Bio Engineer Archive
Thread: Experimentation question
SW-Vehlin
Tue Apr 13, 2004 6:16 pm
#40
AFAIK they do have an impact, tho to be honest I'm not 100% sure.
TheIllien
Tue Apr 20, 2004 9:18 am
#41
If I don't plan on selling any of my poisons or diseases, is it reasonable to not mess with the Ease of Use experimentation?
Yalpski
Wed Apr 28, 2004 7:22 am
#45
Hey all, I just recently picked up weaponsmithing and am loving it. This may be more of a general crafting question, but since I only really experiment with weapons (other profession is Tailor), i figured I should ask here.
Does it produce better results (assuming you get greats on everything) to expirement one box at a time, 2-3 at a time, or all at once? If you have a particular way that seems to work best for you, please let me know. I seem to be getting slightly better results when I do the boxes one at a time, but ofcourse then you run the risk of a moderate success.
Thanks for your help.
Does it produce better results (assuming you get greats on everything) to expirement one box at a time, 2-3 at a time, or all at once? If you have a particular way that seems to work best for you, please let me know. I seem to be getting slightly better results when I do the boxes one at a time, but ofcourse then you run the risk of a moderate success.
Thanks for your help.
Joinky316
Wed Apr 28, 2004 7:56 am
#46
Depends on what I'm crafting, and what my experimentation skill mod is for that object. Generally the more points I have, the more experimentation I do at once. For "simple" products such as crafting tools and vehicle customization kits, I spend them all at once. For more complicated things (such as weapons and harvesters), I like to spend 2 at a time. Occasionally for such items I will experiment 1 at a time, though I really don't like to, and hardly (if ever) will I spend 3 or more points at a time. The good thing about experimenting 1 point at a time is that each experimentation will have a lower risk than if you used multiple points at once. Thebad thing is thatyour item will have a higher complexity rating than if you experimented 2 or more points at once (not that bad if you're crafting by hand, but if you're making a schematic to use in a factory then it will take longer to manufacture each item). In my eyes, you're just pressing your luck if you choose to experiment 1 point at a time because you're "rolling the dice" twice as many times.
Waou
Wed Apr 28, 2004 8:06 am
#47
But does going more than one box at a time increase the potential effect of the experimentation? Can I, for example, get a higher min/max damage on an item if I go 2 points at a time rather than 1 point at a time?
I haven't done any scientific tests or anything, but I seem to do better going one at a time.
Shmoove
Wed Apr 28, 2004 9:46 am
#48
I've heard conflicting reports on this. My gut tells me that, yes, you will end up with a marginally better product. Personally I experiment 3-4 at a time for less chances of a 'goofed' experiment overall. I think they calculate your successes 1 by 1 anyway. Meaning if I put 4 points into experimentation the game 'rolls the dice' 4 times and adds them up as 'great success, great, awesome, great' and gives me the final outcome. The down side is that 'great, great, moderate, great' will still come out looking like great anyway.
This is all just my theory. It is by no means gospel. Anyone wiser than I care to explain it otherwise?
AldaronTavish
Wed Apr 28, 2004 9:50 am
#49
I got a very weird outcome when experimenting all points at once. I think it was a proj pistol barrel. When I did all exp at once the min dam was higher than max, one at a time and not only was the amount higher but min/max matched.
Traveler2112
Wed Apr 28, 2004 1:40 pm
#50
AldaronTavish: Unfortunately, you can't always depend on what the experimentation result message says for how every box actually experimented (if you're experimenting more than one at once). While it's usually right, there may be one rogue moderate or worse mucking things up in there somewhere. That's probably the case with your projectile barrels since I've seen some weird stats come from moderates.
What it comes down to is: It doesn't matter how many boxes you experiment at once. With the exception of a single day, the resources you use hard cap the final result (barring the VERY rare critical success). There are some tricks you can use, however, to get more 'bang' per point.
First, find the max percentage for the line you want to fill out (usually damage for weapons). Next, subtract the base your materials start you at. Lastly, divide this number by the number of points you get from a 'great success' (which is 7%). The remainder is how many boxes you need to experiment at a time and get an 'amazing success' (which has an 8% percentage jump instead of just 7%) so you don't waste points finishing out a line.
For example (very simplified):
You test out a weapon, and the max you can experiment to is 76%. With a base of 18%, you get 76 - 18 = 58 points that you have to experiment to max the line. It takes 8 great successes (at 7 points each) to reach 56 points, but then you'd still have 2 points left over which would require another point. To get around this, use 'amazings' to your advantage. Experiment 2 (probably 3 to be safe, due to the fraction after the 76% you don't see) boxes at a time and try to get an 'amazing' to max the line with just 8 points, leaving you 2 left over instead of just 1. This can waste a lot of resources, but will make 10 points go a whole lot further.
Another thing worth mentioning is that using points on HAM and range just don't really do you much good on the final weapon itself. Since damage and speed are tied into the same line, not maxing it out is almost never a good idea (unless it's a special order). Even if that wasn't the case, the amount of change per point in anything but damage/speed is VERY small. Thus, it's best to tweak non-damage/speed types of things in the subcomponents for the best effect (especially with melee weapons).
Hope that helps.
What it comes down to is: It doesn't matter how many boxes you experiment at once. With the exception of a single day, the resources you use hard cap the final result (barring the VERY rare critical success). There are some tricks you can use, however, to get more 'bang' per point.
First, find the max percentage for the line you want to fill out (usually damage for weapons). Next, subtract the base your materials start you at. Lastly, divide this number by the number of points you get from a 'great success' (which is 7%). The remainder is how many boxes you need to experiment at a time and get an 'amazing success' (which has an 8% percentage jump instead of just 7%) so you don't waste points finishing out a line.
For example (very simplified):
You test out a weapon, and the max you can experiment to is 76%. With a base of 18%, you get 76 - 18 = 58 points that you have to experiment to max the line. It takes 8 great successes (at 7 points each) to reach 56 points, but then you'd still have 2 points left over which would require another point. To get around this, use 'amazings' to your advantage. Experiment 2 (probably 3 to be safe, due to the fraction after the 76% you don't see) boxes at a time and try to get an 'amazing' to max the line with just 8 points, leaving you 2 left over instead of just 1. This can waste a lot of resources, but will make 10 points go a whole lot further.
Another thing worth mentioning is that using points on HAM and range just don't really do you much good on the final weapon itself. Since damage and speed are tied into the same line, not maxing it out is almost never a good idea (unless it's a special order). Even if that wasn't the case, the amount of change per point in anything but damage/speed is VERY small. Thus, it's best to tweak non-damage/speed types of things in the subcomponents for the best effect (especially with melee weapons).
Hope that helps.
d0qtrX
Thu Apr 29, 2004 12:32 am
#51
Usually, unless I do 2 points I get an avalanche of crap experimentation. Sometimes I'm forced to go 1 at a time.
d0qtrX
Thu Apr 29, 2004 9:17 am
#52
Traveler2112 wrote:
AldaronTavish: Unfortunately, you can't always depend on what the experimentation result message says for how every box actually experimented (if you're experimenting more than one at once). While it's usually right, there may be one rogue moderate or worse mucking things up in there somewhere. That's probably the case with your projectile barrels since I've seen some weird stats come from moderates.
What it comes down to is: It doesn't matter how many boxes you experiment at once. With the exception of a single day, the resources you use hard cap the final result (barring the VERY rare critical success). There are some tricks you can use, however, to get more 'bang' per point.
First, find the max percentage for the line you want to fill out (usually damage for weapons). Next, subtract the base your materials start you at. Lastly, divide this number by the number of points you get from a 'great success' (which is 7%). The remainder is how many boxes you need to experiment at a time and get an 'amazing success' (which has an 8% percentage jump instead of just 7%) so you don't waste points finishing out a line.
For example (very simplified):
You test out a weapon, and the max you can experiment to is 76%. With a base of 18%, you get 76 - 18 = 58 points that you have to experiment to max the line. It takes 8 great successes (at 7 points each) to reach 56 points, but then you'd still have 2 points left over which would require another point. To get around this, use 'amazings' to your advantage. Experiment 2 (probably 3 to be safe, due to the fraction after the 76% you don't see) boxes at a time and try to get an 'amazing' to max the line with just 8 points, leaving you 2 left over instead of just 1. This can waste a lot of resources, but will make 10 points go a whole lot further.
Another thing worth mentioning is that using points on HAM and range just don't really do you much good on the final weapon itself. Since damage and speed are tied into the same line, not maxing it out is almost never a good idea (unless it's a special order). Even if that wasn't the case, the amount of change per point in anything but damage/speed is VERY small. Thus, it's best to tweak non-damage/speed types of things in the subcomponents for the best effect (especially with melee weapons).
Hope that helps.
Hey that makes sense. I'll try it. I'm at a point now where if I get all greats I want to make a damn schematic because I am plagued by moderates. I rarely ever get an Amazing, but I'll try your method.