to school" and wastes his time. Sony loves to waste players' time (12-week village cycle, anyone?).
To a full template Jedi, the matter is more complicated. He can afford XP loss and sometimes has zero equipment (consider a defender / powers template -- not all Jedi use lightsabers these days, yes?). From him we can only take skills, since he has no profession-granted privileges to be suspended and no use for XP. Thus, a Jedi that loses to a BH could maybe have 2 random skillboxes revoked. Maybe that Mdef / enh 3002 would get lucky and only get knocked back to Mdef enh 3000. Maybe he'd get screwed and knocked back to Def 3444 / enh 3002. In any case, he's going to have to grind to replace lost skill. This system would apply to grinding padawans, as well. The only time raw xp would be withdrawn from a Jedi would be if he had no skill boxes to revoke (an uberbaby padawan / initiate who somehow managed to get himself vised) and in that case it should be some fixed amount in the 20k ballpark.
To summarize, I support even stakes for both sides and stiff penalties all around, not making the game easier / less dangerous for everyone. I'd hate to see the Jedi profession simplified and candy-coated further by removing all consequence for BH death, and it's about time the BH profession stood something meaningful to lose, too.
mbolyard wrote:
I dont think folks want the experience of being hunted to be taken away. What folks are addressing is that the bounty hunter profession has seen significant strength increases while Jedi has been balanced to be an equal profession. The devs have not admitted this, but silently it has happened. The XP loss is the last residual vestige of a time past.
Believe me, I understand that Jedi is balanced almost to a regular profession..on Bria we have a group of swordsman that go around killing full temp Jedi 1v1, sad as it sounds..if that's the way things are so be it, no other profession gets cloak, no other profession gets AI, force aura, force run, choke..there will always be people wanting to be a Jedi..for those reasons alone if not anything else. Jedi will never be equal to a normal profession until they give normal professions lightsabers and choke.
MasterJedi2003 wrote:
Thorkahn wrote:
alpinestreams wrote:
An experienced full template Jedi under normal circumstances should not be dying to a BH ... period ... sometimes you win ... sometimes you learn.
Under normal circumstances means what? 1 vs 1, Jedi has a PreCU glowstick with Premium Pearls
I just don't see how being a full template Jedi has any advantage over any other full template toon.
Lvl 80 vs 80.
Provided both players know how to play their template.
Combat level is for pve, no bearing in PvP
? How is that?
As long as their is damage mitigation based upon level, then it is very much a part of PVP.
A lvl 80 toon will kill a lvl 70 toon allot faster than a lvl 80 toon.
Not to mention that the Devs have indicated seval times that lvl also impacts how benefical all the SEAs are as well.
Agreed that their is little to no documentation either way.
Thorkahn wrote:
MasterJedi2003 wrote:
Thorkahn wrote:
alpinestreams wrote:
An experienced full template Jedi under normal circumstances should not be dying to a BH ... period ... sometimes you win ... sometimes you learn.
Under normal circumstances means what? 1 vs 1, Jedi has a PreCU glowstick with Premium PearlsI just don't see how being a full template Jedi has any advantage over any other full template toon.
Lvl 80 vs 80.
Provided both players know how to play their template.
Combat level is for pve, no bearing in PvP
? How is that?As long as their is damage mitigation based upon level, then it is very much a part of PVP.
A lvl 80 toon will kill a lvl 70 toon allot faster than a lvl 80 toon.
Not to mention that the Devs have indicated seval times that lvl also impacts how benefical all the SEAs are as well.
Agreed that their is little to no documentation either way.
you are incorrect. trust me, there are pleanty of lvl 70 swordsman that will drop you before you know what happened. the damamge mitigation due to level is PVE.