Bounty Hunter Archive
Thread: The official reason BH TEF's where removed
Pussycat, you don't even have a clue what Jedi was supposed to be in this game. Jedi was never planned for ''Casual PVE Players'' like you. You know the '' 3 strikes out '' rule ? Permadeath ? Original Jedi ? Pure PVP.
Don't even talk about '' Powergamer - Casual Gamer '' and their rights. To be able to play with a '' Finished '' template in Everquest2 or World of Warcraft you need to level at least 5-6 months of your '' Casual '' play.
BH - Jedi contained griefing, true. But it was the most unique thing in any game I have ever played. I am sitting in Theed cantina, talking with my friends, a BH walks in, and starts shooting at me, and we fight while the whole cantina watches us. This is ( was ) unique.
I have been both Jedi and BH. And the most enjoyable times I had in SWG were the ones I have been chased by 3 Jedi 2 BHs and several non-Jedi just because I killed their Jedi with my BH. The name of this game is : STAR WARS GALAXIES.
Erynder wrote:Pussycat, you don't even have a clue what Jedi was supposed to be in this game. Jedi was never planned for ''Casual PVE Players'' like you. You know the '' 3 strikes out '' rule ? Permadeath ? Original Jedi ? Pure PVP.
Don't even talk about '' Powergamer - Casual Gamer '' and their rights. To be able to play with a '' Finished '' template in Everquest2 or World of Warcraft you need to level at least 5-6 months of your '' Casual '' play.
BH - Jedi contained griefing, true. But it was the most unique thing in any game I have ever played. I am sitting in Theed cantina, talking with my friends, a BH walks in, and starts shooting at me, and we fight while the whole cantina watches us. This is ( was ) unique.
I have been both Jedi and BH. And the most enjoyable times I had in SWG were the ones I have been chased by 3 Jedi 2 BHs and several non-Jedi just because I killed their Jedi with my BH. The name of this game is : STAR WARS GALAXIES.
Yes, I know what Jedi were supposed to be in the game originally... rare. Making Jedi rare did NOT have to involve forced pvp. It could have done just as easily by simply having NPCs "hunt" the Jedi, and as you well know NPCs can be even deadlier than player characters because the devs can give them HAMs far bigger than those of players. All of the game mechanics... including permadeath, didn't have to involve forced pvp.
Your comparison with other MMORPGs is pointless, they were aimed at a different target audience. And I don't question the fact that some people enjoyed the adrenaline rush that came with player bounty-related pvp; what I question is why you thought that it was a good idea to try to impose the same game style on EVERYBODY in the game.
And lastly... this is still going to be STAR WARS... even without forced pvp.
Enryder-
Give it up. The arguing is pointless. Pussycat and her minions will not stop so the best thing we can do is ignore them. I am very tired of arguing. Lets just look forward to the way it is going to be and forget the people that don't matter anyway.
STARTING NEW THREAD
pussycat wrote:
To me, it sounded like you were first saying that Jedi players were BH content, then saying they weren't... in either case, if there was some room for misunderstanding, we can just set that point aside.
You tell me know, with a straight face, that simply pointing out that some BH's griefed other players is "neither constructive nor helpful".
Yes pussycat what EXACTLY are you trying to achieve? Gloating?, anger?, resentment?
But was anybody in these forums expressing any concern when BH's routinely came here and bragged, openly and shamelessly,
Shamelessly, of course shamelessly there was no shame in what they were doing, they were playing their role EXACTLY as intended without exploit. Read around the forums a bit you will find Jedi just as openly and shamelessly admitting killing BH, killing each other in PVP, go check the galaxy forums and find all the PvP threads there completely shameless. Why because there is no Shame in follow game rules.
about the things they had done or planned to do to grief players who had a Jedi character, and in some cases, even the people who were grouped with them (even if non-Jedi)? Or when BH's kept clamoring that Jedi should be attackable somehow even when they were inside their homes or another private residence? How were those posts constructive or helpful towards making the situation better for all involved?
The posts were helpfull for the BOUNTY HUNTER profession, helping us to carry out OUR profession easier, just as Jedi wanted flawless pearls etc etc, Hence TOTALLY appropriate for this forum.
Now you actually say that simply pointing out the obvious (that there was some griefing going on as a result of player bounties) is actually worse than some of the other things that have been posted here? Gimme a break!
Yes because what you are posting is designed solely to provoke, the other things posted here were trying to promote the BH profession, taking care of OUR OWN interests. Any BH posting I kill you all on the Jedi forums I would support seeing publicly horse whipped.
At any rate, hope you enjoy the game with all of your toons, just as surely as all peace-loving Jedi will enjoy a greater degree of peace and tranquility that was ever given to us before.
The poor lil pickets
DTQ wrote:
pussycat wrote:
To me, it sounded like you were first saying that Jedi players were BH content, then saying they weren't... in either case, if there was some room for misunderstanding, we can just set that point aside.
You tell me know, with a straight face, that simply pointing out that some BH's griefed other players is "neither constructive nor helpful".Yes pussycat what EXACTLY are you trying to achieve? Gloating?, anger?, resentment?
But was anybody in these forums expressing any concern when BH's routinely came here and bragged, openly and shamelessly,
Shamelessly, of course shamelessly there was no shame in what they were doing, they were playing their role EXACTLY as intended without exploit. Read around the forums a bit you will find Jedi just as openly and shamelessly admitting killing BH, killing each other in PVP, go check the galaxy forums and find all the PvP threads there completely shameless. Why because there is no Shame in follow game rules.
about the things they had done or planned to do to grief players who had a Jedi character, and in some cases, even the people who were grouped with them (even if non-Jedi)? Or when BH's kept clamoring that Jedi should be attackable somehow even when they were inside their homes or another private residence? How were those posts constructive or helpful towards making the situation better for all involved?
The posts were helpfull for the BOUNTY HUNTER profession, helping us to carry out OUR profession easier, just as Jedi wanted flawless pearls etc etc, Hence TOTALLY appropriate for this forum.
Now you actually say that simply pointing out the obvious (that there was some griefing going on as a result of player bounties) is actually worse than some of the other things that have been posted here? Gimme a break!Yes because what you are posting is designed solely to provoke, the other things posted here were trying to promote the BH profession, taking care of OUR OWN interests. Any BH posting I kill you all on the Jedi forums I would support seeing publicly horse whipped.
At any rate, hope you enjoy the game with all of your toons, just as surely as all peace-loving Jedi will enjoy a greater degree of peace and tranquility that was ever given to us before.The poor lil pickets
Wrong -- many BH's came here and gloated about all of the exploits they used to kill Jedi... exploits with droids, exploits to try to enter their marks' houses, exploits to kill a Jedi and all grouped players by shooting them off a skiff over lava... there were many, many examples of things that BH's bragged about and gloated about... even thought this forum can be easily monitored by SOE/LA. So don't say that there's no shame in "following game rules", because many BH's openly bragged about using exploits and griefing players. And don't claim innocently that the only stuff posted on these forums was for making the profession easier, some of it was just plain old gloating about griefing players and looking for exploits that would make it easier to kill marks. As for Jedi, we could not attack BH's unless the BH had their mission and attacked first. Jedi could not attack other players unless said players were Special Forces.
Message Edited by pussycat on 11-08-2005 07:10 AM
NewEye wrote:
Pussycat....are you in some way compensated for the number of posts?
I would ask you the very same question.
pussycat wrote:
Wrong -- many BH's came here and gloated about all of the exploits they used to kill Jedi...
Posting details of how to carry out exploits is specifically banned! any such posts would be deleted very fast.
exploits with droids,
Ah I see your own definition of exploits rather than official ones, the healing of droids was considered intended game mechanics by CSR's, our own corrospondant I believe took up the issue of that with the devs, as well as the issue of medical bonus's being in effect after the incap of a droid, Neither of these were considered exploits, and were both an option available to jedi.
exploits to try to enter their marks' houses,
I must have missed that one only thing I heard was shooting a Jedis vehicle - not an exploit
exploits to kill a Jedi and all grouped players by shooting them off a skiff over lava...
Also not an exploit, a TACTIC, and wouldnt result in a mission complete.
there were many, many examples of things that BH's bragged about and gloated about... even thought this forum can be easily monitored by SOE/LA.
It is and where exploits were mentioned players would be suitably warned, I did see our own corrospondant warning a player about use of an exploit to reduce a NPC mark to CL-1 these forums ARE monitored
So don't say that there's no shame in "following game rules", because many BH's openly bragged about using exploits and griefing players.
Your definition of exploit seems to differ somewhat from official rules
And don't claim innocently that the only stuff posted on these forums was for making the profession easier, some of it was just plain old gloating about griefing players and looking for exploits that would make it easier to kill marks. As for Jedi, we could not attack BH's unless the BH had their mission and attacked first. Jedi could not attack other players unless said players were Special Forces.
Enjoying our profession as it stood at the time IN OUR OWN FORUM is not gloating, most often Jedi names would be blotted out etc. Yes BH HUNTED JEDI AND KILLED THEM, and they considered it the ultimate challenge in the game! Yes when they did this they posted amongst their fellows in their profession who would also enjoy the tale. THIS IS A PROFESSION board it is the BOUNTY HUNTER Profession board expect people to relate their PROFESSION stories. They WERE NOT trying to upset Jedi by posting, the fools who wanted to do that posted in the JEDI Forums.
AND of course I never saw Jedi discussing how to overload their sabres, how to house sit to deliberately annoy other players, AFK camping loot spots, or over camping quest spawns stopping other players from completeing their quests?
Message Edited by pussycat on 11-08-200507:10 AM
What is really offensive is 260+ posts in 5 days in the BH forums saying "ha ha you lost your content I hate you all" I believe that makes you the BH forums NO 1 troll, a title you can feel free to add to your sig if you so wish.
We KNOW you dont like us we KNOW you cried about BH Missions, you've told us all 260+ flaming times.
DTQ wrote:What is really offensive is 260+ posts in 5 days in the BH forums saying "ha ha you lost your content I hate you all" I believe that makes you the BH forums NO 1 troll, a title you can feel free to add to your sig if you so wish.
We KNOW you dont like us we KNOW you cried about BH Missions, you've told us all 260+ flaming times.
Can you provide an accurate count of all the BH's who bragged about using exploits to hunt/kill their marks, and who gloated about griefing other players (and even grouped members) during the last couple of years? I think those figures would be far more telling....
There is a large contingent of Jedi and Bounty Hunters who did not enjoy the Jedi Bounty system, male and female. Personally, I found in interesting and exciting...for about the first 2 weeks. After that, it just mainly was an annoyance and cut into my playtime, and was about a 75/25 chance to end with a string of tells from my opponent. If it wasn't hate tells, it was "GG, I would have beat you if ...." excuses, or them asking me for my template or what specials I used or what stats my saber had or something. On the rare occasions when I was killed, I'd still end up with strings of tells more often than not. There was the always-lovely "I PWNED JOO!" ones, and then the "Sorry dude, I know it sucks. I have a Jedi too" ones. Don't get me wrong, I liked the friendly tells and even the excuses a lot better than the hate/gloat tells, but in the end, all of them are just adding to the interruption of whatever I was doing at the time. On a good day, I get about 3 to 3.5 hours of playtime a night. A BH encounter, start to finish, is pretty much guaranteed to suck up anywhere from 15 to 45 minutes on average. Some longer. Thats a significant portion of time, especially if I'm in the middle of doing something else. Its sort of like having your time taken away from you. It was even worse when I'd be out with guildies or friends doing something, and not only is my time wasted, but there's is too because they're waiting on me. Win, lose, draw, good fight, bad fight, friendly afterwards, angry afterwards...I pretty much always ended up just seeing it as an interruption after the first two weeks. This is all, of course, not to mention that the bounty system meant I couldn't go afk just to go to the bathroom or let my dogs outside for even a minute or two, without risking death or going to a safehouse.
Did I personally KNOW that this was going to happen to me when I became a Jedi? Yeah, I knew. I was pre-pub9, but I wasn't one of the first on my server or anything. I knew about player bounties, and I knew about saberTEF, and I knew having a Jedi would be painting a great big "Come get some!" sign on my back. Yes, I did it anyway, and yes, I tolerated everything I had to tolerate. But that doesn't mean that I LIKED it. It means I put up with it. I became a Jedi in spite of all that stuff, not because of it.
And now they're changing the profession, making it no more powerful than any other, and taking away the remaining risks/penalties like the player bounty system. No love lost here. Doesn't much matter to me that I'm not teh ewbur anymore with my Jedi. That wasn't why I went there in the first place.
Ultimately, tho, we all (Jedi and BH, alike) brought this conclusion on ourselves. The original Dev/Design team presented us with a very delicate dynamic, matching two unbalanced classes together for high stakes, disadvantaged PvP. It was a system that required maturity and discipline to be successful. We pretty much proved that, as a whole, we were incapable of either. Over its lifespan, the Jedi Bounty system was one of the most exploited in the game. Worse, it was sometimes used as a griefing tool for particular BHs to harass particular Jedi.
Forced PvP? Not forced PvP? Jedi = PvP class? These questions are really irrelevant. The bottom line is that this system was a failure, in that it generated less fun than it created, on the whole.
Tight Goatfinger - Zabrak Teras Kasi Mystic
Waxen Wane - Reformed Force Choker of Gungans
Proud Intrepidean since Launch
That said . . .
ALARIA!
pussycat wrote:
DTQ wrote:
What is really offensive is 260+ posts in 5 days in the BH forums saying "ha ha you lost your content I hate you all" I believe that makes you the BH forums NO 1 troll, a title you can feel free to add to your sig if you so wish.
We KNOW you dont like us we KNOW you cried about BH Missions, you've told us all 260+ flaming times.
Can you provide an accurate count of all the BH's who bragged about using exploits to hunt/kill their marks, and who gloated about griefing other players (and even grouped members) during the last couple of years? I think those figures would be far more telling....
The bounty hunters were posting in THEIR forums about THEIR Profession as they are quite right to do so. Find one single BH posting that many times in that few number of days on the Jedi forums.
You are just bumping your post count spamming and trolling.