Bio Engineer Archive
Thread: Please put some experimental points at MBE level
Spazzers wrote:
Have you been paying attention? I doesn't look good for BE's NOW. Hello??? You don't have to master BE. You can already respec your unused skill points that come from not having to master medic anymore and instantly become 0404 BE. No need to master the profession. You don't have to spend a single skill point you're not already using for medic. Unwad your panties now and take a deep breath. You've already won. I'm not sure why you're all upset. YOU WIN!!!By the way. You are not the forum moderator. You do not get to tell people when they can post and what they can post. If you don't find the post constructive then move on. These people have been members of this forum far longer than you have.
a) He was trolling in and had nothing to say except to laugh about me being nerfed in his opinion. Not friendly nor constructive, so it doesnt belong on the forums. Want me to get a moderator at it and comment on the issue?
b) I always said I know you are in a bad position currently. But your solution is to nerf current docs, hoping to take their business. I am offering you a chance to meet in the middleground, by you keeping your current BE products and me keeping my med business. If you dont support that but rather call for docs being nerfed, dont expect me to support you in any way.
Furthermore, I am master doc currently, enabling me to heal and craft. If I want to keep the same abilities post-CU, I will have to move the CM line of medic to BE 0004 and will lose master medic for novice BE - less healing and enhancing abilities for me. If I want to enter the additive market in addition, I will have to spend 14 more skill points. You dont need to fear me, you need to fear the pure doc crafters. Those will just take master BE for master doc and save 3 lines + master of medic in the process, netting that at 48 skill points gained.
I know currently the MBE box is devalued, so I am offering my support to make it valueable for pet and tissue crafting again. But apparently, you want medical crafting, also. You dont want to compromise, instead you want to take it all, so I will try to get it all, also. Which I already do, youre right, currently I win anyway.
So I wont discuss this here anymore, I offered my support for you keeping your business, but you not just want to keep your business, you are trying to take my business from me. I wont support that.
Furthermore, I am upset because people seem to be blinded by having MBE devalued, and rather than taking the hand I am offering to change that, I am getting called the bad doc taking away your business. I dont want to take your business, but if you force me to become MBE to keep my business, I will take your business also. I have no choice in that case because of the high skill point cost.
I posted enough here, you know my view on the issue, I wont post in this thread again.
Eskie wrote:
a) He was trolling in and had nothing to say except to laugh about me being nerfed in his opinion. Not friendly nor constructive, so it doesnt belong on the forums. Want me to get a moderator at it and comment on the issue?
Sure, because you don't get to decide that. There is nothing that states a comment has to be constructive. And to be honest he makes some valid points. You see it as a nerf to you, so you call it trolling. Differing views, which is why, again, you don't get to decide.
b) I always said I know you are in a bad position currently. But your solution is to nerf current docs, hoping to take their business.
See this is what you don't get and why you keep calling this a nerf to you. A master BE has nothing to lose by asking for skill points to be moved to master. Look at it logically. You can master BE NOW and take over the entire medical and tissue business. You don't even have to master the profession. You can craft 90% of the tissues on the very first day this CURB thing goes live. The revelation you're going to make is that the medical supplies you're trying so hard to covet as "your turf" is not really needed by doctors to begin with. Consider the resources and the that ultra expensive skill mod you bought then look at your customer base. You think you're going to be rolling in credits? I don't think so. How much do you think a doctor is going to pay to have a 20% boost when they don't have to buy it at all? They can just shake their hand and not bother with you or your super expensive ultra meds. I totally appreciate that you would have the experiment points seperated from BE and medical. In all honesty it's a pipe dream. Ain't gonna happen. To be complete honest and practical ALL the experiment points in BE should be...dun dun dun....BE. Yes, that pretty much polaxes your ultra expensive skill mod. I care about that as much as you seem to care about making master BE worth having. Let's remember, you were the one worried a master would have an advantage over you at 0004 BE. Like that was wrong or something.
I am offering you a chance to meet in the middleground, by you keeping your current BE products and me keeping my med business. If you dont support that but rather call for docs being nerfed, dont expect me to support you in any way.
Again, BE's have nothing to lose. We're already screwed. You can come in and take over from the word go. I'm looking at this from a realistic view. You want everything to be status quo for crafting doctors with your 12 point suits. Then why even move medical crafting? I spend a lot more skill points to master a profession and you actually would post that you DESERVE an advantage over me and then feel slighted that you aren't accepted with open arms. Interesting world you live in.
Furthermore, I am master doc currently, enabling me to heal and craft. If I want to keep the same abilities post-CU, I will have to move the CM line of medic to BE 0004 and will lose master medic for novice BE - less healing and enhancing abilities for me.
You don't need master medic to become a master doctor. That has been removed for you. You lose nothing. I'm not buying this for a second.
If I want to enter the additive market in addition, I will have to spend 14 more skill points.
No you won't. You need 2 lines in medic to become a master doctor. Those othertwo lines you've taken along with that master medic box which you don't need anymorejust moves over to novice BE (6 points) and boom, instantly you have 0404 BE. I think you will find, the tissue line will be more to your advantage anyway. Doctors don't need your meds and considering what goes into them you'll soon discover why BE's aren't rich. lol
You dont need to fear me, you need to fear the pure doc crafters.
I don't fear anyone. This is a game. It's all monopoly money. It just strikes me odd that you would strive so hard to keep a market that doesn't need you.
Those will just take master BE for master doc and save 3 lines + master of medic in the process, netting that at 48 skill points gained.
Nah, they won't master BE. No need to unless they want to craft pets. Many docs have already said that interests them not at all. Besides, as it is now, a 0404 doc/BE with a skill mod will outcraft a master anyway. I know, it's because you deserve it.
I know currently the MBE box is devalued, so I am offering my support to make it valueable for pet and tissue crafting again. But apparently, you want medical crafting, also. You dont want to compromise, instead you want to take it all, so I will try to get it all, also. Which I already do, youre right, currently I win anyway.
You're wrong again. I don't want anything. I see things as they are. I'm a realist. It has nothing to do with compromise because, surprise, it's not up to us. You and I don't own this game. SOE does. Don't compromise with me. Your argument is with them.
So I wont discuss this here anymore, I offered my support for you keeping your business, but you not just want to keep your business, you are trying to take my business from me. I wont support that.
I have nothing to lose. I've already lost it. I'm not trying to do anything. Medical supplies are moved to BE. They are a BE product. Simple basic fact. You're not a crafting doctor any longer. You're a novice BE. You feel you deserve to have an advantage over a master BE. That's the thing you refuse to accept.
Furthermore, I am upset because people seem to be blinded by having MBE devalued, and rather than taking the hand I am offering to change that, I am getting called the bad doc taking away your business. I dont want to take your business, but if you force me to become MBE to keep my business, I will take your business also. I have no choice in that case because of the high skill point cost.
No one is calling you the bad doc. We're calling you a novice BE.
I posted enough here, you know my view on the issue, I wont post in this thread again.
It was a good discussion. I said from the very beginning that it's pointless. We don't get to decide. SOE does. I'm not sure why you would let it get to you like that. You have but one choice in the matter. It's the exact same choice I have, whether or not to play the game SOE comes up with.
We'll have more discussions in the future, since you'll be a member of this community. Welcome to BE young novice.
Message Edited by Spazzers on 04-09-2005 05:19 PM
Every letter below is relating to the according paragraph in your post
a)
Forum Usage Guidelines point 2. More than likely laughing at somebody because one thinks that person is nerfed is off-topic and not friendly or supportive in any way. I dont call it trolling because I dont like his opinion, I call it trolling because his only opinion is that he should try to anger me.
b)
Doctors not needing the new medical enhancers is pure speculation on your side. Granted, this might happen. But also include stims in this discussion, which everybody will need.
Currently I need 140 skill points for master doctor, post CU I will need 140 skill points for master doc and BE 0004. This is the skillset I will need to continue what I am doing now. _NOT_ a nerf to doctors.
You proposal to move medical experimentation to MBE will make healing / crafting docs take MD and MBE to be able to continue what they are doing now, having to pay 183 skill points total. Requiring 43 skill points more for the same abilities _IS_ a nerf. This is why I call the suggestion of moving med experimentation in master BE a nerf to docs.
Resources needed to craft items are of no interest to the discussion of who should be able to craft them at what quality.
Yes, I am worried about a master BE having an advantage over me _in medical_ crafting.
By suggesting to put BE experimentation back into the game and put it into the master box and have it applied to _additives and pets_, how do I not care for MB being valuable to have? It is more valueable than it is with all experimentation in BE 0004.
c)
I deserve an advantage over you because I am currently MD and have a med business, and you are currently BE and have a pet / additive business. I simply deserve an advantage because it is _my_ business and not _yours_ currently, so if my business gets exposed to BEs taking up med crafting by having it moved around the skilltrees, I deserve an initial advantage to keep you from entering it, just as much as you want to keep me from entering your business.
Yes, currently you are screwed, because the advantage given to me in medical crafting actually turns out to be an advantage also applying to additive crafting.
d)
Where did I ever say I will need master medic to be able to master doc / BE 0004 post-CU?
Pre-CU:
- Master Medic: 77
- Master Doc: 63
------------------
- total: 140
Post-CU:
- Master Doc: 63
- Medic 4044: 57
- BE 0004: 20
------------------
- total: 140
Effectively Master Medic gets moved to Novice BE and Medic x4xx gets moved to BE xxx4. Thats what I said, in no way did I say master medic is a requirement for me post-CU. All I said is I will lose the skill mods I currently have with master medic, since I dont need master medic anymore. Read more carefully what I am saying.
e)
I need 3 lines of medic to have master doc and BE 0004 and not 2 as you are saying. Read point d). So I will have to spend 14 skill points on BE x4xx if I want to enter the additive business. Get your facts right.
f)
I am pretty sure there will be money in the Stim market. As for the Enhancer market, nobody crafted one on TC so far, so nobody knows if they are worth the resource requirements and if there is money to be made with them or not.
g) I never said I deserve to craft better additives than you do. I always said I do not deserve to craft additives better than you, but you dont deserve to craft meds better than me, either. Read my words more carefully. In no way did I ever state I want to craft additives as well as you, thats the whole point of my proposal to re-introduce BE experimentation and leave some of it in the master box.
Concerning docs not wanting to become MBEs: Go back in this thread and read the post of the original poster. Matta is a pure crafter doc, and the only reason she wants medical experimentation moved into the MBE box is because she will take it anyway (it will cost her 92 skill points opposed to master doc 140 now), and by moving those points into master she hopes to get rid of some competition in the medical business from the docs that are not pure crafters, but also play the healing game. So dont tell me docs wont take MBE.
My point is that if you dont allow current healers / crafters to keep their playstyle (and that is what you do by moving medical experimentation into MBE), that you will have competition from healing / crafting docs on your current "turf" in addition to the current crafting-only docs. My suggestion is to "quarantine" the healing / crafting docs at BE 0004, not allowing them to craft better additives or pets than you do, but allowing them to craft better meds than you do in return, which they always have.
h) Yes, you want something. You support medical experimentation being moved to MBE. If you dont want anything, dont support it.
You have a slight chance to change something if you can get the support of a large part of the playerbase. If you support moving medical experimentation to MBE, you are fighting against healing / crafting docs while probably having the support of pure crafter docs, if you support the re-introduction of BE experimentation in addition to medical experimentation you have the support of healing / crafting docs while most pure crafting docs probably will be indifferent - more competition but even less skillpoint cost than having to take MBE. Pure crafting docs are a rare breed, I know maybe 10 to 20 on Ahazi.
i) I am MD currently and will be BE 0004 post-CU more than likely, unless you force me to go MBE. So dont call me novice, call me Geneticist. And I deserve an advantage in medical crafting over a current MBE because I can craft medical items better than him currently. Why should an MBE deserve to craft medical items better than a current master doctor, after all he gets the option to craft medical items at the current MD-without-SEA level _for free_ without having to spend any more skill points, so he should at most be on-par with the current doc. Which he is, BE 0004 (the former doc) has 10 exp points and MBE has the same 10 exp points. Dont start talking about SEAs now to counter this fact, because they are as easy to get for the MBE as they were for the doc.
Having summed up all this now, read carefully what I wrote and dont respond by telling me I said things I never said, as you have in your last post, and get the facts about skill point costs right, which you havent in your last post.
Spazzers wrote:
(...)
What I was recommending allowed you to keep your skill mods, allow you to craft the chef and tailor tissues using those skill mods, but if you master BE you will craft all those items better. That makes the ENTIRE BE profession valuable. That's balance.
(...)
What you were recommending would be keeping me from my current style of gameplay. You are saying I should invest 43 skill points more to be able to do what I do now, but for those 43 points I will also get to craft something that a) I dont want to craft at all and b) most BEs dont want me to craft, either, since it will take business from them.
Furthermore, you expect to invest 0 more skillpoints and get a whole new market to cater to, and want to be as good at it instantly as somebody crafting in that market for a long time.
As far as I can tell, we wont ever reach a common ground on this issue.
You want this new market for you at no extra cost, without being threatened by the old crafters in that market unless they wreck their current templates and take up MBE. Your way will also introduce SEAs to pet and additive crafting. You are trying to invade my market while keeping me from invading yours. It doesnt matter at all to me if my market is called doctor medical crafting or BE medical crafting, just as much as it doesnt matter to you if you should call me novice BE or Geneticist.
I am saying you should have an advantage in your current market, while I should keep an advantage in my current market without having to change my style of play. I also say SEAs should be kept out of the pet and additive business, seeing that most BEs lack the financial power to acquire them. I offer you to keep your market, but ask to keep mine in return at no extra skill point cost for me.
The devs say I should be able to continue doing what I do now and get a big share of your market on top of it if I spend 14 more skill points, and making you get SEAs also to be able to compete with me.
As I said several times, your way is nerfing me and I wont support it, the devs way is nerfing you and I dont like it, but I am fine with it and will support it if you dont want to settle for the middle ground.
On a side note: Have you noticed how I see you currently being nerfed and try to find a common ground to un-nerf you, while you say you dont care about me, where I come from and what my current template is or if you nerf it at all? If you are not able to give up small bits to make others comfortable, you will have a hard time getting the things you want.
If you want to craft medical items in the current system, you need to spend 68 more skill points (doc 0004) in addition to BE if you want to craft stims, or 111 (master doc) if you want to compete in the buff market. This is protecting my market from you currently.
With CU, you get the ability to invade my market at a cost of 0 skill points. Nobody can tell me stims wont be a big seller, so this is effectively a huge plus for you.
Seeing this, the devs will allow me to craft the medical items I craft now with no additional skill point cost to me by granting full experimentation at BE 0004. If a current BE wants to craft on par with me, the devs make him buy the SEAs I already bought to be a better medical crafter than a current MD with only profession innate skills. Up to this point, it sounds perfectly fair to me.
What the devs didnt see or didnt look at thouroughly enough at, though, is that the combining of medical and BE experimentation will allow me to invade your additive market at a skill point cost of 14 also. I have to spend 92 points in the current system to do the same. Furthermore, my SEAs will be working in your market now, also.
I can fully understand you being upset about this aspect: Me invading your market for 14 skill points and having 12 experimentation points in it, also buying DNA off the bazaar to craft novice level pets with 12 points as somebody already mentioned. I will support current BEs in preventing this from happening since it is not fair towards current BEs, as long as the solution to it is still fair towards me (read: still being able to use MD healing abilities and pursue former medical crafting at a net cost of 0 skill points to me - same abilities for same skill point cost).
Putting medical experimentation in the master box is _not_ fair, because you not only get a shot at my market for free, but also make me pay 43 skill points to be able to stay in that market and continue what I have been doing.
By saying people should need MBE to get all experimentation just because it is the master box and a master should be able to craft better than a tier 4 at all times, you are neglecting the fact that you get a whole new market for 0 skill points. You are trying not only to get a shot at that market, but also want to dominate it instantly.
Generally I agree that a master should have crafting advantages over a tier 4, yes. By separating medical and BE experimentation again, a BE 0004 will craft great stims. But the master will craft great pets and additives in addition to stims. Consider this as it is in doc right now: a Doc 0004 crafts great stims, but you need MD to compete in the buff market. As far as I can tell, an MBE is a better crafter than a BE 0004 if you follow my proposal, simply because the MBE has the pet and additive markets in addition to the medical market.
It would have the same effect as seperating medical and BE experimentation again, but it might be easier to get across to the devs.
Former docs could continue their business without any penalties at BE 0004, but for entering other BE markets they would need to master the profession. It would be the same as it is with stim crafting and buff crafting in Doc now - limit yourself to stims and doc 0004 is sufficient, if you want to do buffs go master. The downside of this is that the SEAs would work for the current BE markets also and BEs would still have to play the 12pt game.
Eskie wrote:
By looking at the current doc tree I would also support moving the schematics of the most looked-for additives to MBE in order to keep dabblers from accessing them.
It would have the same effect as seperating medical and BE experimentation again, but it might be easier to get across to the devs.
Former docs could continue their business without any penalties at BE 0004, but for entering other BE markets they would need to master the profession. It would be the same as it is with stim crafting and buff crafting in Doc now - limit yourself to stims and doc 0004 is sufficient, if you want to do buffs go master. The downside of this is that the SEAs would work for the current BE markets also and BEs would still have to play the 12pt game.
I doubt the points will be separated because it's all BE now. Crafting docs who move are now 0004 BE's, not docs. Can you think of one reason to separate the points except to benefit us, the crafting docs moving over? If not then I don't think they'll separate.
Of course now that the resource list is out, (holy cow), I may need to reanalyze whether or not I want to be a BE or not where crafting is concerned. I think in order to do it I'd either need to buy more resource kits, or pick up a Ranger alt...
Message Edited by TarMangani on 04-10-2005 11:07 PM
TarMangani wrote:
(...)I doubt the points will be separated because it's all BE now. Crafting docs who move are now 0004 BE's, not docs. Can you think of one reason to separate the points except to benefit us, the crafting docs moving over? If not then I don't think they'll separate.
Of course now that the resource list is out, (holy cow), I may need to reanalyze whether or not I want to be a BE or not where crafting is concerned. I think in order to do it I'd either need to buy more resource kits, or pick up a Ranger alt...
Separating the points will not benefit us, the crafting docs, but current BEs. By keeping me from entering the current BE market I dont win a thing. I only win in the current situation, which enables me to spend 14 skill points to get all relevant additive crafting capabilities at full experimentation.
Since it will be hard to convince the devs to separate them again, I also would support to move the additive schematics current BEs dont want to lose to dabblers into the master box.
On another note, I noticed your post in the voting thread.
Leaving the current TC implementation as it is for now, but already scheduling a re-distribution of experimentation points to the master box, is not a good option. You tell BE 0004 crafters that they can be BE 0004, start up their businesses, collect their resources and get themselves a name, but that you will also make them spend 43 skill points more soon without them getting anything in return. If you want to nerf, do it now when people are entitled to a free re-spec anyway.
Moving experimentation points to master remains a nerf to a certain group of people, no matter when you do it, and I stated enough reasons here why this nerf is not necessary to keep BE-dabbler-turned docs from entering current BE markets: Simply because there are at least 2 alternatives that achieve the same result with less nerfing.
Eskie wrote:
Exactly that point of view is what I dont agree upon.
If you want to craft medical items in the current system, you need to spend 68 more skill points (doc 0004) in addition to BE if you want to craft stims, or 111 (master doc) if you want to compete in the buff market. This is protecting my market from you currently.
Look again, I have MBE/MDoc. I've already spent those sp. In fact, I'll GAIN SP after the CU with the loss of the master medic requirement for Doc.
With CU, you get the ability to invade my market at a cost of 0 skill points. Nobody can tell me stims wont be a big seller, so this is effectively a huge plus for you.
I'm not, none of the BE's are, invading your market. It was thrust upon us with out asking our input. All of these changes are being done to us by SOE. A "big plus" for us? How so? Now we have so many people that wanted nothing to do with BE prior to this flocking to BE to "cash in" on the crafting.
Seeing this, the devs will allow me to craft the medical items I craft now with no additional skill point cost to me by granting full experimentation at BE 0004. If a current BE wants to craft on par with me, the devs make him buy the SEAs I already bought to be a better medical crafter than a current MD with only profession innate skills. Up to this point, it sounds perfectly fair to me.
It's not about being "fair" to Doc's, it's about a dabbler being as good a crafter as a Master. And I don't know how you "keep score" to make things "fair", but that doesn't sound "fair" to me. Would you like it if a (sorry, not sure of which tree it actually is) a Doc 4000 could buff as well as you can? I doubt it.
What the devs didnt see or didnt look at thouroughly enough at, though, is that the combining of medical and BE experimentation will allow me to invade your additive market at a skill point cost of 14 also. I have to spend 92 points in the current system to do the same. Furthermore, my SEAs will be working in your market now, also.
BE's have never had SEA's nor wanted them. That makes it a resource profession rather than an SEA crafting profession. As for you getting into my market...well, the only place you'll have an edge with your SEA's is in the slow selling, not-in-demand, high level pets. I have NEVER had spaces left in the experimentation bar when I've finished crafting an item. And that includes some really uber resources. So your SEA's won't help you there at all.
I can fully understand you being upset about this aspect: Me invading your market for 14 skill points and having 12 experimentation points in it, also buying DNA off the bazaar to craft novice level pets with 12 points as somebody already mentioned. I will support current BEs in preventing this from happening since it is not fair towards current BEs, as long as the solution to it is still fair towards me (read: still being able to use MD healing abilities and pursue former medical crafting at a net cost of 0 skill points to me - same abilities for same skill point cost).
I don't know any BE's that sell DNA. Lot of work to sell something that only another BE can use. I've never even seen any on a vendor or the bazzar....might be wrong. Pet crafting isn't as easy as it sounds. Yeah, you can follow the recipies you'll find here and many do. I've used several just to see the results. But most, if not all will be invalid after the CU.
Putting medical experimentation in the master box is _not_ fair, because you not only get a shot at my market for free, but also make me pay 43 skill points to be able to stay in that market and continue what I have been doing.
The point is IT'S NOT YOUR MARKET. It's a BE market now. Not putting experiment points in the Master box is, to use YOUR words, NOT FAIR. A dabbler should NEVER be as good as a MASTER, it's, YOUR words again, NOT FAIR.
By saying people should need MBE to get all experimentation just because it is the master box and a master should be able to craft better than a tier 4 at all times, you are neglecting the fact that you get a whole new market for 0 skill points. You are trying not only to get a shot at that market, but also want to dominate it instantly.
Sorry, for me to get into "your" market, will require me to aquire a whole new set of resources. Since the amount of things like avian meat, reactive gas, metals, minerals and other resources required by the new buff I currently have on hand is pretty close to 0, you'll have a big jump on me there. Since you'll have the same chance to respec I will, you'll have the same chance to move into the market I, and any other BE does. If you want to craft Master Level, be a MASTER, not a dabbler.
Generally I agree that a master should have crafting advantages over a tier 4, yes. By separating medical and BE experimentation again, a BE 0004 will craft great stims. But the master will craft great pets and additives in addition to stims. Consider this as it is in doc right now: a Doc 0004 crafts great stims, but you need MD to compete in the buff market. As far as I can tell, an MBE is a better crafter than a BE 0004 if you follow my proposal, simply because the MBE has the pet and additive markets in addition to the medical market.
Ok, now you say a Master should be a better crafter than a dabbler. Then you say MBE should only be better than the 0004 dabbler in the number and types of schematics. Why are you saying a MDoc should be better than MBE? Does this, your words, sound "fair" to you? Can't have it both ways. It wouldn't be "fair".
"I'm not, none of the BE's are, invading your market. It was thrust upon us with out asking our input. All of these changes are being done to us by SOE. A "big plus" for us? How so? Now we have so many people that wanted nothing to do with BE prior to this flocking to BE to "cash in" on the crafting."
If you do not want to invade the market I currently cater to, why do you even worry about me having the same experimentation skills in that market by being a 0004 dabbler? If you dont want that market, you dont even need to care to have an advantage in that market. Maybe you want BEs to be able to "cash in" in the medical market?
I made suggestions to protect your current market from future dabblers, but in fact, you do not just want your market protected, you want the current market of the dabblers. SOE is not forcing you to take that market. If you want to craft in the medical market, it is your own decision, so dont tell me they are forcing you to craft in the market that I currently craft in.
Eskie wrote:
I will just comment on one short passage you wrote, because I am tired of this discussion where apparently we will never reach a common denominator.
"I'm not, none of the BE's are, invading your market. It was thrust upon us with out asking our input. All of these changes are being done to us by SOE. A "big plus" for us? How so? Now we have so many people that wanted nothing to do with BE prior to this flocking to BE to "cash in" on the crafting."
If you do not want to invade the market I currently cater to, why do you even worry about me having the same experimentation skills in that market by being a 0004 dabbler? If you dont want that market, you dont even need to care to have an advantage in that market. Maybe you want BEs to be able to "cash in" in the medical market?
I made suggestions to protect your current market from future dabblers, but in fact, you do not just want your market protected, you want the current market of the dabblers. SOE is not forcing you to take that market. If you want to craft in the medical market, it is your own decision, so dont tell me they are forcing you to craft in the market that I currently craft in.